Democracy at 4 AM: What unprecedented protest means for Taiwan | Hacker News Reader

Democracy at 4 AM: What unprecedented protest means for Taiwan

4am.tw

110 pointsdryman31 comments

I'm an software engineer from Taiwan. Taiwan is one of the countries in east asia that has democracy, and we're super proud of it. However, the current government tried to pass some laws that has deep impact to our economy secretly. They tried to pass the law in congress restroom, and passed it in JUST 30 SECONDS.

This is something that Taiwan people can't stand for. We need to fight for our democracy procedure. A law like this cannot be treated this way. The students in taiwan occupied the congress hall (Legislative Yuan). Following up we have so many volunteer from all professions joined us. The doctors started to help people who were injured; the lawyers defended for people who were caught by police; hackers who like you and me helped the wifi and real time streaming to be stable and robust, and also built this website for more visibility from the world.

It's 4am at Taiwan. WE NEED YOUR ATTENTION. WE NEED YOU to spread what happened in taiwan to the world. Take a look on those photos and videos. It's dark in Taiwan, but we believe the dawn will come.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OIAe3DREUhI http://instagram.com/p/l-Duu5By7B/

Some recorded video of how police beat people

that's a pretty standard riot control tactic, executed quite well. I don't agree with the beating tho :(

The protesters are made up of three overlapping groups:

1. Those who resent the way the ruling party reneged on its promise of legislative review and forced a this trade services pact with China through.

2. Those who have economic concerns, e.g. they worry that Taiwanese small and medium sized businesses would be acquired by Chinese capital thus massively raising the barrier to entry in some industries. Another worry is that Taiwan may face a massive brain drain to China.

3. Those who have national security concerns because the trade services pact opens for e.g. some parts of the telecommunications and publishing industries. China claims Taiwan as a renegade province and has said it'd use force to unify the motherland if necessary.

So far this is still a Taiwanese domestic issue though with the U.S. and China watching closely. One WSJ report goes[1]:

"U.S. officials might consider all this as they prepare to resume bilateral trade talks with Taiwan next week. Advancing bilateral trade—and encouraging eventual Taiwanese accession to the Trans-Pacific Partnership—would help quiet nerves on all sides of Taiwanese politics. The U.S. has largely ignored Taiwan in recent years, but Taipei's current crisis highlights the extent to which trouble still lurks in that corner of Asia."

[1]:http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB1000142405270230441840...

My girlfriend (who is Taiwanese) and happened to be visiting home during this time, went to observe the protests during the first week. From what she told me (going off memory here), there's many people going to the protests for 2 hours just so they can mark on their Facebook wall that they were there... and many others who don't actually care nor understand, but just follow the vocal protestors. However, there are indeed those who care, as marked by your 3 different groups.

P.s. she also said the police were not a problem for her. The ones they were dealing with were generally trouble-makers and basically out of control or whatever.

Oh well, I hope Taiwan can sort this out, it's a great country :)

I would be scared of annexation if I were a Taiwanese citizen. Heavy-handed states (including China) have not been kind to dissenters.

Taiwan may get "Putin-ed", step 1 cause citizen outrage, step 2 citizens revolt against their corrupt government step 3 China moves in to help stabilize the country without a government.

There is another scenario: 1 cause citizen outrage, step 2 government successfully ignores outrage/beats protesters/tells lies to general public step 3 you're Putin-ed still.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iV8JDbtXZm4

We video taped and written a song for the occupation. Even compare to other protest in countries, we are so proud our people in protest is peaceful and well organized. People who have profession (like doctors, hackers, lawyers) setup stations to help people. Other volunteers got organized and pick up trash and send out food.

Still, we are terrified. The government sent out police to beat up people who don't have weapons. Even though we have videos to prove it, the government is still denying it.

This is the worst moment for us, but also the best. We see hope from people, and we're looking for your help.

Keep posting video. They can't deny it if it's all over youtube. Also, post links to video on newspapers sites if they have a comment section

Background: On March 17, the ruling political party in Taiwan passed a wide ranging services trade pact[1] with China through extraordinary legislative maneuvers. On March 18, a few hundred protesters, mostly college aged, stormed and successfully occupied the legislature. Once the news got out, a larger crowd of tens of thousands surrounded the legislature building.

[1]: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross-Strait_Service_Trade_Agre...

The web site does not do a good job of explaining what their concerns are with the agreement.

But the pie chart shown (setting aside sample bias...) is stunning: it says that only 1.6% of people asked said they support the agreement.

This in a country where people believe in democracy as a strong part of their national identity, and as the main thing that makes them different from mainland China.

Thanks for advice. We have a lot discussions of the agreement, but written in Chinese. We'll translate those to English and expose the context to the world.

Another "colorful" part is that there have been gangsters showing up at the protest site, threatening the largely college aged protesters. This coincides with the return to Taiwan of a mob boss with close Chinese ties:

http://thediplomat.com/2014/02/the-return-of-gangster-politi...

He's been spotted at the scene (the last photo): http://www.appledaily.com.tw/realtimenews/article/new/201403...

Democracy in Taiwan is crucial.

The President of Taiwan is nicknamed President 9% (his approval rating). 70% of Taiwan people favor the students, which is why they have had difficulty removing them from the Congress (Yuan).

A huge protest is planned tomorrow, March 30th.

Here's some Twitter hashtags to follow events:

#Taiwan

#TaiwanOccupy (they are occupying the congress)

#反服贸

The trade agreement between China and Taiwan that's currently on the table contains two parts, one concerns publishing and the other has to do with ISP. Taiwanese in general, like to preserve their own identity, culture, language, etc. The agreement MAY alter the market dynamics, for example, squeezing out Taiwan's native publishers. The biggest concern is the control of digital information. No need to explain on this. Overall, Taiwanese are just afraid of what-ifs. Personally, I'm OK with publishing but not the digital information pact.

Within a few hours, there will be a protest event in Taipei. Accroding to the facebook event page, more than 60000 people have signed up to join the event. We believe more people would standing out on Sunday to ask government to legislate supervision regulations on Cross-Strait Trade. We advocate transparency of the trade agreement including review, signing and execute process. https://www.facebook.com/events/1471107093105919/

I've been to the protest. One good reporting source is https://twitter.com/JMichaelCole1

I'm a website developer from Taiwan. There'll be a protest movement 9 hours later. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iV8JDbtXZm4 This song is made during these days, might explain what happened these days.