When Airlines Screw Up Your Flight, AirHelp (YC W14) Gets You Paid | Hacker News Reader

When Airlines Screw Up Your Flight, AirHelp (YC W14) Gets You Paid

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176 pointsnicomichaelsen63 comments

We just announced our YC participation and we are now officially live in the US.

I just tried to use the service to get some money from a cancelled flight from Houston to Los Angeles that I had in January.

Here's some feedback/questions about the service:

- When I filled in the flight, I selected "cancelled". When I got to the final claim filing step, it asked how many hours my arrival was delayed, with the highest tier being 4+ hours. This was confusing to me and made me double check that I selected cancelled and not delayed. If the text said here "how much did your flight cancellation delay your arrival?" or something similar, the process would have been much clearer.

- After completing the claim filing, I got a message that I wasn't eligible for compensation. The first two sentences talked about why I wasn't eligible due to not being on a flight between EU countries. The end of the paragraph said that reimbursements aren't given for flights cancelled due to weather, safety, strikes, etc. I would be far less confused by the service if a simple answer was given here instead (don't mention the EU stuff if you're trying to reimburse Americans, and hopefully just put a single statement like "Sorry, you are not eligible for reimbursement because your flight was cancelled due to weather".

Another question related not so much to the website but just the reimbursement service. For the particular IAH->LAX trip I was hoping to get reimbursed for, I had a Saturday flight delayed then cancelled, then got reschedule to Sunday morning, which got cancelled, and then got rescheduled to Monday (which actually went through). Could I attempt to get reimbursed for both cancellations or just one?

The only circumstance you're eligible for compensation on a domestic, US flight is if you are bumped off the plane due to over booking.

0 to 1 hour arrival delay = No compensation.

1 to 4 hour arrival delay = 200% of one-way fare (but no more than $650).

Over 4 hours arrival delay = 400% of one-way fare (but no more than $1,300).

Do you have a source for this?

http://airconsumer.ost.dot.gov/rules/part%20250.pdf

14 CFR 250.

This is a great idea. I once had a (US domestic) flight cancelled at the last minute because there weren't enough people on it, and all the airline offered to do was put me in a hotel overnight and pay for my meals while I waited for another flight that was about 20 hours later.

In the end I managed to weasel my way onto a different flight to a nearby airport, and I still have no idea what I should have asked for if I had actually had to wait that long. I was pretty outraged that they didn't offer me any other compensation for all the time I would have lost because they chose to cancel an underbooked flight.

My wife and I had our flight from Europe to Japan cancelled a few summers ago. The put us another flight via Bangkok. Added 8 hours to our journey. That became a really long trip.

Eventually we got the EU paperwork and filled it in meticulously. And to our surprise €600 each arrived within a few weeks.

As soon as the use of these type of apps become the norm the flight prices will probably go up a bit to compensate. Or maybe the airlines will be less cavalier about cancelling flights.

> As soon as the use of these type of apps become the norm the flight prices will probably go up a bit to compensate. Or maybe the airlines will be less cavalier about cancelling flights.

Presumably both these things will happen, the former as a consequence of the latter.

According to the voucher Delta gave me, things are different now. Only technical difficulties are exempt. Other reasons require them to give you a multiple of the ticket cost back.

The power of attorney part is a little scary. I understand they really have to handle the whole process to ensure they get paid at the end, but I surely don't take giving someone power of attorney lightly.

It will most definitely be a limited power of attorney for this event only. They should have called it "Representative Appointment Form" like other industries do.

The latter is technically a limited power of attorney too.

Edit: The following is from their EU POA form:

   This power of attorney shall become effective on the day of signature and shall expire if revoked by me/us in writing. This document shall be construed and interpreted as a general power of attorney and my/our Agent shall have full authority to act on my/our behalf in relation to my/our claims resulting from disruptions of flights pursuant to EU Regulation 261/04. I/we furthermore grant my/our Agent the authority to:

   *(1) undertake all appropriate legal – judicial and extrajudicial – measures appropriate to collect my/our claim(s) from the airline until the claim is fully settled;*

   *(2) collect and receive payments on my/our behalf.*

Could a lawyer express an informed opinion about that?

My thoughts as well. Can POA be limited to a specific area or case (e.g. just for flight reimbursement)?

"A 'specific' power of attorney imposes limits upon the named representative, and may restrict the scope of that person's powers to a single type of conduct or a single transaction."

http://www.expertlaw.com/library/estate_planning/power_of_at...

From getairhelp.com:

> The Power Of Attorney - POA for short - authorises AirHelp to undertake all appropriate legal (judicial and extrajudicial) measures to collect the compensation from the airline on your behalf.

It's a bit weird the article mentions it in the general case if AirHelp is only asking for it in regards to that specific area.

Neat.

While perhaps impossible, I'd also love an app that would overall just help me get back ontrack for flights and rebooked somehow.

I realize I can go to the gate agent (who invariably now has 50 other people in line, and are working with computers that seem to require 1000 key presses to even look up the most basic thing) or call the airline (similar situation)- but it seems that the best results only happen for you if they aren't super busy and like you.

Oftentimes I've found that there is some 'problem solving' that can occur to get you back on track.

For example: I missed my flight to BOS to AUS for SXSW one year. Initially it was a 'the next available flight is in a week' situation, which clearly wasn't going to work for me. We went through some problem solving however and found a solution that totally worked. They booked me on a flight instead to DFW or SAT (can't remember which), with a layover in CLT. I went on Twitter and found a friend driving to SXSW who was going to pick me up then and take me there from the alternate nearby city. They also put me on standby for a flight from CLT to AUS. The standby totally worked out, and I got to Austin only an hour later than originally anticipated.

However, if the person at the gate/ticketing doesn't feel like helping you then frequently you're just kinda screwed. I've had dozens of situations like this where I was able to convince them to try something 'different' with me and it worked out well.

If an App helped me automatically rebook and find my options that I'd otherwise have to go beg a customer service agent for... that would be awesome. If then I'm on a connecting flight that something is going to mess up- I could probably have my plans made by the time I'm off the first plane.

I had a BA flight out of LCY cancelled due to "atmospheric conditions" (that's "fog as thick as pea-soup" to you and me) and had resigned myself to the long line and slow computer scenario described, when on of quite a few agents equipped with an iPad walked up, got my name, and told me my options. Her app was fast and easy to navigate (if not exactly a thing of beauty) and I was rebooked and in a taxi to LGW inside of a couple of minutes.

Very impressive.

That sounds awesome, but I'm a little skeptical. The app would have run a huge optimization problem over your schedule and preferences (how would it know that you had a friend that could drive you?) and the airline reservation systems (which don't exactly have a well documented API, even internally).

For now, at least, this sounds like a problem where human involvement is really useful.

Cranky Concierge, as someone mentioned below, is one great option.

Another is paying the ~$50 for lounge access for the day, to talk to the reservations agent at the desk inside the lounge. They're usually much more experienced, much more likely to spend the time to do creative routings, and haven't just had to deal with possibly several hundred angry passengers. In one case with United, I stepped out of line to speak to the gate agent after my flight was delayed several hours and paid to go in the lounge. I wound up getting the last confirmed seat on the next flight, whereas the person just in front of me in line had to go on the standby list (which she didn't clear). That $50 was _well_ worth it.

It's not an app but I've heard good things about http://crankyconcierge.com

I've never had cause to hire them myself though.

I used them for an award flight that got severely messed up.

I was pretty impressed with the service.

As many others have mentioned trying to figure out connections yourself can help a lot. United wanted me to wait overnight in Dulles or come back 24 hours later for a flight to Seattle. I figured out connections for myself and only lost about 4 hours in stead of 17-24 hours. It helps when you have no checked bags.

> While perhaps impossible, I'd also love an app that would overall just help me get back ontrack for flights and rebooked somehow.

I forse a day when Google Now or Siri detects your flight delay and presents you with rebooking options via a push alert.

This is functionality offered by tripit.com in their paid version.

I'm a huge fan of tripit to parse my emails, and add all my travel details to my google calendar for me, but I happen to have never missed a flight and needed their service's help.

When airlines screw up such as when you miss a connecting flight due to an airline-caused delay, walking to the ticket counter or agent desk gets you paid. If you have a cell phone, a phone call to the airline gets you paid.

If you don't want to bother with walking to the airline reps in the airport or you are not comfortable interacting with people, AirHelp may be useful.

Not always. We had a direct flight from Orlando to Seattle that was waiting on the plane to come from SEA (I assume they just run the plane back and forth between the two cities, based on the schedule). Except SEA had a little sprinkling of snow, so the plane never left. I woke up at 4:00 a.m., looked at my phone, and flight was cancelled. No "we rebooked you", no nothing. So I called. Their offer was to put us on a plane 36 hours later. That's not gonna work, we've got to go to work and get the dogs out of dog jail. Tampa's closer, can you stick on a flight out of there? Nope, not even an option. An hour on the phone got me nowhere.

My wife tried later, and after another hour of "no, that's not acceptable" finally got a later flight with a five hour stop in Washington, DC. Alaska Air at least gave us exit rows for the ride home. Granted, this wasn't a "missed a connecting flight" scenario, but the airline's lack of helpfulness does not give me confidence they would act differently. Man, for the good old days when you'd call or walk to the desk, hear "just a moment, sir <clickety, clickety, clickety> there, I have you on the next flight. I put you in first class for the trouble."

On a side note, I find it ironic that the only airline in SEA that was cancelling flights due to snow was the one with the word "Alaska" in its name.

I would use this if I didn't get any initial help - sometimes you don't. Or sometimes you get put up in a fancy hotel in Copenhagen without asking because there is a snowstorm and the pilot couldn't get there. But maybe I could have gotten cash instead?

Not in this day and age. United stranded me in Houston last year after leaving late from LA... said it was because of the weather and politely told me to "shove off." Well guess what, it was another perfect day in LA that day. If work hadn't paid for everything I'd be very angry. I'm still angry but busy and less motivated to fight.

A company that could do the fighting for me could be helpful. Even if they didn't produce a profit for me, I'd consider using it out of principle.

Weather upstream from your flight can still be responsible. If the aircraft your flight is going to use gets delayed due to weather earlier in the day, that's a weather delay, even if you had clear skies at your departure.

Airlines aren't responsible for weather delays, full stop.

> Airlines aren't responsible for weather delays, full stop.

Yes, exactly.

"Airline-caused" means things like:

- flight crew delays/unavailable

- mechanical issues

- overbooking

Not even. If air crew is unavailable because a previous flight ran long due to headwinds and they are out of allowable flying hours for the day, week, or month? That's "weather-related" and you get nothing.

I agree, I could have been clearer by repeating the exclusion for weather delays on one or more line items. I'm sure there are even borderline cases where a denial by the airline might be questionable and your only course of action would be to repeatedly and/or strongly state your case, escalate the matter up the chain-of-command, call/file your case with the government (e.g., DOT ACPD), file a request for arbitration (i.e., if your ticket requires), file a small claims suit, etc.

Nope, we sat ready at the gate for a half hour past departure time. Clear skies in Houston as well.

I am intrigued and tried to submit a claim for a recent domestic (USA) flight. However, the app update for US flights does not appear to have taken effect because I was denied for not being eligible under EU law:

http://i.imgur.com/sgDGyZy.png

Really curious to hear what their success rate is with Ryanair, as they seem to be as consumer unfriendly as possible. (Though I think they have started to change their priorities recently)

So basically this app is a simplified version of this? http://airconsumer.ost.dot.gov/publications/flyrights.htm#ov... If you get bumped involuntarily due to overbooking you are due compensation. Else you're SOL.

We started this company in order to help bridge the gap between people and legislation. We asked ourselves, how it is possible that there is a defined set of rules and still it seems like the process of actually enforcing them is quite cumbersome. Today only very few passengers who are entitled to compensation actually claim it. The reason must be that they do not know it exists and/or they feel it is a huge mountain to climb. We want to make it easy and transparent for all parties involved in the claims process. Pursuing your legally given rights should never be a burden.

Just as a general PSA (without claiming to be complete):

(Generally, none of these apply if the airline can claim extraordinary circumstances such as weather)

- Flights Originating/Transiting/Ending in the EU:

1. You are entitled to cash compensation for sufficiently long delays (2-4 hours depending on flight duration) 2. You are entitled to cash compensation (for the inconvenience) and reroute (whenever you want) for a cancellation or cash compensation (for the inconvenience) and a ticket refund

If delay is long enough, you are entitled to meals and refreshments, if over-night, to accomodation.

- Flights in the US

AFAIK, you pretty much are only entitled to something if you get denied boarding on an overbooked flight.

However, it's always best to just walk up to an airline agent, putting a smile on your face and explaining the situation. They have nothing against you and only help, but you greatly reduce their inclination to do so by making it their personal fault.

> you greatly reduce their inclination to do so by making it their personal fault.

AirHelp should really include Hans Rosling’s video on how blaming yourself really improves service. I swear, I remember him explaining that in one of his speeches (he usually talks about developing countries). I can’t find it back, but he is perfect at it.

Thank you for taking the time out of your day to provide this comment. You are absolutely right, however currently only about 0.06% of entitled passengers are getting what they are entitled to. Most people will end up getting a rejection, we know because we where "those" people. That was the reason why we started AirHelp.

What are the statistics on the number of canceled or delayed flights that the average flier has in a year that would qualify for reimbursement?

I used to have 40 round trip flights a year not so long ago, and I'd say that there was probably only one or two flights that were canceled during that duration of time. Occasionally I'd volunteer to get off a flight to grab a voucher for reimbursement, but most of the time I only got a hotel or other small voucher for a flight cancellation.

I understand that Europe provides more compensation for technical problems, but are flight cancellations really that common of an occurrence for non-frequent fliers?

my parents had a 3+ hour flight delay/re-routing in 3 consecutive years coming back in the same holiday period - not frequent fliers, rather frequently delayed

Just curious: in the US, if you were denied boarding, is the airline obligated to compensate you in the form of cash? Or are they allowed to get away with giving you a voucher for the equivalent amount ("store credit")?

If it's involuntary, you are owed cash, unless you're denied for weight/balance reasons in which case nothing is due, or you're rebooked on a flight within the hour. If it's voluntary, everything is at the airline's discretion.

United's official rules: http://flyerguide.com/index.php/S*UAL/DENIED-IDB

The core of the problem here, is that when you accept the voucher or miles, then you waive your right to any further compensation. This is due to the fact that you enter into a new agreement with the airline. So think twice before you accept that $50 voucher next time. You could be entitled up to $1300

This sounds like an exact clone of the German company flightright, which has been around for several years now. http://www.flightright.de/

Flying with US Airways this past week; 8 flights in 4 days, 5/8 flights were delayed, causing missed connections, etc.

How I wish AirHelp was available in the US :(

We are actually available in the US, the problem is that the airlines are only obligated to compensate you if you're bumped when flying on domestic US flights.

Feedback:

The airport search fields should recognize airport codes. If I type in "bru", Brussels airport should be the first, not the third in the list. If I do not choose from the suggestion box, but tab into the next field, it should fill the field with the correct selection.

Thanks for the feedback, really good point. Actually some of our batch mates (algolia) from the current YC batch should actually be able to provide this.

Sure, happy to help!

What a great idea ! so easy to use ! With laws, general conditions, etc... becoming more and more long and complex (even for educated people) I can see this kind of concept taking off in many other fields. cannot wait !

Thanks for the kind words, that was actually one of the reasons we started AirHelp.

The form should know that travel between MDW and DTW is not eligible before I enter in all my info. Kinda infuriating.

Thanks for this feedback, that's really helpful to us.

Almost makes me want to fly United again ... almost.

Another startup serving the needs of people who demand to be served.

You are of course referring to people who paid for a service which was later denied.

We can sympathize with the frustration many people are experiencing while traveling via airports. If we can assist them, travel with a little less stress, and with all their rights intact, than mission accomplished

They shouldn't need to demand it.

Good luck making a profit off the needs of people who don't want to be served.

So concatenate("Air",$SAASfeaturename) is the new hip naming convention? I'll update the lexicon.

Or because its specifically designed for the air travel marketplace?

Should have been called AirJoy.

That's very funny.

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