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Comment by zenbowman | Hacker News Reader

This picture sums up my thoughts perfectly:

http://anticache.img0.joyreactor.com/pics/post/comics-before...

Anyone who has looked into causes of stress cannot avoid the fact that a lack of PHYSICAL activity, a lack of PHYSICAL presence, and a lack of PHYSICAL stimulation is a major, if not the major factor.

Trying to get the average person today to meditate on a computer screen is like trying to get your average desk jockey to do an iron cross - it will not happen without years of PHYSICAL preparation.

This violates the golden rule:

"Computers to make people happy, not people to make computers happy" - GJS

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It saddens me such a cynical response made it to the top. I will use this app. Some days I walk to a local park to meditate. Some days I go to the meditation class we have at work. However, some days I plan to use this app, even if for just the 2 minute meditation. In my experience, in regards to stress prevention even 2 minutes of meditation is better than none.

This response isn't that cynical, it's pretty accurate. I've been using Calm for about 6 months now and while it's been very nice and beneficial for my use cases, I truly believe meditation is a solely physical experience that will ONLY be hindered by the introduction of technology.

How is this cynical?

It is rather cyinical to offer such a service.

Meditation like most things in life takes deliberate practise, effort and can be dull, hard and boring at times.

This is not meditation but distraction. If you want to medidate, first, don't do it alone. Do it with other people. Go to your next zen dojo, or Yoga school or whatever is available in your area. And then sit together with the people in the dojo.

Who are you to dictate to others what is or is not meditation? Who are you to dictate anything, to anyone?

If the way of the parent comment is not the way, what is a way?

I for one am looking forward to migrating to a lotus position desk from my standing treadmill one.

This site is literally for voicing your own opinion. If it wasn't valid it wouldn't be near the top. Have a decent counter point because arguing by aggression isn't arguing.

Popularity has no bearing on validity, that's a common logical fallacy.

Correlation is not causation, but given people put their trousers on successfully, cross the street and go to work it's likely that they tend on aggregate to have a view of the world that matches reality. You can't use popularity of a view to ensure it's valid, but I don't think it should have zero sway, either. Or, to put it more precisely, I bet it's more likely that something the vast majority of people believe is true, is actually true.

Note: this does not mean I'm saying God/the tooth fairy/the loch ness monster/santa are real. It means there are more true things people believe than false.

Santa is real, FYI.

He's not dictating anything, he's merely explaining how meditation actually works. No one if forcing you to do it properly if you prefer doing it wrong.

> This is not meditation but distraction. If you want to medidate, first, don't do it alone.`

To me this is a practical oxymoron. At least when I was first learning to meditate, I had to be completely alone in a quiet place. Being surrounded by others sounds really unnecessary and distracting.

Shared focus, accountability, and retrospect. Also, a potential group of friends who won't judge you for doing nothing but sitting on a pillow for a half an hour (or more) every day.

There are pros and cons to everything.

I've been part of a few meditation groups. You really have to find the right mix or it doesn't work well.

I personally prefer alone-time meditation to introspect and sift through my inner concerns and arrange my emotional situation.

However you choose to do it, meditation is a wonderful way to unwind and an app with nice calming music and imagery is one way to disconnect from the bedlam.

(said while typing on hacker news with the calm site on the other screen)

If you haven't tried sitting with a group, I highly suggest it. I find it much easier to focus, and there is more accountability so you can't get pulled away inside your own thoughts, then suddenly open your eyes and say, "I've got too much to do!" No, it's easier to refocus and sit until the end.

Also, I find guided meditation groups really nice. I'm a beginner, so it's great to have someone helping me along.

I have to echo the siblings on this one. I don't think there's one prescribed route to meditation, especially since, as I'm sure you know, there are tons and tons of different meditation techniques and lineages.

I personally preferred meditating alone starting off, and really still do. There are some retreats that I wouldn't mind taking part in, but ultimately, meditation is a personal and solitary experience for me.

I think it's good to have a range of comments, cynical and positive. This one raised good points and is articulated well. Personally I think the app is great, but I agree on a lot of what the OP said.

I see that comment as a voicing of my anger at seeing the direction in which we are heading. I'm not cynical about technology, I'm upset about our becoming slaves to it and losing our humanity to it instead of using it for connection and rediscovering and enhancing ourselves.

BTW I feel very similarly about many other meditation services offered, even in the outside (non-tech) world. Far too many gurus who purport to serve up enlightenment on a plate for a few bucks. True teachers are few and far between.

OTOH, I am spending more and more of my free time at the local hackerspace. Talking to people and combining computer with real world stuff. Also, manual work.

I have the impression that there has been/there is a society-wide phase transition, recently. More and more people seem to realize now that being in front of the net all day isn't really fulfilling, either.

cynical is the name of the game here.

This post made me think about how cynical my commentaries on the cynicism of hn probably sound, which was... weird.

Sounds like a zen moment. Let's meditate on that. :-)

This is an infinite loop!

"zen" bowman vs "cs" meder. coincidence?

>Anyone who has looked into causes of stress cannot avoid the fact that a lack of PHYSICAL activity, a lack of PHYSICAL presence, and a lack of PHYSICAL stimulation is a major, if not the major factor.

Could you provide peer-reviewed research supporting this statement? Stress is a well-studied process and if what you say is true you should have no problem finding sources.

Also, could you provide a scientific definition for "physical presence"?

Let me help you out: http://bit.ly/N5TntW

I'm not the one making claims. It's not my responsibility to validate anything. Even if I tried to, it's possible I'd miss the original sources that another person used to make an inference, and I'll lose the opportunity to learn. Worse, I could find bad sources, and learn the wrong thing.

But thanks for taking the time to obfuscate a lmgtfy link. It's clear you put time, effort, and love into this comment. Thanks, Quinn. Happy hacking!

Physical stimulation probably happens more often in front of the computer these days too...

Instead of theorizing, how about just using it and seeing if it actually helps ?

I have been a regular user every morning for the past 3-4 months. It is easy to follow and gives a great sense of calm - almost time expanding in a way. Helps productivity too.

Lack of physical activity CAN contribute to stress besides numerous other factors. It's definitely not the major factor for everyone. However, as funny as that cartoon strip might be, there's nothing wrong in using a stress producer (aka your computer) to counter stress. I'm not advocating this as a substitute for physical activity. Just saying that in a busy day, this site seems like a nice aid to calm your mind.

I've used a computer program in order to aid me in meditating. That was a program dealing with sound, not with anything visual.

You're right that computers for computers sake is missing the point. But so is dismissing computers because they're computers, or because they're used in unconventional ways.

I can at least say that using that program made it a lot easier to get into a more meditative state. And it was not supposed to be a perpetual training wheel, more like a temporary one, until you could get the same desired effect without any sound-aid.

"once he reaches his destination at the far shore, does the wise man pick up the ferryboat and carry it with him?"

- http://www.angelfire.com/indie/anna_jones1/ferryboat.html

(linking to an angelfire page on hn is probably my favorite thing of the day)

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