A Café for the Freelance Nation | Hacker News Reader

A Café for the Freelance Nation

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29 pointsRougeFemme31 comments

My take on this: While it's an interesting concept, and I'd love to see discussion on it, $3.50 an hour is a bit higher than what I'd be willing to pay for using wifi in most American cities, unless the coffee is really good and comes with the best damn selection of creamers, sweeteners, and frills around.

Now from what I understand, in some cities it actually is tough to find wifi because the inflated property costs have birthed a restaurant and cafe culture that clings to snap turnover to stay afloat. In these cities (which are in the minority, but perhaps are home to the majority of tech workers), I could see this kind of cafe succeeding wildly.

In addition to the restaurant/cafe culture, the quality and quantity of space provided by the local library systems is another factor. I sometimes work in coffee shops in Copenhagen when I don't want to be in the office, but compared to other places I've lived, I find myself more often working in libraries. They have free wifi, don't care how long you stay, have power plugs, have access to various paywalled databases, and some even have cafes if you want to grab a coffee. And there are a lot of them, something like 20 libraries within 5 km of my house (counting municipal and university ones), so they don't really fill up, with the possible exception of exam weeks.

This is what I've been eyeing for my next move if it ends up being remote. My only concern is a space where I can eat and conference call without disturbing other patrons or going outside.

Around here most of them have a place where you can eat, but conference-calling is more of a problem. Some libraries do have private "study rooms" or "meeting rooms" you can book (intended for students working on group projects and the like, who need a more enclosed space where making noise is ok), but I haven't looked into it.

Someone on HN tipped me off to the Workshop in SF recently, which has a similar pay-per-minute (well, hour) model. Coffee's still expensive, but you don't have to buy it, and there's concierge service with food etc. It's been a great spot to fill a multi-hour gap without guilt.

The biggest "bummer" to laptop camping is the limited food selection.

I make sure to pay my "rent" when I'm in a cafe (buy stuff, tip well). But it'd be a lot easier if there was stuff more compatible with my cave man diet, selections beyond treats and panini. I get that fresh fiber is highly perishable, so is mostly impractical. Maybe soups. Or house salads (bulk, pre made) like the grocery store deli.

Who ever figures out the food options will win my heart and money.

I agree, Workshop is great! No guilt, and they've got the place set up for work, no worrying about bad wifi or finding outlets. I go to other cafés for hanging out, and I go there when I need to focus on work.

The nice thing about these sort of places is that if you're a freelancer, I think you can make a decent case for expensing them (not counting the coffee).

I can't understand the appeal working in coffee shops has to some freelancers. I can see how an hour, maybe two could break up the day but when you have free coffee and excellent wifi you're already paying for at home why would you pay to work in a crowded, noisy public space?

I understand that you don't personally find this appealing, but I suggest that you are likely in a minority:

1. Background noise is said to be good for creative-type work: http://www.prevention.com/health/brain-games/how-noise-makes...

2. Breaking up your day into chunks and physically moving around are both potentially great for productivity. Joel Runyon recently dubbed this 'workstation popcorn': http://impossiblehq.com/workstation-popcorn

Not to mention, in similar places like these, meeting people (for business and/or flirting), and well, having some exersize just by walking there.

And after you dragged yourself there, you have more guilt if you don't work, compared to being at home.

Neither of which actually require going to a coffee shop. It's the human interaction that most people find appealing.

I work at coffee shops for one of a few reasons, depending on the day. Sometimes I just want to get out of the house, and it's good to see what other people are talking about and doing.

Other times I need to get away from my very needy, very rambunctious dogs (we have three) but it's raining or really cold outside so they want to stay in and play. That gets very distracting.

Finally, sometimes I drop my wife off at work as she's a professor and it's difficult for her to find parking. So I'll take her to work and then camp out at the coffee shop where they know me and immediately make my order without me even asking.

People are different. Some people like noise and bustle. Others don't.

I find it hard to understand people who don't get that.

When I work with people around, I get more done. I get almost nothing done at home.

I'm an extrovert. Most of the time, I like social interaction. And when I get into the zone, I just pop in the earbuds and crank out the code. Best of both worlds.

Serendipity is huge for me. My passion is open government projects. I'm astonished how many random people I meet have a keen interest and relevant experience, from every walk of life. That validation, and knowing that they'll ask about my project next chance we meet, keeps me plugging away.

Have you seen the bit about the honor system for office bagels? Simply putting up a picture of human face watching you makes people more honest. I absolutely jog faster, do more pushups, write more code, etc when I feel there's someone around to impress.

This is a refreshingly honest answer, and I completely relate to it. I spent a lot of money on a nice desk at home, but I still get more done in coffee shops.

I find it harder to get motivated when I'm at home, but when I go to a coffee shop I know I'm there to just do work, and paying for my time there (in coffee) also helps spur me onto work.

Same here. You're stuck with a small keyboard and screen, and your posture probably isn't ergonomic. The horrible wifi and fighting over power outlets just tops things off for me.

>You're stuck with a small keyboard and screen, and your posture probably isn't ergonomic

So, just like at home for most people.

>The horrible wifi

That's a bonus. Less of a chance to turn your work-day into a youtube-cats-marathon.

>fighting over power outlets

That just does not happen, not in the kind of environment the article describes, which is built for this sort of thing.

> So, just like at home for most people.

That's easily fixed at home by buying an external monitor and keyboard/mouse (not a big expense, especially when you're no longer paying for transportation and coffee).

> That's a bonus. Less of a chance to turn your work-day into a youtube-cats-marathon.

There are much better technical solutions for this than using horrible wifi. There are lots of software options out there for blocking distracting sites.

> That just does not happen, not in the kind of environment the article describes, which is built for this sort of thing.

I'm not talking about the environment this article describes. I'm talking about the standard coffee shops all across America that people are currently working out of.

>That's easily fixed at home by buying an external monitor and keyboard/mouse (not a big expense, especially when you're no longer paying for transportation and coffee).

Sure, but the take away is, a lot of people just don't care, so the cafe is not that different for them.

>There are much better technical solutions for this than using horrible wifi. There are lots of software options out there for blocking distracting sites.

But then you can disable the software itself. I've tried those stuff, from pomodoro to internet site killers. Nothing works like absolutely having crap or no internet. See also various posts about how plane trips are so productive for coding and such.

>I'm talking about the standard coffee shops all across America that people are currently working out of.

Well, doesn't happen that much in those either. You can either go to one that's less populated, or you can always bring a tine 2-socket plug-expander with you (don't know how they're called in english).

> Sure, but the take away is, a lot of people just don't care, so the cafe is not that different for them.

The same way people don't care about their diets, but it ends up causing them a lot of (actual) pain down the road. If you don't pay attention to ergonomics, you're going to suffer, that's for sure.

> But then you can disable the software itself.

You can also get up and leave the coffee shop.

> Well, doesn't happen that much in those either. You can either go to one that's less populated

...or you could just go home and save yourself the trouble.

>You can also get up and leave the coffee shop.

Has more friction. And why would you leave the coffee shop? These people LIKE to work in those.

>...or you could just go home and save yourself the trouble.

If you're the kind of person who is productive and/or enjoys being at home all day, yes.

While the plural of anecdote is not data most of the programmers I know have at least 1 large screen at home to connect their laptop to (and at least half have a set up like mine which is a fast desktop connected to three screens).

The "average" hardware profile does seems to vary across the type of programming done/age of the programmer and industry they are in (it would be an interesting survey).

If you're regularly working remote you likely want to create a separation between your work and home environment. Cabin fever and what-not.

I agree with you. I have a comfortable home, and home office so I spend less than two hours a month working in a local coffee shop.

Off topic: Watching the picture, do people realy code in their tablet (ipad, etc)?

I had a friend who tried [0] before, but switched back to a macbook after a few months.

[0]: http://yieldthought.com/post/12239282034/swapped-my-macbook-...

His follow-up article suggests he ended up doing it permanently.

I'd try it if I had a keyboard for mine. I've written loads on a 10" netbook; it's a great environment IMHO because it's so portable.

A good work café would have Apple TV, Miracast and HDMI cables connected to 24-30 inch screens & borrow keyboards wireless and usb charging of devices.

That's not a café, that's an office that has coffee making facilities.

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