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Comment by elwell | Hacker News Reader

At first, I thought: "oh that's cool!" Then, I started to get a sick feeling in my stomach and realized the future will be mostly virtual. Some broad questions this made me think of; not necessarily related to this article in particular: What are the consequences of lying/tricking ourselves? Why (attempt to) mimic nature? Will we live in a 'fake' world in the future?

Not novel questions, of course, but this article explains a recent manifestation and progression towards that dystopia.

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I don’t think this is anything special. It’s just fancy room decoration. Better than a painting of the outside. (Well, depending on the quality of the painting, I guess. But I guess you won’t find any good ones in cheap cruise ship rooms.)

It’s not lying, it’s not dystopian, it’s nothing of that kind at all. When they board up actual windows with screens, then you can start complaining. Before? Not really, no. That’s completely ridiculous.

Those rooms didn’t have a view of the outside before. Now they have one. It’s in many ways imperfect but (depending on the implementation) better than nothing. (I guess their cameras could be awful, noisy and low-res, the screens could be awful, so in practice it might just be a kitschy room decoration, but I was assuming the best-case scenario.)

The ridiculous elevation of all things “real” is frankly one of those disgusting status games the rich and privileged like to play. Travelling to faraway places is probably in most cases a better experience than seeing images of that place on a screen (depending on what you actually do) but not everyone is privileged to be able to do that. Screens make our world smaller and more accessible for more people. That’s great, not dystopian.

If it turns out our entire universe is a simulation anyway, then what's the difference? The cruise ships walls are a simulation of a simulation, and our memories of them after returning home are a simulation of a simulation of a simulation. Nihil Sanctisne?

This kind of thinking might be one of the: "consequences of lying/tricking ourselves". That is, losing touch with reality. I'm kind of kidding, but not completely.

There's an interesting philosophical question here: what is the difference between seeing something in person, or watching it from inside your stateroom on a retina screen that mimics exactly what you would see if you were outside?

I agree with you that seeing things on the TV screen seems much less meaningful, but I have a hard time explaining why.

Easy answer: "a sense of depth" -- but then, retina 3D screens sans glasses... now there's an interesting thought!

Also include backlighting vs. natural light. Not going to be an interesting nighttime experience.

You can't feel, smell, or touch anything, for one. The dynamic range of the display won't match what you would see outside, either.

Simply knowing the truth that the experience is "fake" is enough to ruin the illusion.

Sort of a turing test for illusion.

How do you define virtual? Is it limited only to simulations, or is it for any attempt to mimic nature? For example, organic compounds used to be considered impossible to synthesize due to a "vital force" until Wohler synthesized urea from inorganic compounds. Is organic chemistry the study of "fake" organic compounds?

Unfortunately, a lot (most?) people do indeed see that as "fake" "chemicals"... that, I'll never understand.

I could see us living in houses where the view outside was simulated (mountainscape, seascape, etc) because the same view might get boring or be prohibitively expensive. If retina implants or Rift-style goggles go the distance, we might live in stark houses that are virtually decorated.

We might experience virtual travel as much as we do real travel, and do it without crowds, without heat and distance.

If the experience is accurate enough, I think our bodies and brains could be confused enough to derive more from it than we lose.

I had the exact same reaction. Sad to think that a "getaway" could be spent in front of a screen depicting what you came to see.

I don't think people spend a lot of time in their cabins on a cruise. This might just be a small enhancement and selling point.

Well clearly people go on cruises for reasons other than staring at the ocean from their room, else no cruise ship would have ever been designed with cabins without a view.

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