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Comment by TomGullen | Hacker News Reader

Not a fan of Beats. Tried a pair of their headphones in a shop and they sounded terrible. Build quality was flimsy as well. I think the only new thing they bring into the market is style, and that's not enough for longevity imo.

This new service, $10 a month. Not quite sure what it offers over Spotify. Anyway, past experience with their product means I'm just not going to be interested in this.

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You and I might have quickly picked up on the fact that Beats headphones are trash, but the vast majority of consumers have no idea. I see Beats everywhere these days. A lot of seemingly intelligent people I know are using Beats.

And you can't even tell them that Beats sucks, as I learned the hard way. It's not socially acceptable to inform someone that they wasted several hundred dollars, especially when they identify with the brand so closely.

If the majority of consumers are using headphones that are a 1 to 3 on a 10 point scale and beats are, for example, a 4 or 5, then they're better for most consumers. Are they as good as some ATH-M150s? No...but the market is saturated and it's difficult for the consumer to understand what's good and what's not. Enter the marketing/brand dollar and consumers will pick what they hear about plus what sounds better than what they're used to.

> If the majority of consumers are using headphones that are a 1 to 3 on a 10 point scale and beats are, for example, a 4 or 5, then they're better for most consumers.

You're not factoring in price. Beats are very expensive for mediocre quality sound. Those headphones that are a 1 to 3 (where Beats is 4 or 5) are only 1/10th the price of Beats. And for 1/3rd the price of Beats, you can get headphones that are a 7 or 8.

For Beats' target market, they don't factor in price either.

When I personally go to buy stuff, price is third or fourth down on my list of concerns.

I've bought two pairs of over-the-ear headphones in the past few months, and sent them both back. I was shopping on price/value, but the headphones I was getting were way too loud for an office environment.

For whatever reason, whenever I'm looking for decent headphones, nobody indicates whether I'll be broadcasting what I'm listening to to my workmates or not. Not the manufacturer, not the reviewers. Giant pain in the ass. It might not be long before I'd be willing to shell out the cash for Beats just to not have to fuck with it anymore.

Were you ordering closed over ears? If not, try sticking to those, and generally ones that reviewers say offer good isolation (in-ears like Shures are great for this).

Sennheiser HD280 Pro headphones are pretty good at isolating yourself from the outside, and the outside from you. Definitely sound different than a set of open ear headphones though. Just a recommendation. I have a pair and they're pretty solid. They can grip your head tightly though depending on your head size, but I haven't found them uncomfortable.

http://www.amazon.com/Sennheiser-HD-280-Pro-Headphones/dp/B0...

> For Beats' target market, they don't factor in price either.

Then they should be buying from good brands - for $300, you can get a 9 or 10.

> For whatever reason, whenever I'm looking for decent headphones, nobody indicates whether I'll be broadcasting what I'm listening to to my workmates or not.

Of course they do, you're just not familiar with the terminology. What you're looking for is circumaural (around the ear) headphones, rather than supraaural (on the ear) headphones. I would recommend the Sennheiser HD-280 PRO: http://www.amazon.com/Sennheiser-HD-280-Pro-Headphones/dp/B0...

I've had a pair for several years, and they still sound great.

> It might not be long before I'd be willing to shell out the cash for Beats just to not have to fuck with it anymore.

Getting Beats isn't going to fix your problem, as they are well known for noise-leaking.

Leaking's fine. Blaring out the other side of the ear cups isn't. I don't understand it, if I wanted everyone to hear my music, I'd just use speakers. What the hell is the point?

But thanks for the recommendation. I'll be sure to grab those.

You assume that sound quality is the only thing that matters in a pair of headphones. A lot of people care more about how they look and the branding then the sound, which is totally fine. I work in a small tech store and I've convinced people to buy better headphones to have them come back a few days later and exchanging them for Beats. Yes, they sound horrible, but different people have different needs and desires. It's not wasted money if they enjoy them, which I believe to a large part people do. Who are we to tell people they should buy headphones they don't want?

Branding and design is a legitimate category for a company to compete in and the people behind the headphones are certainly successful in it. They recognized that most people don't really care how they sound because the vast majority of people are not audiophiles and just want to look cool.

I have heard they are very bass heavy which is what most people like. They could not care less about nuance and realism in music. Bose speakers proved that.

If you've never tried good headphones you can never tell what bad headphones are. Most people have never tried good headphones.

I've been giving it a run through this morning. Haven't gotten too far in, but I'd already say Spotify and Rdio have some serious competition on their hands.

The curation is where this service really excels, also the UI is pretty tight.

I've heard bad things about the headphones, so never tried them.

I own a pair (got them as a present) and didn't sell them just to make people listen to them and compare them to my other headphones (I'm not joking). I hate them (because of the false marketing first, and the low quality product second) and also most people realize at the 10th second of the music that they're not good at all. But for some, in a strange way, they sound excellent. I just don't get it. Maybe humans developed two different hearing mechanisms and we're still not aware of our differences =)

Many people think more bass == better sound. Go figure.

Many people listen almost exclusively to bass heavy music, which does turn out sounding 'better' compared to more balanced headphones.

Beats are EQ'd to increase the volume of the high and low end frequencies.

These frequencies sound good to human ears.

So, when someone compares Beats to non-Beats, they hear that those frequencies are louder and the very fact that there is a noticeable difference is enough to create the illusion in some gullible people that Beats 'sound better'

Of course, in the long run, they don't.

>> "Beats are EQ'd to increase the volume of the high and low end frequencies."

It depends which model you buy. Their 'Pro' model is marketed towards sound engineers so I doubt they mess with the EQ on those. They also claim they are "The Headphones Used To Mix In Every Major Studio." which I seriously doubt. AFAIK it's always recommended to mix with monitors, not headphones.

They are not marketed to engineers. They are marketed to people who think they need headphones as good as those used by engineers.

In reality of course, engineers typically use headphones that sound as boring and "lifeless" as possible, for obvious reasons.

Ironically, they often also buy (relatively) cheap ones, as they get used to destruction.

I bought a nice, high quality pair of headphones and was disappointed to find that sound was quite 'crisp'. Fortunately there's an equaliser in the Spotify app... I cranked up the lower and highest end frequencies, and now Meshuggah sounds nice and crunchy again.

I'm not defending Beats at all, but I'll defend that low frequency / high frequency setup all day. Not everyone listens to classical.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equal-loudness_contours

The problem is, a lot of modern music has this same curve (the "smile") heavily applied to it already, so it can disintegrate into a mess quite quickly.

as a former sound engineer and tiny record label owner. They mix pop music and high bass music for scooped out eq, headphones and systems.

I can hardly believe that people buy them at all, let alone pay so much. I have to give them credit for the marketing, but still- my $50 refurb Sony MDR-V6 sound much better. Maybe if we paint decent headphones blue/red/green/pink we can resell them for $300? Anyone know if the beats products are better or worse since their deal with Monster Cable ended?

How do you know that you're not fooling yourself with the low price you paid, via the same mechanism beats fans are fooled by the high price?

They have(had?) a microphone like the apple earbuds. A couple years ago, being able to take a call was pretty important. I couldn't find any similar headphones with the integrated mic, so those are what i got.

Weren't Senn momentums available at that time?

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