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Comment by smokeyj | Hacker News Reader

Are you intentionally misrepresenting people's concerns of promoting racial discrimination as a virtue? I think it's concerning that we want to segregate and advance certain racial groups instead of addressing (what I see as) the core issue -- why are we so segregated (racist?)? Why are we uncomfortable around people who look/act/dress a little different than us? Many of us are multi-racial immigrants with backgrounds that cant be identified by by the color of a crayon.

That said, I think teaching anyone to code is better than not teaching them to code. If you choose who you teach based on the color of their skin, I don't see how that isn't racism.

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You can write as many paragraphs about the technical definition of "racism" as you'd like. You are criticizing a private effort someone is taking to commit private resources to helping an underserved demographic get access to programming expertise. Your choice of controversy speaks louder than any particular argument you might make. The point of these arguments, whether you realize and accept it or not, is to diminish the claim people have to being underserved in the first place. I find that notion contemptible.

Does the word racist make you uneasy? Maybe you should embrace your position instead of misrepresenting mine.

It definitely makes me uneasy when people try to deploy the word "racism" in service of the concept of "racism".

Since you seem to be very connected to the a generic literal meaning of things, try taking one more step and imagine how this "racism" would manifest itself, what the negative repercussions could be. Would whites and males be kicked out or jailed for trying to attend?

You're ignoring the cultural context in favor of whatever correct perspective you have. Unfortunately, natural language doesn't respond well to simple analysis like yours.

> Since you seem to be very connected to the a generic literal meaning of things

Quite the opposite. I'm arguing in principle, and if you would like to redefine these words, I have no problem with that.

> try taking one more step and imagine how this "racism" would manifest itself

I fear that people continue to only associate with those in their small bubble of what makes them comfortable instead of reaching out and forging relationships that span sex/color/religion. Maybe they feel that they need a "black" version of education, and feel less confident in their ability to thrive in a multi-cultural society. Instead of opening up to new cultures we cement ourselves in one that we can identify with based on superficial factors like skin color and clothes.

I'm actually arguing from a position deeper than "white men should be able to join too!". Please, don't take it that way. I think humans tend to be afraid of people who are different than themselves, and that's the core issue. When we turn our skin color into an identity, we segregate ourselves from so many people. I think something like sports/teambuilding would be more effective at breaking down the barriers we're witnessing in our society.

These are all mostly separate issues than teaching black girls to code. Why do you think they must be conflated and tackled at the same time? There is a benefit to tailoring solutions to different problems. There is nothing contradictory about being for all the things you mentioned while also encouraging specifically black girls to experiment with coding.

> There is a benefit to tailoring solutions to different problems.

There is, but I don't think that being inclusive to black girls requires being exclusive to everyone else. Not only that, they're cutting themselves off from potential peers who can help them grow their passion for programming.

Maybe I'm being naive, but I think it's possible for a brand to appeal to people of multiple races. In my mind I see other minority kids feeling left out and unappreciated. This kind of hits close to home, so I'm not just speaking out my ass. But just to reiterate, I don't think reaching out to people of a specific demographic is inherently wrong. I just wish it could be done without being exclusionary.

This is not a plain level field. Many are still suffering from institutional discrimination based on race, generations later, just as some are still enjoying the fruits of it. The bubbles exist. Obvious point made because this ties into culture, which is what programs like this help with. You're trying to deal with social issues at a universal human level which is orders of magnitude harder, if not impossible in practice. If I'm understanding you correctly.

My point was, however: you're taking an absolute view of discrimination based on race being racism. It's not the case.

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