Occupy Google: Income Inequality Backlash Hits Silicon Valley
finance.yahoo.com
finance.yahoo.com
I guess this kind of happens in Singapore, too. As the billionaires come in, the poorer locals encounter rising housing costs. And unlike the US, Singapore is an island-city-state, so there's nowhere to run.
I can't think of any solutions to this. Anybody have any ideas?
In Singapore, unlike many other countries where people think they're out of space (including the UK), they may well be really running out of space - I believe there are similar problems in Hong Kong.
Once various plans to rebalance the economy away from London come to fruition (e.g. HS2) things will return to normal.
[1] https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/no-stone-unturned... and/or http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-20142837 - "The Heseltine Review" isn't a primary source of evidence for this assertion, but it's through this coverage that I learned of these ideas.
I would love for there to be more houses in the place I want to live but can't. But I don't get a vote because I'm not a resident.
Also, while it stinks for people who are already tied into careers, having money flood into your community isn't exactly a bad thing for somebody entrepreneurial. I mean, if the new wealthy folks want to blow that cash locally, there's a lot of money to be made. It's demeaning in a "trickle-down" services sense, but it's cash to be had.
If a new property costs $500k to build, as a builder you would need to at least cover that cost. I can't imagine that this helps the poor unless it's government sponsored.
To make remote work work, you need a culture where in-crowds and promotions and ladders don't matter (they'll always exist, but some companies give them more weight) and where people are pretty much assured that, even if they never get another title bump-- because those things happen less when you're not in-person-- they'll continue to get work that they're happy with.
I don't know if the last sentence in your first paragraph was advice for Googlers or portable but I'd advise literally everyone to avoid traffic at every possible opportunity... though as I get older I'm much more 'ambitious' about happiness than title bumps, so YMMV.
I know a few nurses and none make $100k.
Someone should invent an economic mechanism that raises salaries when it's hard to find workers. This mechanism should work in some automatic fashion that allocates money to fields that are understaffed.
To be clear, I think this opinion demonstrates such a completely bullshit, narrow, entitled, and ethnocentric view of the world it blows my mind. It's a helpful reminder of why I don't live up there.
Well you can safely unblow your mind. He used a stereotype broadly applied to a group, but lazy people do indeed make up some portion of the "have nots". Sibling comments show measured, thought-massaged responses that correct the GP.
Let's not combat bad generalizations with hyperbole.
There's a good book on this: Guns, Germs, and Steel: The Fates of Human Societies. Well worth a read.
There are no easy answers here, though being mindful of history is important in arguing this topic - predisposition and environment have historically been used by social darwinists to assert superiority over other cultures and races (see: "tropical climates breed laziness" and "blacks are predisposed to lesser intelligence but greater physical ability"). They're not verboten, but it pays to tread carefully if you want to argue in that direction.
Spoiler: GG&S ends up arguing that the answer to why some countries are more productive than others is historical geographical circumstance, particularly because of access to large grains and domesticate-able animals which propelled some early cultures into agriculture and the rest is history.
The question of why Africa was largely technologically undeveloped was of some importance to Europeans during the slave trade. The predispositional argument was made to justify the practice of slavery, and post-slavery to justify continued discrimination.
Similarly, if you go to East Asia today (see: Japan, Taiwan, Hong Kong) you will still see today continued mistreatment of Southeast Asian migrant workers under the guise of predispositional and environment inferiority ("tropical climates breed simple minds" and such nonsense), justified by macro-scale outcomes ("look at all the tropical countries, all of them are a mess, clearly non-tropical climates breed harder workers").
These attitudes are depressingly common. The macro-scale differences in countries is often used as justification for odd micro-scale beliefs.
I don't think the GP deserves a measured response. I think the comment deserves outrage, but I get your point. I certainly get hyperbolic.
Unrelated to this, I wonder if people are outraged at the people who move to ND to pursue the oil boom over there. There relatively medium skilled and unskilled workers can earn more per year than SV 'tech' workers. Are people also showing the same contempt and or jealousy (or whatever it is) for those workers who decided they would partake in the energy industry boom in North Dakota? Or are tech workers a special kind of evil manifestation of things gone wrong? If so, what exempts the ND blue collar workers from this outrage at people's earning power?
[Added]
In both cases I pretty much see supply and demand at work. If suddenly everyone sought a CS degree (and then saw a devaluation in the degree, kind of like EE degrees in the 80s/90s), then salaries would slump. Same for the energy boom workers.
That said, I still think the comment fails. "haves and have nots" is only arguably hyperbolic because it's cliche, but ignoring cliche connotations it's just plain dryly accurate because the discussion is effectively about a resource: Money.
paul_f's proposed hyperbole makes a jump from "has money" to "has a work ethic", which is what I find wildly invalid and offensive. Even ignoring opportunity and circumstance for a moment (which I put aside so that I can avoid getting into a Randian snowball fight), it still ignores the existence of two people with equal opportunity and circumstance, but unequal tendency/desire to optimize for income.
If that is so, then it doesn't come across that way.
I'm not sure what the perception is towards the ND oil boom workers, but to get a sense of how the protesters perceive the tech community, take a look at the Fake Google employee that was at the protests: http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2013/12/fake-google-emp...
It's a caricature for sure, but it sounds a lot like the comment at the top of Hacker News right now.
"Making smart choices" doesn't always pan out. I don't think one can easily accuse someone who studied hard, disciplined themselves, and made their way through law school of being shortsighted, but here they are facing unemployment or dramatic underemployment.
Ditto traditional fields of engineering. Lots of people who studied hard, planned ahead, worked hard, and then fell into the massive collapse of manufacturing in this country.
It's nice to know that the crazy "improv political theater" from that one guy has some bearing in reality, though.
Lazy they are not.
(seriously thinking of pushing them into joining one of those RoR or similar bootcamps and getting into Programming, they have the drive and intellect to do well, I think)
Edit: Just to be clear, their PhDs are both in the 'Hard Sciences' - biology to be specific - Virology and Genetics respectively.
In the Bay Area this isn't possible, since NIMBYs have fought against every and any transit project, and caused the neglect of existing mass transit. Housing is expensive from SF all the way south - where exactly would these people commute in from? You can't even get from downtown into the Outer Sunset in an hour during commute hours, where do you think your baristas are going to come from?
The SF Bay is one of the most thorough and complete failures of government and infrastructure I've witnessed first-hand.
The choice to pursue a career as a mechanic or plumber or electrician or whatever else isn't a "bad" decision - those jobs are necessary and thus we need people to do them.
SF is a city and has the same needs as any other city, which means it needs people to meet all those needs. You can't have a city with just wealthy tech people because then no one's going to come over to fix the plumbing.
Wealthy tech companies are growing, hiring more talent, and paying them lots of money; this means that housing demands go up (from the people they're importing from other cities/states/countries) which leads to increased prices (specifically because you now have more demand from a group of customers that can afford to pay higher prices than everyone else).
Now, all of a sudden, people who aren't as nicely compensated at their jobs can no longer afford to live in the city they work. The issue is that the city still needs those people - regardless of what wealthy people think.
> SF is a city and has the same needs as any other
> city, which means it needs people to meet all
> those needs. You can't have a city with just
> wealthy tech people because then no one's going
> to come over to fix the plumbing.
If this is the case, it would be factored into the market. If there are no plumbers available to work in San Francisco, then no one would want to live there as they can't get their plumbing fixed. If there are no baristas in San Francisco, then no one would want to live there because there would be no coffee shops.Coffee shops aren't closing in the mission, quite the opposite, more are opening all the time, selling expensive coffee to tech people and providing barista jobs to baristas. Now for it to make sense for the barista to work at these coffee shops he or she needs to be able to live within commutable distance of the coffee shop. If there is no one within commutable distance willing to work for what the coffee shop is willing to pay, the coffee shop has to pay more and raise prices. If coffee prices go up so much that people hate living in SF because of it, then rental prices will go down because people will move away.
Of course it's easier to rail against the the former camp than the latter; we all believe in some degree of property rights, i.e., you bare the fruit of your labor. However, I propose both positions are unjustified and both parties need to bow out of one another's business.
Not trying to push libertarian beliefs (I am not one). But everyone is an asshole, out to serve their own ends, trying to sculpt the world in the way they would have it.
Care to explain that more, the tax system certainly does not punish the haves; it in fact rewards them. By the very nature of the marginal utility of money, the current tax rates hurt the have nots far more than the haves. The burden is quite simply not equally shared by all, it is born mostly by the have nots.
> This is classic "Us versus Them" (divide and conquer) that systemically makes it worse for most everyone, especially the individual. One is punished for success via taxes, fees, fines, etc. by the "have nots"; while the "haves" punish you for practicing a different set of ideals or lifestyle choices that go against societal norm.
Again, I meant to show an example. Whether the "haves" or "have nots" are in camp "punish by taxes" or camp "control lifestyle" is irrelevant. Persons shift between camps, when it's convenient. Similarly, all sorts of other camps exist towards other ends.
Clearly, Have versus HaveNot is not binary; there is a range there. Who is a Have and who is a HaveNot? If a Have is a $20k/yearly worker and a HaveNot is without a job entirely, we could easily argue that taxes are punishing the Haves.
It has to do with the fact that decisions in life have consequences. I can't help myself and have to quote a fantastic line from Star Wars: Your Focus Determines Your Reality.
Coincidentally, I had a long conversation with my oldest son, now in High School, last night.
He screwed up in a big way. He was given a book project a month ago. He had to read "To kill a mockingbird" and annotate it profusely. He read the book over several nights but procrastinated when it came to the annotation work. The work was due today.
On Sunday he came to realize he made a big mistake. What did he do? He stayed up 'till 2:00AM every day to get the project done. He decided to do this on his own.
Neither my wife nor I made him do it. He recognized his mistake and made the decision to right it entirely on his own. Up until yesterday afternoon we had no idea why he was working so hard. I have never been a micro-manager, professionally or at home. I assume and expect responsible behavior of others and, of course, try to lead by example. So I asked my kid if he really needed to stay up late doing this work and, when he said "yes" I just got out of the way and supported him by staying up, making tea and generally being there for him. I would get down to the bottom of it once he got done.
He got done last night. We had a talk. He is getting an A in English. This was extra credit work he didn't need for grades and didn't really need to complete. Yet, he told me he had committed to doing the work and explained how sorry he was he procrastinated and to such a degree.
I think my reaction surprised him. He's never screwed up on anything to this extent. He thought I might be angry or disappointed. The summary of a two hour conversation boils down to this:
In life we are guaranteed to make bad or non-ideal decisions from time to time. Not one person is immune to this. What matters in life; what defines a man is how he chooses to deal with these mistakes. Some will cave in and sink into a dark hole of self pity and agony. Some will find every possible creative way to deflect the blame and rationalize what happened as being someone else's doing or fault. And yet others will look you straight in the eye, own the problem and do whatever is necessary to fix it.
I said: "Son, you screwed up. You took responsibility for your actions and worked incredibly hard to make good on a promise you made to yourself and nobody else. You didn't need to do this for a grade. You already had an A. You did it because you are becoming a man with high values, morals, ethics and honor. I am proud."
I almost cried when i said this. It is an incredible feeling as a parent to see your kids make the right decisions.
In a country like the US the whole business of income inequality has two facets.
The first is that of Liberal politicians manipulating the masses because it is far easier to get them worked-up en-masse with stuff like this and then you get their votes...by e millions. That's the nasty reality of the Liberal party: They benefit directly from low education voters' suffering because that is easy to convert to votes. This is the oldest trick in the books and it is not monopolized by US politics. I lived in Argentina for a while and learned quite a bit about their Politics and history. Evita was known for sending trucks into poor neighborhoods to give out blenders, refrigerators and other vote-buying crap. At the same time they kept the poor down because, not surprisingly, without them they'd get no votes. Things are not done the same way here but it really is the same. Pit the masses against the successful, throw them a bone here and there (minimum wage, union pay and pensions, etc.) sit back and collect the votes. It's sick. It's all about pandering and manipulation.
The other aspect of the income inequality situation has to do with a massive change in the work ethic of the American worker and American youth over decades. We have devolved into an entitlement society where people want it all, don't want to work hard for it and everything is someone else's fault.
When I owned an electronics manufacturing business I made it a point to hire students from the local junior college. I would say maybe one out of ten, if not twenty, had a reasonable work ethic. I had a couple who stole components and expensive tools (crimpers, etc.). Others screwed around and played on the Internet if nobody was watching. In general, most were down-right disappointing in their performance and attitude towards the job. A select few were absolutely exemplary. I have no doubt the will become valued members of society.
What will become of the rest? Once they realize their mistakes in life, rather than work hard to correct them they will fall back on the simple idea of blaming it on others. They will undoubtedly become tools of the only political party that will roll down the street handing out virtual blenders and refrigerators. They will scream bloody murder at someone like my son who will get where he is going because he worked hard, made good decisions and, when he made bad ones he busted his ass to own and fix them.
It's about the decisions you make in life and whether or not you are man (or woman) enough to own them.
Your Focus Determines Your Reality.
In 2008 when Wall Street tanked the economy, people were saying, "I wish all that talent were somewhere useful like Silicon Valley." This seems laughable now. Silicon Valley? Useful? Anyway, "tech" had the good faith of the nation for a long time, we were the "good rich" as opposed to the people on Wall Street-- and, in the next 5 years, fucking blew it thanks to debacles like FWD.us, Sean Parker's wedding, and all the bad behavior that Valleywag so excellently chronicles.
We were the good guys. We still should be. Most of us, by population, are. The fuckers at the top, who don't even code and 90% of whom are MBA/private-equity types, have ruined not just our industry but our reputation. Now, people associate "techie" with spoiled brats, misogynists, and entitled, crypto-right-wing fuckheads (like the character played by the union organizer when impersonating a Google engineer).
Engineers and technologists and real visionaries (not executive bikeshed painters) need to take technology back. Now. No fucking excuses. We are the good guys-- the bad guys are private equity douches with no business in our world-- but if we don't take back our industry, it and our work will be used for bad (as we see in the Bay Area) and we will be the ones to get the blame.
I love technology and there are a lot of wonderful people in this world, but I hate what has been done to it, mostly by MBA-culture outsiders who'd be better for the world (and make more money) as passive backers, but their ego gets in the way and they have to act as an executive caste.
"Business" should be about creating value for all (including oneself) and not about wielding and accumulating power.
VC is a Cheap Votes Problem over what a certain set of highly intelligent people, when given capital from a certain pool, will work on. Passive investors don't care (as long as they get decent returns) and trust the VCs, who use the investors' cheap votes to pursue their career goals and those of their friends.
Google has some sins of its own. The airplane fuel deal was seen as a sign of taking advantage of the taxpayer. It is a big company and will make headlines in this regard.
I am sure we will get some inaccurate reporting, but it happens to a lot of groups (e.g. Occupy, Tea Party, Apple), and this particular article is actually very sympathetic towards Google[1].
"blame the victim"
Under even the most generous eyes, I fail to see how Google is a victim. If we were talking the fraud the protesters tried, then yes, Google is the victim, but not for the buses in the first place.
1) quote: "The frustration with Google's buses is misplaced"
Chairman of Google's Board of Directors makes for a fine headline and suggests his opinions might have an effect on Google's policies.
http://sfist.com/2012/09/25/behold_the_secret_corporate_shut...
Sort of like calling a tissue a Kleenex, I suppose. The shuttles for other tech giants pale in volume compared to Google.