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Comment by ZoFreX | Hacker News Reader

> We are the most survillienced nation

We are? I hope you have a better source for that than yelling something about CCTV and 1984 before running away (which is the extent to which most people can make the argument).

I do agree with the rest. Apathy is the name of the game here.

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Indeed. There's no evidence I've seen which shows the UK is subject to more surveillance than the US. Grainy, mostly privately-owned CCTV is a complete irrelevance in comparison to the digital/online monitoring which has recently come to light.

last i heard cheltenham was actually somewhere inside the uk.

There have been reports which indicate that GCHQ have greater capabilities than the NSA, but they are based on leaked documents, produced by GCHQ, to make themselves look good to other surveillance agencies. The NSA has a budget which is equivalent to that of the entire British military.

I was under the impression the statistics show that even negating private CCTV we have more cameras than every other nation and capital city.

Also when I was there only 5 years ago they started to build cameras that could speak to people on the street to issue fines on the spot for littering or being out of school, remotely.

Also road cameras were being deployed that issued automatic fines if the driver was eating or drinking in the car.

I have never seen that level of surveillance anywhere else in the world.

> I have never seen that level of surveillance anywhere else in the world.

I've lived in London in 13 years, and frankly I've not seen much more signs of surveillance here than in any other large city I've visited.

From Bruce Schneier:

http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2008/jun/26/politics.u...

> "We live in a unique time in our society: the cameras are everywhere, and we can still see them. Ten years ago, cameras were much rarer than they are today. And in 10 years, they'll be so small you won't even notice them."

I'm agnostic on whether the UK is much worse than anywhere else in the developed world. But the main thing I've learned from the recent revelations is that what I can see by looking around me is a very small part of what goes on.

Any source for that other than just an impression? Would be interesting to see..

> Also when I was there only 5 years ago they started to build cameras that could speak to people on the street to issue fines on the spot for littering or being out of school, remotely.

I have never heard of this, and never seen anything like it. It sounds like a half-baked tabloid story. Where did you see these cameras?

There are at least some in London. An old housemate of mine once got yelled at by one for relieving himself in an alleyway on the way home from a night out. Nothing more came of it then that, but it is still quite creepy.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/6524495.stm

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