South Korea’s education system: The great decompression | Hacker News Reader

South Korea’s education system: The great decompression

economist.com

36 pointsr0h1n15 comments

This is an example of policy devoid of cultural context. East Asian societies, and Korean societies specifically have a history of examination as the main way to move up in class. During many dynasties of the past, if you could do well enough on various exams, you could potentially go from being low-born to serving in the court of a king. It is in this context that the current system developed. Thus, a simple policy change will very likely not work. It's a cultural shift that needs to take place.

An informative article, which is worth reading, but the conclusions seem bizarre and lacking in logic.

Why should perhaps the best education system in the world pull back into a period of decompression? South Korea have created a generation of talent which is internationally competitive and fuelling a strong economy. Human capital is now one of the country's best assets. Even if you could identify an obvious cause, you certainly shouldn't seek to mess that up.

Why should the chaebol, who monopolise industry talent, be required to do the same in other industries?

My reading of the article suggested to me that "perhaps the best education system in the world" is focussing on the wrong things.

The pressures of an ageing workforce and the demands for recognition elsewhere in the economy will force a correction at some point I suppose.

Measurably the first or second best education system in the world (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11939566 ; http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-20498356).

You are apparently describing a correction in the sense that the quality of education will be reduced. I would be happy for you to clarify otherwise, but why should any country seek that out? Education is perhaps the primary reason for the continuing strength of South Korea's economy. What reason is there for South Korea to go in a different educational direction than it has, consistently and successfully, since its formation?

As you note, the article indicates that there's an ageing population due to low birth rate due to the expense of education. I find that an extremely long stretch and I've never heard this link made regarding a Western country. Why does this logic apply to South Korea if it doesn't apply in the UK?

I do agree with you that the article has not provided any evidence suggesting the correlation between low birth rate and the expense of education.

As an Asian I think the correlation is a little hard to believe for some people but this correlation can be true. The ever-growing economy brings destruction to peaceful Korean society and living expense is going up so much that good salary (and thus having an admirable job) is necessary. If you are not a Samsung engineer you can face social pressure (from your family, your gf/bf family and from your friends) according to the article. This is probably because Koreans are very proud of their technology. As a result from the pressure, I suppose a lot of Korean are avoiding marriage and birth early so they can concentrate on their career growth. These are just my theory and I'd like to see a good research on this.

Education in South Korea is often cited as the reason for their economic growth, but that doesn't quite match up, as discussed in this article:

http://www.spiked-online.com/Printable/0000000CA640.htm

There's also this article which talks about the downsides of their focus on education (for example, 40% of graduates are unemployed four months after leaving university):

http://www.economist.com/node/21541713

My personal take is that their economic growth and rise in test scores are both the result of the way their culture is set up. South Koreans tend to be extremely competitive and live under constant pressure to outperform their peers. For students this means that they study harder and for longer periods of time to do well in tests which makes them get some of the best scores around the world. For working people this means working an unhealthy amount of hours (South Korea often ranks at the top of the charts when it comes to measuring working hours) which is the most likely explanation for their economic growth. Both of these facts also contribute to South Korea having one of the highest suicide rates in the world.

Furthermore, I think there is a key point when it comes to education. South Korea is doing great at tests because that's what they're training for. Their education system centers around doing well in tests, not necessarily about learning the right concepts. There is a very big focus on memorization and they care more about doing well on a test than on actually learning. It is not uncommon for them to focus on memorizing previous exam questions to get the right answer rather than actually understanding the concepts to be able to correctly answer questions.

The benchmarks you cited measure scholastic ability. It is measured by such metrics as test results and graduation rates, as the second link says. The benchmarks have little implication for the general quality of life for students, graduates, and educators. Especially since getting into a top college doesn't guarantee success anymore.

Meanwhile, South Korea has the hightest suicide rate among OECD countries [1], and suicide is also the leading cause of death among people aged 15-29 [2]. Teenagers killing themselves to escape from academic pressure are so common they don't even make the news anymore. South Korean students might have the highest grades, but neither students nor educators seem to be even remotely happy about what they've got at the moment.

We're talking about a country where competition for standardized tests is so great that people pay thousands of dollars for leaked SAT tests [3]. I'm talking about the American SAT, not the Korean equivalent. Competition for the Korean SAT (suneung) gets even more serious.

In the past, when some foreign leader cited Korea's academic achievements in a public speech, Koreans felt immensely proud. Nowadays, Obama mentions Korea all the time when he talks about education policy and we're like "Err, whatever."

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_in_South_Korea

[2] http://www.voicesofyouth.org/en/posts/rising-suicide-rates-i...

[3] http://blogs.wsj.com/korearealtime/2013/05/28/group-of-south...

Look at this mofo's awesome education:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chung_Ju-yung

You mention measuring of education quality such as test scores. Interestingly Google recently found GPA and test scores to be uncorrelated to the success of their hires. (http://dailycaller.com/2013/06/20/google-executive-gpa-test-... ) The value of standardized tests as predictors of student prerformance in general is questionable just look at the critisim of No Child Left Behind (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Child_Left_Behind_Act#Critic...). Others have pointed South Korea's high suicide rate. If you eduction results in you making a lot of money but being unhappy with your life would call that success?

'Quality' is not a scalar variable with continuous properties, where you can say the second derivative equals zero!

An education system has a range of effects in society. The OA seemed to describe a system that is optimising one very narrowly focused outcome that was useful in the past but may not be useful in the future.

We shall see!

Sounds like an opportunity for someone with a different perspective to hire all the late blossomers...

That's what I always think when I read about these sorts of problems in Japan and Korea. There's a tremendous amount of pressure generated by the overwhelming influence of the big companies, and the shame felt by those who aren't given validation in this system must be acute (or at least it sounds like that for Korea, I don't know as much about Japan.)

Anyway the most common reaction may be to accept the judgement that you feel has been passed on you - that you are worthless - but at some point someone has to come along who refuses to accept that, and realises that the whole system is founded on narrow-minded bullshit. Then that person can build a challenger to the chaebol - one fueled by fresh thinking and real inspiration.

I mean look at LG and Samsung. Where's the passion and love in their products? Raw technical competence and business acumen might lead to limited success, but these companies seem completely soulless. At the end of the day, the world will never love a Samsung like they do an Apple. No matter how big they get, they'll never be able to make it to the next stage, where they actually inspire people and have devoted, passionate fans. So the space for alternative approaches within Korean culture seems (from an outside perspective) huge, even if the first steps are going to be very hard.

Is this what Japan was like before their youth burn out?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hikikomori#Japanese_education_s...

There's still a lot of societal pressure to pass exams to enter a "good" university in Japan (here "good" is an in-country measure - only a worldwide basis there are a lot of universities measured as better than almost all of the "good" Japanese universities).

Your university degree has usually been the measure of your worth to enter a big Japanese company, but there are presumably a few more foreign companies in Japan, and conditions there are better (not as much overtime). Companies like Rakuten have made English the company language, so there are changes afoot in Japan.

Did anyone else think about how we kind of have the equivalent for athletes here in the US?

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