Hacker News Reader

Comment by spodek | Hacker News Reader

Effective site, but I hope the people who found it depressing reconsider their response.

The site didn't tell you anything you didn't already know, it only clarified it.

Instead of denying information to keep yourself happy, why not use the information? My 69-year-old mother remarked earlier this year that if she didn't get around to some of her life goals soon she wouldn't be able to.

Did she say that out of depression? No, to live the life she wanted even more. She celebrated her 70th birthday bicycle-touring a wine region in France with my step-father, riding something like one hundred kilometers a day.

We can all do the same in our ways. In my opinion, awareness trumps denial.

View on HN

"Remembering that you are going to die is the best way I know to avoid the trap of thinking you have something to lose. You are already naked. There is no reason not to follow your heart." - Steve Jobs I built this to remind myself - http://liveconsciously.me/

There's every reason not to follow your heart, if your heart doesn't know how to make money.

You've gotta have something for retirement...

It's strange to me how some people seem to obsess so much over retirement. Is your intertemporal discount rate negative (i.e. do you value a dollar 50 years more than you value a dollar today)? That's awfully counterintuitive if you do. There is a risk that the utility will drop to zero if you die before then, and even if it doesn't there is every reason to believe that you will be able to wring more enjoyment out of it today then at a time when you are very likely to be physically and mentally diminished.

Perhaps it is an expensive minimaxing strategy.

It's not that much different than squirrels saving nuts for the winter. Saving for the future is wise.

More to your point though, I think retirement dreams have been born out of blue-collar type work. People physically cannot do most types of blue-collar work when they reach the "golden years". Consider how you can enjoy your life now and how you can position yourself to have an income when you are not as nimble and healthy as you are now.

I had to upvote this as this is something I've been saying for years. The amount of things a college grad can do with a million dollars is vastly bigger than the choice an octogenarian has. A dollar simply doesn't have the same value to a young person and an old person. The potential of what you can do with your money greatly diminishes as you age and at some point money even becomes a non-factor. When you're pissing your diapers in an old people's home, what good is your retirement money?

I am not advocating recklessness with personal savings, but at a certain age you pass the point where you can reasonably enjoy money.

> When you're pissing your diapers in an old people's home, what good is your retirement money?

As I've understood, the point is to blow all your retirement money between the age of 65(standard retirement age), and as you so eloquently put it, the age when you are pissing yourself in an old folks home. With a little luck, you've got about 30 years there.

More than a little luck. It'd take quite a bit of luck just to live that long, much less be healthy till 95.

If you're in the US, that money is always for keeping you off the street, at any age. It's funny you mention retirement homes. Those cost more than my current lifestyle does. Medicaid, you say? Ok, but first you need money for a lawyer to help you get on Medicaid, because the state will seek to deny you no matter your situation, as a matter of policy. We've been going through this pathetically broken process with my grandfather for a year. Just in case any young people out there are under the impression that 'the system' just sort of kicks in and takes care of things at a certain age, it doesn't. So you don't save for retirement so you can go jet-skiing in the tropics at 90. You save so you don't end up stuck, suffering alone for years in bad conditions, because you can't afford a roof and humane care.

I think that's exactly what a lot of people are missing. They forget that the US has very little in the way of social assistance. It seems nerve wracking to live there. I save because I like to have the peace of mind but I know that if I need it there will be assistance.

You are assuming that as your age increases you eventually become more and more debilitated. Although this has been true for all of human history, it's not unreasonable to think that this might change during our lifetime. See SENS:

http://www.sens.org/

People associate frailty with age, but it doesn't have to be that way. If we can fix or clean up the underlying processes that cause aging, being 90 years old will be a very different experience.

If you save a dollar, you can always spend it (plus interest) later. If you spend that dollar now, you lose the option to spend it on something you would have ended up valuing more later.

You can see the home where I grew up in your site’s photo. I freaked out for a second, thinking it might be some kind of message from above. Or some crazy breach of my privacy. I guess it’s just a freaky coincidence! Wow.

This just makes me stop and think for a second how connected we really are. Blows my mind.

Looks like beautiful Florence! Is it?

Pisa. Here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Santa_maria_della_spina_10...

Speaking of freaky coincidence: I went to this site, and it asked me my date of birth, before telling me how long I had left to pursue my dreams, on what happened to be my first experience on my 40th birthday.

Good job on the site.

I'm not sure if this information is motivational or debilitating. :)

Great site, small issue:

After signing up for the mailing list, there is a typo in the link to "continue to our website".

Another thing you can do right now is to start asking your parents about their life. It's one of those things you never take the time to do, and then one day it's too late.

If you live close to your parents, do it in person the next time you see them (and bring a voice recorder, your grand-kids will thank you some day). If you live far away, I built a service that makes it easy to do over email (http://www.storyworth.com).

Yes! It is a good idea to document family stories, recipes, etc on audio or video. You will learn a great deal about your relatives in the process.

My great grandma died at the age of 94. My grandma said last year in her late 70s "I wish my mom was alive, there are so many things I want to ask her" then started to name the things she wanted to ask her which included "Why didn't she smile in her wedding photo," a photo which has been on the mantle for at least the last 30 years.

This is really a pillar of the stoic philosophy, or at least as far as I interpreted it.

The awareness you speak of is quite freeing and empowering when you take the time to consider it. The appreciation you gain based on a stoic style of living can be quite freeing for people. It isn't just about using the information though as you mention, it is about being aware of it. Whether you act on it or not, you can gain some peace.

This site seems to put forward that idea, that knowing about it will in turn provide you with more appreciation and a better way of coping with the death as well.

I admit at first I thought it was depressing. But I quickly realized the opportunity to make the most of it. My parents are 80. Skype should sponsor this site.

I think the airline industry is the biggest winner.

I don't want to nitpick but 100 kilometers a day for a 70 year old, sounds pretty impossible...thats about 7 hours of non stop riding every day at a modest speed, even a fit college student won't be able to bike for 7 hours straight.

Edit: I do agree that a fit student can do a 7 hour bike tour, but i still staand by my opinion that for 70 year old it seems to be impossible.

A 60 mile ride on flat roads at a leisurely pace of 12mph would take about 5 hours. College cyclists ride at 20-25 mph. Pros ride at 30+. On my weekend rides were I average 19mph on the flats I regularly get passed by some very old riders. The point is: 100km a day is a difficult but achievable goal for a reasonably fit 70 year old.

I am 52, and I do 27 miles each Saturday on a longboard. It takes around 2:20 to do it. When I am 70 I may not be on the longboard for those distances, but no problem on abike i'd bet.

I disagree about the college student thing. I didn't train at all and biked from DC to Pittsburgh, doing 80 miles a day about. It one of those things where you can push yourself a lot further than you think.

Its really not that crazy. Its probably 5-6 hrs at a modest speed. Doable if you break it up. If its not too crazy hilly you just need some reasonable fitness and a conditioned rear end.

100k a day is.. routine, not even challenging for anyone who cycles regularly. They say cycling is a sport where you can peak around 50. The guys I cycle with are all well over 50 and some of them can seriously outpace me (I'm 31) I am sometimes overtaken at sportives by very old brown skinned skinny men on bikes. I'd say one of those guys would be able to do 200k a day np. (last sportive I did was 190k with 4 category 1 climbs in one day)

"They say cycling is a sport where you can peak around 50" - I doubt there is any sport with a significant physical component (i.e. not golf) where you can peak at 50.

http://www.outsideonline.com/fitness/fitness-coach/Am-I-too-...

My parents ride with a group some of whom are in their mid 60s, and have no problem doing 100-150km/day. They are outliers, but it's by no means impossible.

The worst part about a random person riding for 7 hours straight is being unused to sitting on a bike for that long. If you ride all the time it gets much easier.

Get involved in cycling communities and you realise that this, while not particularly easy, is not particularly hard either. Especially for spryer-than-average 70-year-old.

An average unfit person of almost any age, can, within a couple of weeks of regular riding, achieve 100 km in a day.

Woooh. An unfit 55 - 70 year old isn't going to do 100km's after a couple of weeks. They'll blister and cramp out at a minimum even if it's really flat terrain. However, they could get there in a couple of months with the right training/dedication.

Disagree, hell an unfit person can normally walk 30-40k+ a day and biking is much easier and faster. Perhaps you're confusing km with miles?

Get involved in cycling communities and be comfortably shown up by someone three times your age and you realise that [...]

I (32, not in good shape at all) started biking last year for the first time in years and was able to do 60 miles (100km) my second time out. with hills. It's about 5 hours at a very slow pace, but we did it in 3 1/2. My father (72) rides regularly with a large group of older bikers and does 150km twice a season, but 80-100km every weekend. My mother-in-law (60) recently got back from her second cross-country bike tour where she did 130km 6 days a week for a month.

I've known people in a bicycle club in their 70s who ride 100 mile rides a time or two a year. This being an antique bicycle club, that's 100 miles on an antique high wheeled bicycle. Fixed gear, and quite heavy.

Outliers for sure, but those are just those who I personally know. My own parents, 71 for him and 68 (with an artificial knee) for her, will be touring Hungary next year. I don't think it'll be 100K per day, but it should be a healthy daily distance.

e-bikes are becoming popular in Europe,and they can get up to a speed of 35kph, so they could cover 100Km within 3.5 hours, easily.

Similar to other comments, my father (68), rides to and from work which is 30km+, then for fun, will also include another 2-3 hour ride after work. My understanding is eventually you get into the zone, 100km is easy work.

If we were talking 90, then I could see why 100km a day might seem hard. However for some, 70 can still be considered youthful.

do you know many 70 year olds? My father-in-law runs 100 meter dashes with other old folks. He is 70 and can probably outrun me at 41 - and I exercise regularly.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com