Even Amid This Slump, Demand for Toyota Prius Is Insatiable | Hacker News Reader

Even Amid This Slump, Demand for Toyota Prius Is Insatiable

nytimes.com

22 pointspeter12324 comments

I have a 2006 Prius and I drove it 300 miles the other day on the highway and averaged 53 MPG.

It's spacious inside. My girlfriend and I can open the back and camp inside there. It's smart. It's good looking. For years it was worth more than I paid for it, partly because I have the California HOV stickers.

But still, a vehicle that is an investment. What's not to love?

I'd agree with everything except for the good looking. ;)

It's definitely a sophisticated car, but I've wondered about a couple of things: do TCO calculations for the Prius include the cost of upgrading the batteries? Will the depreciation accelerate as the cars age (and batteries wear) and as other hybrids enter the market? What is the environmental impact of building those batteries?

The batteries are covered by a 10 year warranty. And the entire battery would never fail, at worst you'd have to swap out one small piece of the battery which isn't very expensive. (The 2nd generation and later support this.) Of the million plus that have been sold, I read that something like only 3 people have had battery issues so far.

Just to add to what Alex3917 said. I spoke to someone who had an older model Prius than I did. He had owned it for a while and said that he noticed a bit of fuel economy decline, but that's it. But, like I said up there, I've had mine for over 3 years and it still gets 53 MPG.

As I learn to drive it better and let go of the need to go really fast, I get better mileage as well.

A friend recently remarked that she got 55 MPG on her last (all highway) car trip in her diesel VW Jetta. I wonder what demand looks like for these?

Also, I had lunch with a marketing contractor regarding a "green" tinted startup I was considering. She recommended I offer blog/facebook badges so that people could "brand" themselves as users of the service. She used the Prius and how its instantly identifiable shape/look helps sales as an example of this benefit. One of the important factors for potential customers is that others know they're green.

Yeah, diesel used to be terrible environmentally-speaking, but now it's actually very good. They've made big improvements over the years, between engine efficiency and that low-sulfur fuel they use now. That said, they're less convenient in some respects, which is going to be a barrier whether we like it or not.

In what respects are they less convenient exactly?

Diesel prices > gasoline prices.

You're probably talking about USA and while the prices are higher here as well, that's only because of taxes which are bigger for diesel.

By how much more does diesel cost in USA compared to petrol?

$0.50 to $1.00/gal more.

In Montana right now, diesel is about $2.39/gallon versus $2.59/gallon for regular gas.

Infrastructure. It's somewhat harder to find a diesel gas station, and also somewhat harder to find a mechanic to work on a diesel.

This is at least true in the U.S.

I've only heard good things about Volkswagen and diesel engines in the past year or so. What are the downsides do it?

Is it better for someone looking to buy a car in the next 2-3 years to just wait out for a hybrid or is diesel/gas here to stay for a lengthier time?

If you are interested in the true environmental benefits, then a diesel Jetta is a better car than a Prius. The Jetta is just as good as the Prius for fuel economy in real world driving, particularly if you have a significant freeway component to your normal driving. In addition, diesel drivetrains last longer, are less energy and resource intensive to build. And as a side benefit, the turbo diesel VW engines will out perform a Prius in acceleration and real-world driving. In addition, diesel engines have the most fuel flexibility to run on bio-fuels, and bio diesel is the easiest to make, positioning yourself well for future technology changes.

Diesel is not new or it revolutionary. 50% of all new passenger cars in Europe are diesels, they have been continually refined to the point where they are a quiet, powerful clean running powerplant.

The only drawback is that your neighbours and co-workers will not know you made the environmental choice, and you won't get HOV lane inclusion.

I often wonder if hybrids car have to look distinguishably different from other cars in order to be successful in the marketplace.... since I think most people buy it as a fashion-statement for environmental consciousness. You don't see as many hybrid Camrys/Civics around, even though I would argue they are better value for the money, but they don't immediately show that the owner is hip.

There was a hybrid in the small car market I might consider it. As it is, they are too expensive for me still, even considering a $5,000 savings on gas for 100,000 miles.

well its not that surprising, they just refreshed the car, so a lot of people are upgrading. Especially since the prius operates in the same trendy market, where people strive to have the best and latest.

"Trendy market" does not describe the owners that I know. They usually rank high instead on either Green scale or cheap-skate scales. [ disclosure: I rank high on both ]

If I had significant distances to drive I'd sure be watching to optimize my gov-sponsored rebate options to acquire one before $4 gas returns and jacks up competition for them.

green IS trendy.

Yes. But I would argue that trendiness it not its essence

It's much more of a political/conscience issue - that is what the Prius appeals too (IMHO) (as well as thrift).

I've seen a lot of taxi priuses recently, which makes me think they're good for more than just looking trendy. I would assume taxi drivers tend to buy cars that are economical to run and maintain, more than any other factor.

Sometimes the use of efficient/alternative cars is mandated by the taxi licensing authority, regardless of the total economic calculation. (It may not be the "taxi drivers" expressing preference via these purchases.)

The TV commercials for the 3rd-generation Prius are fantastic: in imagery, music, special effects. Here's the first of the series:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tq4nrmnqY9o&hd=1

And a video of the 'making of':

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_M-WaCg27k

Amongst other things, I think it has made a small car (other than e.g. a BMW 300 series and such) socially acceptable/desirable for a certain portion of the U.S. population. It's not just an economically influenced decision; there's still the motivation to "fit in".

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