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Comment by dangero | Hacker News Reader

"The real problem is finding a laptop that isn't built like crap"

The other day I went to Best Buy with the intent of buying a non-Apple laptop to make it easier for me to do some Windows development. I left empty handed after being appalled by the bulky plastic machines I found. It felt like the PC laptop industry hadn't evolved in the last 10 years since I switched to Macs. They did get somewhat thinner and nicer at the high end, but then I was getting no price benefit over just buying a Mac.

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I think your first problem was looking for a professional-quality computer at Best Buy. They've always been full of cheap plastic junk that can only be pushed on unknowing consumers.

Have you considered the Thinkpad X1 Carbon, Yoga 13, Vaio 11/13 or Asus Zenbook?

Yoga 13 is available at the Best Buy by me. First time in a while I've been envious of a non-mac laptop. IMHO, non-mac design has come a long way (finally!) in the last few years.

Best Buy also has the XPS 13

If anyone's in the market for a new computer, keep in mind that the new version of the Yoga is about to be released, it's going to have a retina quality IPS panel instead of an HD+. Also the old ones have been on the outlet for as low as $500 recently, so you can save quite a bit of money if you don't get it at Best Buy.

I really hope we get the IPS retina panel for $1100. I would probably preorder a computer for the first time in my life if this happened.

But at those prices, why not just get a MacBook Air? Sure, the build quality of the Zenbook is getting close to that of a MBA, but it's still has a ways to go yet it costs the same (or even more). Sure, it may have better specs, but really, for most people's use cases, the MBA is more than fast enough.

Why should the MacBook Air be the default choice? Most people don't want to run OS X, they want to run Windows. A notebook designed to run Windows will do so better than one that's been highly optimized by a competitor.

My Thinkpad T430s let me change the memory to that of my choosing, add an mSATA stick of my choosing, change hard drives of my choosing, has an extra mini-pci slot, expresscard slot, supports Linux well, replace the DVD drive with another battery, and has a superb online manual that lets me (or anyone else) make any repairs or updates.

At the end of the day it is my machine to do with as I please. Apple's stuff not so much.

Other happy T430 user here. You forgot to mention the stellar keyboard and trackpoint. And yes, it's very easy to disassemble. On the other hand, it is a full laptop, not really an ultrabook. But I wouldn't trade it for Apple hardware.

I've been using an X230 as my personal laptop for a while and I absolutely love it. Comparing it to my work T430, it's smaller, with a vastly better screen (IPS, albeit lower resolution) and on the whole it doesn't make too many compromises versus the T series.

I second the Lenovo service manuals. Behind the excellent Linux support they're the reason I buy Thinkpads. Not only can you completely disassemble them, reading through their service manuals it's almost like Lenovo encourages you to do it. Compared to this, a teardown of the 2013 Macbook Air makes for some pretty depressing reading: soldered RAM, proprietary SSD modules, proprietary screws, etc. I get why people buy the Air and Ultrabooks, but I'm glad the T and X series are still around and still dependable workhorses that you can service yourself with nothing more complicated than a swiss army knife.

reason i never bought lenovos: i cant see them before i buy. takes a month or more to arrive. you cant return if you dont like, despite no showroom.

You give good reasons why someone might want to buy the Zenbook over the Air and then ask why anyone would want to?

There are more than a few ultra-books that are widely considered to be on par with apple in terms of build quality, its just that you'd have a hell of a time getting an Apple user to admit it even if he held it in his hands. That's just human nature.

The Acer Aspire S7, the Lenovo X230, the Lenovo X1 Carbon, the Ativ Book 9 Plus, the Lenovo T440s, the Sony Vaio Duo 13, the Asus Zenbook Infinity UX301LA. Most of these come with Full HD or better IPS panels too.

You can find something wrong with any product, but it stands to reason that a person who has lived with Apple's faults for a long time is likely to have grown more forgiving of them due to familiarity. Therefore, when that person sees a competing product that isn't absolutely flawless, he may be more critical of it than he would be of a new Apple product.

Add Dell XPS 13" Ultrabook to the list. I got one with Ubuntu pre-installed, very happy with it but there is a Windows variant available also of course. Core i7, 8gb RAM, 256 SSD, 1080p. Very yummy. (Not astro-turfing :)

Dell really need to pull their finger out and ship that laptop in .au (and upgrade it to haswell already.)

Just switched. Love it. Absolutely love it.

I have a Yoga 13 and won't recommend it. The WiFi chipset is horrible and can't keep a connection to many routers, and the keyboard has a terrible flex to it that makes typing annoying. Otherwise, it's a great little laptop :)

all that is at best buy. but he calls those $999 models "high end". so...

I have a Lenovo W520 with 32GB of RAM, discrete graphics, 4G wireless and all kinds of other goodness. It's a little ugly but spec-wise it is day-and-night better than anything from Apple.

I just have to make sure it never goes into hibernate mode because it takes a long time to wake up.

I bought a laptop from microsoftstore.com recently. They have a good selection and their sale items undercut Amazon by ~20%.

Not being able to try the device in person is not great; you might be able to go to a physical Microsoft Store and get the same prices.

It's sad that the best windows laptop on the market is installing win8 on an MBP.

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