$349 Ubuntu Linux Desktop
indiegogo.com
indiegogo.com
A barebones, back of the monitor net top runs around $150 or so appears to be exactly what they're using:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16856119...
Then throw in a small HDD or SSD, a monitor, RAM, keyboard, mouse, and you're still at or below the $350 mark. These computers will get even better as the low-end battle between Intel and AMD heats up, and ARM alternatives appear.
I set up a bunch of systems like this that PXE boot into Debian off an older server last week. They run great, are nearly silent, and take up less space than the aging G3 iMacs they replaced.
Edit: the specs are actually almost identical to the $329 chromebox http://www.google.com/intl/en/chrome/devices/chromebox.html#...
4GB RAM, SSD, WiFi, Bluetooth.
> 100 GB Google Drive Cloud Storage with 16GB Solid State Drive
...I see Google's strategy is to own your data. Do you really trust them now that you know they work with the NSA?
So it is indeed not hard at all - most HN readers will be able to assemble a device similar to our campaign themselves.
But I want to clarify we are not running this to as a money-making campaign! We are doing this for two primary reasons: 1. Ignite pre-installed Ubuntu/Linux among PC makers by showing there is demand for it. 2. Try to put out a device at a lower price point than most Ubuntu vendors today and be price-competitive with the low-end models for Windows makers.
349 is pretty big price tag, I don't think it is low-cost.
I had a lot of examples and reasons lined up in here, but I think I am missing something. But what?
EDIT: I think I am missing the part where you are making it black and white clear what makes your system different and why is it good deal for that kind of money. At the moment, I can see it why it would be worth the money.
Good luck anyway:)
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We wanted to price it below $300, but were a bit nervous since Indiegogo/Kickstarter take about 10% including the payments system (Amazon/PayPal), so we're pricing it safe.
We'll certainly try to provide the best hardware we can at the price we can get it - who knows, maybe we can throw in an i3 processor or 128 GB SSD!
Also, we are pricing it below most of System76/ZaReason offerings - I think if you look at Dell/HP offerings at the same price range, they provide similar specs. But if we get the volume we need, we should be able to get much better hardware.
i3 processor or 128 GB SSD it would be worth it probably! But still, for me it wouldn't be low cost. But in the other hand, I do not live in US.
And I confess, I am not familiar with how popular is System76 and similar machines.
Although, I will say. For 200 euros I get Atom netbook from my local shop, with 50-100 dollar investment I can update to meet your current specs(ram+ssd). So Only difference I see, is that you have ubuntu preloaded. But you do not have screen included.
I think it would be good offer if I would get full deal within 349. Screen, where the PC is built in, keyboard and mouse. It should be hassle free for any grandmom for her internet machine.
Nevertheless, I wish you good luck. You have become further than most of us, making real difference. I can only talk, you really did something :)
I wish the video focused more on the box itself, it looks really nice, but there isn't a lot of time to see it. I would love to see a device that caters a little more to the mainstream that runs linux out of the box. I wish your team the best of luck.
Yeah, we really want to do a low-cost netbook or a full-fledged ultrabook with Ubuntu, but this is not within our capability at the moment.
But we have built this desktop you see in the video, and if we show enough demand, might be able to convince a manufacturer to work with us to do a low-cost netbook with Ubuntu pre-installed. But let's see how it goes! :)
At least we'll be able to show there is interest in having Ubuntu or Linux pre-installed on machines, and a larger manufacturer can take the ball and run with it.
What does ordering it through this indiegogo get me, other than Ubunutu being pre-installed? I can certainly do that myself, and the Dell would be a lot easier to upgrade in the future if I ever had the need.
Having said that, we're not aiming to become one such vendor. We are just trying what we can to ignite the pre-installed Linux computer market, not eke a profit out of this.
I'm with you on this in most respects, but you and I are in a very, very tiny minority. For the rest of the world this isn't a value proposition.
> we're not aiming to become one such vendor
So you're not going to be around to support this, then?
> We are just trying what we can to ignite the pre-installed Linux computer market, not eke a profit out of this.
If you're looking to make a statement, commit! Build something sustainable that benefits your customers. Don't just "eke a profit out of [it]," find a way to make gobs and gobs of money selling Linux machines in a very public way.
Complete wild ass guess, but you might have better luck selling a top-of-the-line Ubuntu machine on well-tested hardware. That last part, the well-tested bit, that's a really attractive value-add.
In the prior scenario you're asking me to give you control. In the latter, you're saving me risk and a big hassle.
- People who like Ubuntu. - People who can't install it themselves.
I think this intersection is pretty small at the moment... trying to simultaneously create a significant market and also create the product is going to be super hard.
Sorry... I've been looking for a cheap replacement for my current Ubuntu desktop, but this is not very attractive at that price point. It either needs to be much nicer, or much cheaper and I don't see that happening without backing from a big company like Google.
Also agreed about the target market: you're right in that the crowd wanting low-cost Ubuntu machines are likely to build it themselves.
As for a high-end Ubuntu machine: well, we don't think there is a need for us to do this. System76 and other vendors already do a good job with the high-end Ubuntu market.
School computer? Seems to me that a portable is preferable.
Office computer? Maybe - but not many offices use linux.
Libraries? This seems like a reasonable market to pursue.
Government Offices? Also might be reasonable. Big cost saver if the applications necessary are pre-vetted.
Maybe it would be worth talking to some local libraries or similar to see if they'd be willing to be a test bed for the machines.
Get Steam on there, and you could use them for video games as well, which is something libraries are now becoming open to in the interest of community building and getting kids in the building.
1) they're small volume, so there's always a premium
2) at the low end there are very few people who even see the benefit of Linux. It's got to be a gift from a geek, basically
3) if you don't get tripped up by (2), you're probably capable enough to buy an EEE box and install Linux yourself
I wish you guys the best, but I don't see this getting funded :(
* Excellent keyboard for fast typist and programmers, must be better than the Thinkpad keyboards
* Ability to chose the keyboard layout, i.e. being able to chose US International or whatever you like (Lenovo allows to chose US international independent from the country where you deliver to, this is one of the reasons why I use them)
* Having a great Trackpoint, at least as good as the one from Thinkpads
* Having a 3:4 screen ratio and great screen specs, colors, brightness, resolution, should be available from 12" to 15.6"
* Needless to say that Hard-Ware components MUST be fully supported by Linux
* Build quality must be rock-solid
* The option to order it withOUT paying for Windows
* Must be as light as possible with the given specs and material (e.g. I do NOT need a CD/DVD drive)
* Must provide an options to pay for at least 3 year worldwide warranty including coverage for accidental damage
I guess HN fellows will have some more criteria to add. But for me those are the most important.
I am ready to pay a premium for this.
* It has no trackpoint - the biggest deal breaker. But even if it would have one (I used Dell Latitudes in the past) it should be at least as good as the Thinkpad Trackpoints.
* I cannot judge about the keyboard experience on this Dell because I did not try it out, but I looked up and I could not order it in Europe with a US Keyboard Layout + € sign. As well I think the media would have picked it up if it had an excellent keyboard experience.
* The screen ratio is not 4:3 - I know nobody has 4:3 anymore, but I consider exactly this to be an industrial fail.
I could go on, but these 3 points are the most important to me. Currently I have a Thinkpad X220 Tablet, that I can use as well in Tablet mode with integrated stylus - it cost me more than twice the price of the Dell you pointed me out, but this is not the problem. I am almost happy with this device. The main nitpick is that some of the plastic quality is not good enough - it broke twice already and I have plastic bits that are broken right now (luckily I have the warranty). I would prefer a bigger screen, 12.5" is too small for spending the whole day on it. And as well the screen ratio is stupid for developer or people working on text. And I had to pay for Windows.
I suspect you're going to be disappointed for the remainder of your life with those specs.
I can't help mentioning though that the buildapc sub-reddit has had some threads on PCs for under 350: http://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/1khff2/we_need_to_...
But it would be nicer for more novice folks to be able to buy one pre-built.
What makes this Kickstarter special?
We're totally not knocking System76 here, we think those guys are doing a great job! Apologies if we seemed to imply that in our replies.
http://www.alibaba.com/products/F0/i3_cpu_ssd/CID701.html
Don't see something you like send three of the manufacturers your spec. $200 - $250 all up with 4G memory and 128GB SSD. Drop shipped with Ubuntu pre-installed no problem, you buy now?
Seriously there are a bunch of these guys who have family members in the Bay Area at least trying to sell me machines for the office. I like to give them a challenge like "mini-itx form factor and 16GB of ECC memory under $300" drives 'em nuts.
I mean, you could offer a $20 level for a mention in the installer/release, as a supporter, at the very least?
To be honest, I might approach Intel (at least send an email) about licensing the NUC and maybe getting at least a cheaper price on it, and using it as the base of your platform (if you're looking for something cheap & x86, with a little bit of power.
Disclaimer - I work for Intel, but I do not speak on behalf of Intel the corporation or of any of it's employees, rather I give this comment on my own behalf.
We'll discuss this and try to have some additional perks in there by early next week.
Note that it may not be quite right to compare the price with the barebones NUC though - we do include 4 GB RAM, an SSD hard drive (we're hoping for at least 64 GB, if not more) and do some manual work in pre-installing Ubuntu on this (no Windows tax!) so you have a fully-working system out of the box.
With the NUC, you would have to buy the components yourself and install Linux, which would likely come to the same price point (again, we realize most HN readers can do this with their eyes closed.)
EDIT: as for the $20 "supporter mention during the installer" suggestion - we want to install stock Ubuntu, so this might be hard. We can probably put up a perk that involves having the contributor's names on our website, etc.
You should have quite a bit of space after $80 -- the NUC is more expensive than I expected it to be (I thought it was closer to 200 than 300). I do still encourage reaching out and seeing if they would at least like to take a stab at this. While I'm not the kind of mover-shaker that would be able to muscle this through, I think you could get some serious consideration. I can look into the proper channels next week also.
Oh and yeah, if you're installing stock Ubuntu you probably might not be able to do that... but maybe changing something small like setting the default home page to your distribution's thank you page? or something
Also, cool/catchy linux-themed T shirts will go a long way.
We did quite a bit of research - this was really the lowest we could price it at given our volume and the BOM (cost of raw materials.)
We will keep trying to reply to any comments on Hacker News as soon as possible. If this becomes hard to do, hopefully we can answer the questions as updates/comments on the Indiegogo campaign itself.
VGA should be thought of as an emergency, not a standard, due to it's analogue crapness.
A few high-quality pictures of the PC in good light would help too. The video features the monitor more than the PC itself.
Feel free to ask us questions here or on the Indiegogo page, as well as providing any feedback. We'll try our best to answer questions - even over the weekend if possible. ;)
This is a product that has been long due, but for some reason never gets built. 5-6 years ago, driver support etc was the main reason, but it is no longer the case. If this has to work, it has to work exceedingly well for all the possible use cases out-of-the-box.
If it can't do what it is meant to do at the first go, make sure you put up simple and clear instructions as to how to go about it.
The moment you hit the legendary "show me your lspci output" point you would have lost the game, no matter how good the specs are.
That said, a week of fiddling and my dev platform is the same as the one that I had on OS X. So, it is not like it can't be done.
Good luck :)
Pre-installed Linux is a promising niche, but I think not too many people would benefit of this particular model at this price.
I use linux but I have come to really dislike ubuntu over time, so this is pointless to me, but I wish them luck.
The Shan PC is meant to be THE affordable, small and portable desktop with Ubuntu pre-installed that you would ever want or use.
We looked at the Raspberry Pi, but it provides too little CPU horsepower for most basic computing chores - its hard to run a decent GUI or browse the web on it. Not knocking the Pi one bit here (!), but we think a desktop computer would need a bit more firepower than the Pi.
Also, being a crowdfunded project, we're able to provide this at a price-point that System76, ZaReason and other pre-installed Linux providers aren't able to provide right now (they're great companies too, so do support them if you like Linux pre-installed on your desktops/laptops!)
Having said that, Acer, ASUS, Lenovo and others make "nettop" devices that are very similar to this one. Generally theirs are cheaper but with 2GB RAM standard and no SSD... for about the same price as this one you could get one of those others plus the extra RAM and a (small) SSD today at the advertised price... just with slightly more work in upgrading the RAM, swapping out the drive and installing Ubuntu yourself.
The extra work seems like a small price to pay though for getting a system right now instead of putting down money and getting a system in 2014. That sort of long lag time to delivery without any sort of associated price break is what killed the Ubuntu Edge phone for me, and I can't see myself investing in this thing either (sorry @shanpc).
Basically you could do this yourself for right around the exact same price point if not a bit cheaper with the minor inconvenience of installing the OS yourself.
And let's face it, these days, if you're not willing to put together a desktop (which you can trivially do at this price point assuming you're willing to make the same price/performance tradeoffs), you're probably not in the market for a desktop, but rather a laptop or a tablet. That's just where the market is at these days.
We'll certainly try to provide the best hardware we can at the price we can get it - who knows, maybe we can throw in an i3 processor or 128 GB SSD!
Also, we are pricing it below most of System76/ZaReason offerings - I think if you look at Dell/HP offerings at the same price range, they provide similar specs. But if we get the volume we need, we should be able to get much better hardware.