We are just getting started | Hacker News Reader

We are just getting started

blog.app.net

72 pointsdalton24 comments

I'll be honest in saying that while I kind of understand what app.net does, I really think they need to work on their messaging. It's a social graph distributed storage service, kinda, but provided in some way more private than ad based social networks like facebook or google plus?

I'm pretty Internet savvy, have spent most of my life building large web sites, and outside of reading articles about app.net every once in awhile (which I forget and then end up with the half-informed summarized memory above) I really can't figure out WHY I should be using it as a user. I'm sure part of it is them just not having a AAA app yet that just does something awesome, but I do wish they'd work a bit on their homepage so that all of it was more clear at first look.

Just some non-specific advice from an Internet traveler. If it's tough for me to figure out, it's likely tough for someone with much less experience. Right now, all I understand are your core values (which of course I agree with) and have trouble seeing how I actually use the service.

Thanks ahead to the people I'm sure that will comment on this and explain it a bit better, my general point is that I should be able to figure it all out quickly on one page.

Good luck duders! It's a product I'm generally curious about but never have enough time to do serious investigating on.

I feel the same way about it. It's always felt like more of a concept than an actual product or service to me. Even the home page is really vague: "App.net is Your Passport to Great Applications"--what does that even mean?

I have friends who use App.net and love it, but I don't think I'll be jumping on board because I just haven't been convinced that I need it.

I was a member from the first day.. and then cancelled after about 6 months because after trying to force myself to 'get it' I still didn't know what I was meant to be doing with it

My take is that its the facebook platform minus facebook.

Why did you cancel after six months although you had paid for a year?

100% agreed. I'm a very savvy Internet user (I thought?) and I still don't really understand what they do/offer. At one point I thought it was just an "open" version of Twitter, but that seems to have changed now (or has it?)

It feels very much like "insiders solving very specific problems for other insiders" ... maybe insider isn't the right word, but my sense is they were born from frustrations with changes in the way Twitter handled the ecosystem ... i.e. 3rd party clients. So they said ok, we're going to build our own system that isn't trying going to restrict 3rd party clients.

So I (think) I get what they are on the periphery, but I still don't get the core product.

I'm sure it's good though - or at least good in spirit. Would love to hear more.

Can someone do an 'explain app.net to me like i'm 5 and have never used the internet'...?

This is what I get. Could be totally wrong and if so, please correct me.

App.net allows app developers to use app.net platform for a fee. App developers can integrate their user's app.net logins/profiles/network/photos etc. just like they do on facebook platform. App developers can also create users in the app.net platform. Users never see any ad. They also have good privacy settings. It's like win-win for both end-users and app developers. The only catch being app developers pay a nominal fee.

Users also pay a fee (there are free accounts, but they're very restrictive).

App.net con(vince) developers to give up cash to fund a proprietary closed platform. Even users had to pay to get an account. They then sell shares of the business to Andreessen Horowitz for $2.5 Million.

Why don't developers and users get a share of the business? Didn't the developers take on the most risk a year ago? Seriously, it's about time backers of crowd-sourced projects start demanding something tangible instead of just forking over cash to every salesman to come knocking.

Anyway, eventually the investors - and the rest of the bandwagon which is sure to follow - are going to want a return on their investment, so we know how this API-feel-good story ends.

Any developer building on top of App.net expecting long-term stability is kidding themselves.

In recent months App.net has started paying developers. I don't think developers ever had to pay to use the platform, although each developer probably has a paid personal account (in other news, iPhone developers buy iPhones).

I am a little concerned that a centralized silo with a sustainable business model is still a centralized silo and I personally would prefer a personal cloud/indieweb approach instead, but App.net is hardly some kind of Ponzi scheme.

Ultimately I think App.net will either have a killer app (probably from a third party) in which case people will sign up just to get that app, or it will just fail. Either way, there's no real need to market App.net itself.

That's a great point. I don't think the target demographic for App.net is the regular internet user but rather it is/should be developers who could build great apps for regular end users (leaving app.net in the background as a technical detail). So their messaging should be geared more towards selling it as Social Graph as a Service to developers rather than being a direct alternative to Twitter, Facebook, etc. Maybe it already is but the messaging should be more clear.

I agree. The first couple of times that I tried to find about App.net, I got lost in the Social values listed on their page and trying to figure out what each app does and how are third parties benefitting. I believe if Web Savvy users like us are having a hard time 'getting it', it's a lost cause for people who use 'Whatsapp' and are persuaded to use 'Whisper for App.net'

I agree. My impression was that they just want to be the one account you use to sign in to all your apps and provide the backbone structure for those apps.

By the way, this blog might help explain: http://daltoncaldwell.com/what-twitter-could-have-been

I've never been more confused than when I recently downloaded the Passport app for iOS. I was expecting some kind of basic twitter-like client with some app integration hooks. You know, kind of like what you see when you login to app.net! Instead, I see this really confusing app store, with no explanation. Clicking on an app downloads it, and from there I have no idea why I'd want another app store - maybe these are ADN compatible apps? Maybe they all work together because they're ADN aware? Anyone?

My understanding is that it is ning.com but with a different business model. (Interestingly, Marc Andreessen of a16z was a cofounder of ning.)

I wish you guys the best, but to quote a silly TV show: "Any man who must say he is king is no king".

How dare you call Game of Thrones silly? And it's a book adaptation btw.

Is it just me, but I truly don't understand why App.net is still being touted as 'alpha'? I think for many people this is a put off. I paid up on kickstarter because I liked the initial idea. I've been waiting to actually use it because 'meh, it isn't even in 'beta' yet.

It might be just semantics, but the 'alpha' label suggests that it is generally an MVP that is probably really buggy and annoying to use.

You can imagine my surprise when I read this post and find out about all of the cool things that the app.net team have achieved in the last year.

Somewhere along the line I appear to have missed any marketing messages. That might be my fault with some stringent Gmail filters?

Anyway, well done on the hard works guys, but are you really still truly in alpha? Just change it already.

Edit: I've just realised that 'alpha' isn't the project status: http://support.app.net/customer/portal/articles/761034-what-...

That might be a common user mistake. I don;t think I'm the only one that might make this (wrong) conclusion.

One odd thing I found in one of their job postings. They actually say the candidate must be located in San Francisco. I hope they mean Bay Area and that they will not provide relocation and not that they only will talk to someone if they live in the city. I cannot be sure after reading the other silly generic requirements listed before this.

http://jobs.app.net/apply/iX7lc8/Software-Engineer.html

How about accepting bitcoins for subscription? A social network full of bitcoin users would be very cool!

I love it. App.net is going to be messaging system for the internet. Go Dalton!

Uh, you mean like electronic mail? Some kind of e-mail, if you will?

Reply on news.ycombinator.com