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Comment by jmduke | Hacker News Reader

Lot of comments on HN, Reddit, and elsewhere criticizing the title ("what does the MBA thing have to do with anything?", "who cares if its an MBA?", etc.), which I think is a little ironic because the overwhelming mentality on tech forums is that MBAs are idiots with more money than brains that get paid absurd amounts of money to play golf and talk about synergy who could never do what we do.

I'm glad that more traditionally non-tech people are being exposed to the wonders of programming. I'd be equally ecstatic if the title read 'English major builds app in less than 2 months.'

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which I think is a little ironic because the overwhelming mentality on tech forums is that MBAs are idiots with more money than brains that get paid absurd amounts of money to play golf and talk about synergy who could never do what we do.

We've all seen this, of course. As an MBA, it makes me chuckle. As an engineer it makes me sad. If there's one mindset that could be stand to be purged from the development world it is that developers are so damn smart.

The insecurity over intellectual capability is so strong in the software engineering profession that it's debilitating. Developers - get over yourselves. There are lots of smart people out there and they don't all look like you. Embrace this fact and you will be freed. Once you recognize that you cannot even define "smart", constructing your identity around being smart loses its luster.

I chose to do a two year MBA from Babson College from 2007-2009. I had worked at a medium-sized tech company for 3.5 years prior. My undergraduate degree is in Computer Engineering. Today I run a startup.

I have felt strong anti-MBA sentiment here and elsewhere in the startup community. Some VCs go out of their way to lampoon the idea of an MBA. If the author of this article has experienced a similar sentiment, it makes a lot of sense for this article to be titled this way.

If the prevailing mode of thought is that MBAs aren't useful, or aren't technical, MBAs must present fact-based argument against this.

I learned a ton about working with people, leadership, finance and organizational design in my MBA. I also learned to write Facebook applications[1], cooperated with a friend at Rice to release the first Baby Names iPhone application.[2] (I ran xcode on a hackintosh) I learned a ton about how to turn an idea into a real world thing.

Sometimes things I learned during my MBA offers context to problems faced at startups. However, when I say that things I've learned during my MBA contributed to reasoning on a particular recommendation, I've learned this sometimes detracts from my arguments more than add. That is frustrating.

[1] http://banagale.com/my-first-database-refactoring.htm

[2] http://neutrinosllc.com/products/iphone/applications/babynam...

>> If the prevailing mode of thought is that MBAs aren't useful, or aren't technical, MBAs must present fact-based argument against this.

As with anything, YMMV.

My program overlapped heavily with content in my business oriented (but not actually business administration) undergrad social sciences degree. I didn't get nearly as much out of my program as my peers who came from sciences, technical or arts undergraduate programs did. I actually felt like my undergrad program was superior in many facets to the business school I attended. That's not to say I didn't get anything out of it, but I found most of the first year mandatory stuff to be of much lesser value than the second year optional courses I took.

> If the prevailing mode of thought is that MBAs aren't useful, or aren't technical, MBAs must present fact-based argument against this.

Part of the problem (at least to the HN crowd), is that a lot of the problems MBAs solve can't be shared on Github and/or can't be shared outside of the company (because it would violate NDAs, trade secrets, etc) and so it seems that MBAs are worthless.

I'm halfway done with my MBA (having come from the software development world) and one of the biggest adjustments I've had to personally make is to realize that I've gotten work done (and enjoy the associated sense of accomplishment) even if I don't have a set of commits to show at the end of the day.

>a lot of the problems MBAs solve can't be shared on Github and/or can't be shared outside of the company (because it would violate NDAs, trade secrets, etc) and so it seems that MBAs are worthless.

There is definitely something to this. While programmers do perform undocumented effort, at the end of the day they still have the opportunity to commit or push to production. In that sense, proof of work in manifested by looking at Github.

Using email and phone calls alone a business manager can improve a key relationship or be influenced in a way that will lead to a major impact on a product's future, and there is just no way to express this in a similarly auditable fashion.

Running the business of a startup is much about managing the flow of energy. Energy flows do not have line numbers. You can only feel the effects daily, or wait until a major milestone like a funding event or growth spurt to clearly evaluate success.

I was bothered by the title too, but reading you and the OP, I realized that in the same way MBA is a generalization that generates both bad (arrogance) and good (intelligence) impressions, so is the word "hacker". And YC is built upon the idea that make hackers develop business and entrepreneurial skills is a good thing, so why not the idea of making MBAs develop programming skills is something equally good?

Myself, I am not a MBA, but I related to this stereotype more than I relate to a hacker (I studied Economics and my carreer is on non-profit management). And I learned to code and created a web app, a B2C SaaS, in 5 months. From zero knowledge to publish the site to first sale in 5 months.

I would not put a lable like that on me, even less claim bragging rights on this, but I think both me and the author are good examples that people may easily and quickly change whole carreers that were decided when we were less than 20 years old. And that is a good think.

That a hacker may hustle and achieve to create a business from their code and a MBA may hustle and achieve to create a code from the business he imagined, are both sides of a new and welcomed coin. Why not celebrate them both?

I was an art major that learned Objective-C and launched an app in 3 months (calculated the most drunk for your buck in my college town - https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/red-cup/id477350446?mt=8). Now I have a job creating iOS apps for a living with 2 years of Objective-C experience, and tinker with different languages and side-projects as well. As an artist, I've always been a builder and maker, just now I'm using code and silicon as my media more than paint or clay.

I think it's a little unfair to assume that MBAs are non-technical. You can enter an MBA program with any undergraduate degree. When I did mine between 1992-1994, my cohort had a pretty good cross-section of individuals with undergrads in just about every subject area, from liberal arts to engineering.

Aren't like half of MBA's engineers to begin with?

The only interesting part is that he did it - without any previous knowledge - in two months. Whether he is a janitor, MBA or photographer is not relevant at all. The title itself could be seen as an insult - that "even an MBA can do it". Maybe it's this mindset that inspired the title?

The usual characteristic that is brought up when somebody accomplishes something noteworthy given their background is time - 2 months in this case, a 12 year old person in another case.

I wonder what positions the good MBAs tend to be in vs the bad, for example which kind are more likely to be big company CxOs.

>I wonder what positions the good MBAs tend to be in

*work in

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