Mark my words: by 2041 china will be a freer country than the United States. It is already economically freer in the free economic zones such as Shenzhen.
Every time someone says something like "China is [or will soon be] freer than the US", what they're really saying is "I don't read, but I'm happy to divide the whole world into two sides: whoever supports my current biases, and whoever doesn't".
You can't deny that this is indirectly partly due to America's demand for cheap goods that China provides. Look, United States has already passed this stage -- we have had dark spots in our history too, with crimes among the most heinous in world history: slavery, genocide, child labor. We've mostly improved... and I expect China will improve as well as its populace becomes more learned and starts demanding more freedoms.
But at any rate. I have one question for you tptacek: don't you agree that the extent of child labor, improper wages, toxic dumps, etc. taking place in China would be considerably less if Americans conscientiously chose to not fund these operations by essentially doing business with them? In other words, isn't America -- and the people of America -- culpable of these crimes that you make note of to a non-zero degree?
If not, your claims are just in the same vein as those a century ago telling the world about how those evil (pagan) Chinese hated babies and dropped them in the bins.
Was just trying to show you that since the dawn of time the "other" has been considered dangerous, evil, etc. by many people. And you reflect very well this mentality.
China is agreeing to play by the rules, but the US wrote the rules.
Also, libertarians shouldn't come here expecting a libertarian paradise. There is plenty of unfairness and economic non-freedom to go around.
I think every idealist embracing that "corrupt West" and "noble savage" outlook on cultures should spend a year or two living in one of many shitholes of the world. It could bring some perspective.
Not sure about the date, but in time, China will be the leading free market democracy. What people totally fail to appreciate is the slow long term planning China can do, and no other large country can do that because of the democratic process. If you are out after 8 years, what is the motivation for a 50 year economic plan?
As the Chinese move more and more in to capitalism, and its people grow richer, they will want a say, and some power. As that happens, China will slowly feed in democratic mechanisms, as it has capitalist ones. It will have no choice, and it knows that. China will incresingly have more to lose and more international assets to protect, so its military will grow, as will it's navy. As Chinese influence and world investment grows, the likes of the USA will lose power and influence, and grow more an more concerned. As we have seen, that fear and paranoia will lead to more and more loss of freedom and democracy. So as China becomes more like America, America will become more like China is now.
The USA needs a long term plan to meet that challenge, and find a working equilibrium. I don't see one or where it will come from.
Not thought this through, just floated in to my head, but.....
Where might be a better place to host my web site or email? Both the US and China spy on me, that an equal given. But, so far, I dont see non Chinese citizens running scared of the Chinese authorities. Could be totally wrong, but are the Chinese, with allies, harassing any Kim Dotcoms or Assanges? Are they making any one launch massive raids on homes? Cant help feeling that China might be a safer place to host some services. Must be a problem there somewhere. Its an argument to be had though.
Seriously, have you been to China? Have you dealt with their government? TEHRE ARE NO FREE ELECTIONS IN CHINA. You fucking, fucking idiot.
The problem is that it seems like for most people, choosing between a few options is preferable than to have to carefully examine and choose from a wider array.
Don't you see the irony of accusing him of an ad hominem argument to try to win your argument? That's an ad hominem argument!
I primarily had in mind the relative court systems of the two countries. As long as the Chinese court system is not fully independent and autonomous, has term limits rather than lifetime appointments, and replacement judges are appointed by the CCP, it will always be something of an instrument for the CCP, and I don't see them ever completely relinquishing that power.
US Judges are of course appointed by the political party in power at the time (except for lower level ones in elections), but that changes relatively frequently, and once the judges attain their lifetime appointment, all bets are off how their judicial views will evolve over time.
Sometimes we get politically partisan results like the 2000 election decision, but other times we get real surprises like Justice Roberts siding with the ACA in a tie-breaker.
But a completely independent and equal judiciary branch is the last resort of a free society, and the US has a 200yr+ tradition in that respect. China's court system was only reformed ~40yrs ago, and partially as an instrument of the CCP, rather than as a fully independent and equal branch of the Chinese government.
Based on trends, it will also soon exceeded by a few Asian countries such as South Korea.
Given that China has copied the same economic and political transition of other Asian countries such as South Korea, but is simply further behind chronologically, please tell be why it's completely inconceivable that China will exceed the U.S. in freedom.
I call baloney on this. (Your use of "far" to modify "behind" goes beyond the facts.) Where are the rankings you are referring to? Can you link to those rankings, please?
And, yes, as a matter of fact I do speak and read Chinese, and have lived in east Asia for years after university study of the history and language and culture of China.