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Comment by stesch | Hacker News Reader

What he says about the picture of the USA during the cold war, that's what we all thought around the world, especially in Germany.

A few people criticized the imperialism, but most people just saw the USA as an example of how the free world should function.

This was shattered during the time of George W. Bush. He ruined it. We all mourned 9/11. We were at shock and couldn't realize what happened. There were minutes of silence around the world. And George W. Bush ruined it. Destroyed the trust and solidarity.

Then came Obama. We thought he will bring peace and undo any wrongdoing of the former government. He even got a Nobel Peace Prize because we thought it was inevitable that things get better.

And now?

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>What he says about the picture of the USA during the cold war, that's what we all thought around the world, especially in Germany. A few people criticized the imperialism, but most people just saw the USA as an example of how the free world should function.

A few people? Speak for yourself, or maybe Germany, but surely not for "throughout the world".

Well, West Germany was the pet child of the US, to serve as a counter-weight to USSR's influence in East Germany/Europe. But even there, there was tons of popular anti-US sentiment. And even more so in places like Italy, France, Spain, Greece, etc etc.

Not to mention that during the cold war, most of third world and developing countries were anti-US, from Africa to Asia to Latin America. And they have had very bad experiences from the US military and diplomatic influence to justify them too, from toppling Mossadegh to being in bed with Pinochet, and from the Vietnam war to supporting Death Squads in El Salvador.

So, "most of the world"? I beg to differ.

Actually, there were two sentiments. People digged American popular culture (rock music, folk, blues, movies, books, the activism, etc etc) and disliked American policy and interventions.

I think you need to look at how the American system treated it's own people (well, at least those lucky enough to be born into one of the more well-off segments of society).

I'm no expert on the matter but I would say a general outsiders perception was that internally the American system treated it's own people fairly. They had good rules in place to fight the issues we're seeing now.

What they did to the rest of the world is, of course, another matter altogether.

>I'm no expert on the matter but I would say a general outsiders perception was that internally the American system treated it's own people fairly.

More or less, yes, that's true. People admired the economic affluence of the US and the political stability and rule of law (if they came from corrupt/troubled/colonised/etc countries). Younger people also admired american pop culture.

But all those still hated the US for its foreign policy.

And the more leftist ones, also had a dislike for the rampant capitalism in the US (they sided with worker's unions and such), and a cultural dislike for the emptiness of consumerism (they sided with the beatnicks, the hippies, etc).

In Europe i am hoping that Germany will lead the way. The German people seem to care most about personal freedom. If they can convince the government not to give in to outside pressure to take away more and more liberty it could become not only the economic but also moral leader of Europe.

How did german people,and specifically people who lived in soviet east germany or those close to them, treated online privacy and google/facebook etc, before the NSA scandal ?

> The German people seem to care most about personal freedom

That may be the case, but they still don't manage to get rid of their corrupt CDU/CSU politicians who are also most active in implementing US- and US-friendly policies in Germany.

My belief is that with proper education, people would find out on the long run how governments should behave and what policies should not be tolerated. But for some reason, education is no longer a priority for these governments, I wonder why...

The USA has always had fascist policies since far before Bush, and when the EU and Obama are getting peace prizes it kind of detracts from the idea to be honest.

Respect for individual rights has been under attack for a long, long time in the United States. It didn't start with Bush, and it didn't end with Obama.

Precisely

Even people who didn't ordinarily like the USA were supportive back then. The USA completely ruined all that goodwill.

Heck, done right, that would be way more efficient to prevent further attacks than all the money spend in the NSA.

I had very, very high hopes for Obama. But I guess he too is just a cog in the system. He seems better than Bush, at least.

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