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Comment by up_and_up | Hacker News Reader

> We committed to working a year without salary.

Sounds interesting. Not many of us could do that w/o previous success(s).

> We started in one person's apartment with the understanding we'd get an office in six months. Six months became a year, a year became 18 months, five people became six people...and the guy living there finally said, "Obviously, you guys are not leaving my apartment, so I am." That let us turn the bedroom into our conference room.

Haha, thats hilarious. I wonder how much more productive it would have been to have a more comfortable situation?

EDIT: Care to share why the downvote?

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I ran a 3-founder startup from my apartment for a year before we got an office and I wouldn't recommend it. Because it's your office, you feel that you must be working at all times, and it leads to burnout. We did become more productive after we'd moved.

We ran a 4-5 person startup from our apartment (and had the servers running in the closet) for a year before we got free office space. I had a different experience where we worked longer and faster when we were all in the same room (my roommate and I slept in the back, which was our area and no one could touch). Once we got a little larger and had reasonable funding, we moved out and got a really nice office with the money we'd saved for a year.

From the comfy world of home and car owners it sounds like an expensive proposition, but in reality it's a lot cheaper than a year of college and most of us paid for at least a few of those. You just have to really believe in your cause because there's no magic paper at the end that says the learning you did along the way was worthwhile.

Not sure I agree. I didnt spend 100K for one year of college. I spent more like 15K for four years.

With wife, 3 kids, house etc, taking no salary for year is frankly pretty impossible.

Not sure why I am getting downvoted here? I am voicing my perspective.

Well, assuming you weren't working during those four years, you actually had negative income, rather than no income.

Though of course if you have dependents it's different. Could be either harder, if you are the main money earner, or easier, if your wife makes enough that you can stop getting salary without sacrificing much.

You got a low-cost education not available everywhere in the world at this time

I got an AA degree from Cabrillo College in 2003 for $2000 and then spent only 18 months at UC Berkeley and graduated from there with a BA degree in late 2004. Sure the cost has gone up since then but still..

Vanderbilt paid me to get my Masters.

You need to be careful with using residential property for commercial purposes in most places. Repurposing a property, even though it would require no external changes and no structural internal changes, often requires planning permission and/or a correct license to operate a business. There are exceptions for sole traders, but they'd not count in this case.

Caveat: I'm in the UK. Things may be different the other side of the pond (and may vary by state).

id software used an apartment at one point and was started in a lake house. I think it helped that a lot of the staff actually lived there.

http://romero.smugmug.com/Video-Games/The-Archives/480_GtbLP...

The rag-tag office setup is pretty inspiring.

I'm sure things vary by state, but I think if you're careful, it's something you can easily get away with.

As long as you don't need to have frequent visitors, aren't making tons of noise, and generally make it look like your apartment isn't a makeshift office, I'd probably be more worried about my landlord finding out than the zoning commission.

Is commercial office space substantially more expensive than residential? I could see using a space you're living in as an office, but if the original tenant moved out because the office was infringing on his space/life, is it cheaper to maintain the residential apartment as an office or find proper office space?

Somehow, I don't like the idea of the government telling me how I may use a property I pay good money for, especially if there are no changes and it's just me with a laptop.

Too many laws in too many places. [I know I won't consider the UK now :->]

EDIT: I have heard about this zoning concept, it's just a bad idea IMHO, especially when applied to the modern tech workers. In France, unless you run specific equipment (say heavy machinery) which can create nuisance or risk for the neighbours, or if receive the public (wear and tear being a nuisance in itself), you're quite free. Zoning as in simcity (residential/industry/commercial) is a dated concept. I want to leave near the place I work and where I can find commerces.

In France, there are even special corporate statuses for single entrepreneurs, which especially allow you to do that in case your landlord may tick, and even deduct part of your home expanses as business expanses (say if you are using a room of your 4 bedroom flat, 15% would be reasonable because you'll still use the bathroom and the kitchen more for yourself that for your company, the % amount is left to the appreciation of the tax agents)

That's one of the rare business friendly laws, even if I must say I've been quite surprised by the recent Hollande plan, which for the first time seems to talk sense about business and employment.

The way you use a property affects all properties around it - that's why zoning exists.

Hardly true for any form of knowledge worker. A guy sitting at a desk for twelve hours is unlikely to create nuisance for neighbours

This example was 6 people in one person's residence.

No one complains if you don't cause problems. If you create a nuisance, people complain, and then you get fined/evicted based on the cause of the nuisance, the zoning violation.

6 people in an apartment sized for 4 may be a nuisance.

"Commercial" activity generally refers to customer traffic, not personal work.

In my experience, the thing most likely to cause a problem is going to be the building's management - whether its an apartment, condo, or co-op. With a 2 or 3 low profile people you'll be ok, but good luck trying to get away with actual employees coming in and out all day.

Yup, this was happening in Kendall Sq in Cambridge for awhile until the city quietly asked everyone to move - http://www.boston.com/business/technology/innoeco/2012/04/2_...

2 bd w/ living room apartments were cheaper than office space across the street.

> Not many of us could that w/o previous success(s).

Or other outside support (parents, spouse).

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