Meet Mr. Money Mustache, the man who retired at 30

While many of the examples are silly, I agree very much with all the advice to travel a lot. That takes money. Actually most of the things on that list go way beyond "live cheaply", and I agree with that.

Anyway, as my economics professor said in college. There are those people who plan out how much they must save for an early retirement, and there are those who live.

First of all, the question of retiring is somewhat problematic. Ask the typical person if they could retire right now, what would they do? Doing leisure activities, going on trips, relaxing, etc. can only take one so far. As human beings we need to be productive (no matter how that is defined) for us to lead a healthy life.

I believe the bigger issue is freedom. MMM's approach is very extreme and works for him. I do believe he lives on much more than 25K and works very hard. To him, the work he does might not classify as work. This is freedom for him. He is building a brand and knows how to market his brand.

The big difference I would suggest is that he is absolutely debt-free. American consumerism and lifestyle, to some extent, is driven by credit. Getting a credit card has become a rite of passage.

I like to follow the Dave Ramsey (http://www.daveramsey.com) philosophy (I don't agree with all his advice but most of it is pretty sound). I've just come across Dave over the past year and I find his message and life story inspiring. His message is simple:

1) Get out of debt (goal is to be entirely out of debt - including house). Only acceptable debt is mortgage debt. 2) Cut-up your credit cards (I don't. Having self-control with this is a big part of it) 3) Save 3-6 months emergency fund 4) Invest 15% every year for retirement 5) Save a percentage for Kid's college 5) Buy a house that is within 25-30% of your monthly income 6) Buy cars, boats, etc (ie. toys) that is no more than half of your total income (at most) 7) Invest your money (He's a big believer in mutual funds which I believe ETFs are now a better choice) 8) Most importantly, stay out of debt.

In this way, if you are making 100K a year or more going out for a $200 dinner or a $10K trip is fine since you are out of debt and all the major priorities are covered.

In some sense, MMM's message is the same as Dave's but the difference is that Dave is a multi-millionaire and works just as hard as he did when he wasn't. He has no qualms about going out for dinner and spending $1000 as this puts no dent in his net worth.

I think there is a side-effect to this, where people see what MMM is doing and take his advise to the extremes, failing to full think through their own personal situation. These sort of teachings tend to build some cult-ish/guru-type followings, but I think for the vast majority of people, the messages resonate on some level that allows them to either think about their spending choices more, or cut back.

I see what he ultimately advocates as more of a "think about how you're spending your money" rather than "don't spend money".

He's judgmental about people who want to retire, wish they could save up money, have boatloads of debt, and complain incessantly about how unfair life is when they keep taking on piles of debt making luxury purchases and mismanaging their lives. That's all.

As long as you're happy with your lifestyle choices and either 1. Make enough to be able to retire comfortably when you want to or 2. Won't complain when you're broke and impoverished in the future, then good for you!

Requiring everyone to water down their opinions in order not to offend anyone (usually code for people with mainstream views) is truly offensive. In civil society we can all hold opinions and are able to express them. This is why democracies work so well -- at least better than all the alternatives!

I'm a bit older than the average reader here, so perhaps I'm biased. It seems to me that many people raised in the toxic and simplistic battles between left and right in the US media don't seem to have much of an intuitive sense of civil debate. I think the lack of good examples may be one reason.

In short: People have different opinions. If you don't agree, feel free to speak, but be civil.

Hello my friend! Care to share where?

I'd like to meet with fellow Caribbean entrepreneurs. I'm from Martinique, FWI. We do some good stuff too, yet I thought most of the scene was in T&T or Jamaica. T&C - why no!

http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/07/27/youll-never-be-nor...

http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/07/22/protecting-your-mo...

It seems as if the lifestyle has colored their ability to enjoy things like going out for ice cream, or dinner with friends.

I read another blog, I think it was a different guy, who talked about how he did this by living on 30% of his income and putting away the other 70% and then went on and on about how anyone could do this. Of course, he made about $300k a year. He talked about how even if you make way less than this you can still do it, you just have to be willing to live on 30% of your income. That's easy to say when 30% of your income is more than 100% of most people's income...

I feel with those conditions, his "advice" for retiring early has a huge asterisk.

Even if he had $0 in investment gains he would of been able to do this at 33-35 instead of 30.

Just to scratch my own itch, I've built a finance independence calculator for my daydreaming needs

http://yourdream.io

It's also worth noting that he didn't do this as a single person. A few years in the combined salaries of him and his wife were approaching $200,000.

I am also nomadic, although yet a university student, still making it eventually possible working in an industry capable of earning over $100k per annum. Nothing would change if it was not as prosper.

It's not full time work, but it can take up quite a bit of time in spurts -- especially if you do maintenance and repair work yourself.

I could sell all of my bussiness, I could lease the buildings, and retire. But doing nothing is the hardest work I've ever do. I took a sabatic year after I graduated from college, traveled around the world, fucked some really beautiful girls, and after livining a dream-life, my life became quite frustrating.

This guy wont last too long retired, because, after all, he will just grow tired of playing golf, and doing nothing.

But people are different and I get what you want to say.

http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/01/21/exposed-the-mmm-fa...

But it's also hard to argue with the reality that, if you eschew stupid expenses and live frugally, you can very rapidly build up a very healthy savings. Given that, it's trivially easy to retire by 50 or even 40 for most people; for a software developer (like MMM), it's quite possible to do it by 30.

Honestly, though, I would argue that his plan gives him a sense of false security: no one knows what the economy will look like in ten years, let alone twenty or thirty, and building his retirement on the assumption nothing drastic will change in it or his personal life is folly.

And he spent the first... seven or so years of his working life in some soul-sucking corporation. That's a shit load of time wasted. So his problem?

I'd say it's that he retired too late.

If you take his definition of retirement as "having enough money that you can do what you want to do," all you probably actually have to do is save up 100k-200k, plus or minus a bit. That's because most people want to have some integration into the economy; they just want it on their terms. And integration into the economy means you're getting paid some amount. Given a fluid nest egg to last you a frugal decade or so really gives you all the financial security you need. (Of course, shit can happen, but any shit that can burn through that kind of nest egg is likely to ruin whatever plans you have anyways.)

If you have $200k saved up at this point and no real commitments but have grand plans for how you'll retire sometime in the next five to ten years and then do what you really want to do--teaching, or open source projects that interest you, or traveling around the world as a photographer/blogger--more likely than not you can do it now, within a year. You should. Money will come to you, and there's no reason to put off your dreams.

I don't get why people on here are so negative about it. Don't be bitter because you live in the valley and spend 2k+ a month just for a crappy apartment. It just sounds like this guy values his time more than money. He might not be spoiling his kids with tons of toys or free college, but at least he is there for them. I'll warrant many of the entrepreneurs hackernewsers look up to don't spend nearly as much time with their family as this guy. Their too busy making money as a way to keep score in their "life." This guys just living his life.

I assume they have savings for that, but it doesn't sound like they have any bandwidth for saving. Does it all depend on the market?

Anyway, too risky for me, but good for them.

But it sounds like he's got emergency cover. Plus with his blog he's adding new revenue.

http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/11/01/our-new-237-per-mo...

http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2011/09/21/i-can-never-retire...

There is a rating service that independently tracks the profits of 180 stock newsletters and has done so since 1980. It's called the Hulbert's Financial Digest. From this you can pick one with a good track record, and then invest directly in stocks.

This allows you to plan your taxes much better (sell the losers for a similar company in the same industry and keep the winners). I'm up over 70% in unrealized, and therefore untaxable, gains this way.

That said, everyone has to choose their own acceptable level of risk.

Edit: Plus you can argue that biking all over the place decreases his risk of dying of heart disease or similar later in life, which may balance out or outweigh the risk of dying in a vehicle collision.

I find it somewhat baffling how many financial tools ignore the effects of dividends when calculating returns.

I have a healthy rate of savings, but still decided to buy a new car and finance part of it. I'm happier and safer than I was in my old car, and the rates are pretty good. My V8 gets the same mileage my old 4-cylinder did, and hopefully I helped create some work by buying a model designed & built in Detroit.

So, stop conflating living month to month with having debt. There is a happiness component that doesn't show up in your spreadsheet.

    According to me, retirement means you no longer have to work 
    for money. You then proceed to do whatever you like, without 
    regard for whether or not it earns you money.

For me, I think my satisfaction with life jumps dramatically the more I feel like I have control (shocking, I know).

I got laid off a few years ago an had two months severance. I floated on it, but I think I did more coding and reading, and generally had more productive time than when I was at work.

I'm by no means in the MMM league, but I've had jobs where I couldn't quit if I wanted to, and I hate that. The psychological freedom that comes from knowing I could up and quit if I needed to, even on principle, is so much more satisfying to me than what I could buy with the money I save.

I can imagine knowing I could up and quit... forever.. would be pretty awesome.

Only if you would have spent that hour working instead, and if you would actually earn an extra $50 (net) for working that hour (many people wouldn't), and if that potential hour's work is now lost to you.

It's pretty rare for all three of those things to be full, and most of the people I've ever met who have been in that scenario have learned pretty quickly that working every hour possible isn't really a fun way to spend your life.