‘The Shawshank Redemption’: A Simple But Powerful Message | Hacker News Reader

‘The Shawshank Redemption’: A Simple But Powerful Message

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68 pointsnpguy35 comments

This really seems like reaching.

Or maybe it seems so universally true of protagonists in pretty much any story that it's basically meaningless.

"Startups are hard. They are filled with uncertainty. Just like when Nemo gets lost in the ocean and his father searches far and wide, not knowing if he'll ever see his son again."

There is one huge difference between prison and startup - alternatives you have.

When you are in prison all you can have, if you don't try to escape is a miserable life till the end of your days. On the other hand - after ten years of hard work you can get free. It gives you really big motivation - negative motivation is usually greater than positive.

With startup you have choice between pretty good life (if you are a programmer you can find really nice job) and great success. Motivation is rather small comparing to prison situation.

Having said all this - author still is right - you need to have fun from journey, not only from target.

What a great way to trivialize a classic film. "It's like 'Shawshank Redemption', except at the end people can reserve a table at a restaurant without calling ahead."

Apparently running a startup is just like being imprisoned for life in an institution with rampant routine prisoner rape, abusive and sometimes murderous guards, and a terribly corrupt warden. And here I thought that startup entrepreneurs were fairly well off and had decent lives.

Andy was also falsely accused and wrongly convicted. So he ends up in prison without any recourse. This is the same as starting or joining a startup voluntarily?

Also, don't forget what he had to swim through to reach freedom.

Imagine how nice prison would be if at any moment you could just say "fuck it" and go get a six-figure job with Google or Facebook or whatever.

"If you fail, all your efforts add up to nothing. "

Disagree with this. Even if you fail, you have learnt a lot and you will get another chance to try it. In case of Andy, he probably would not have got another chance. Big difference.

I like The Shawshank Redemption.

But, startups are like digging an escape tunnel for wrongful imprisonment so you can live the life you deserved in the first place, or be placed in solitary confinement if you fail?

No, thanks -- I'll go with another analogy :)

I'm not a huge fan of the lessons drawn here, it feels forced. I think the two key takeaways from Shawshank are 1) "Get busy living, or get busy dying." and 2) "Hope is a dangerous thing, hope can drive a man insane." I see these as complementary, one should simultaneously relentlessly persue one's dreams, startup or otherwise (get busy living) but be aware that those dreams can be dangerous, they can "drive a man insane."

This is a tedious link. I'm sure you could similarly formulate one based on Batman or Predator, if you wanted.

Shawshank's message is "Enjoy the journey"? Andy's "journey" includes rape, beatings, and solitary confinement. I don't see how you can find that message in the movie.

Thank you. I have struggled for years to explain what is so magical about building anything creative. Most people cannot understand. But, your connection to the movie Shawshank is brilliant. This is a movie people get so well. I will probably use this metaphor for years. Thank you!

I am glad you liked the post, and the connection to the movie !

Good points, but I really don't agree with the analogy of Andy's predicament and a startup...

You have no idea how deep the wall is.

Then find out. Google "lean startup", "Eric Ries", "Steve Blank", or "Rob Walling". There is a strong active movement for avoiding exactly this problem. Anyone starting a business should embrace it.

You have nothing but a rock hammer.

Then get more tools. This includes technology, methodology, money, and, of course, people. "Lack of resources" is no longer an acceptable excuse for failing.

You have no idea when you will be caught.

Then find out. Talk to people. Embrace the lean startup approach mentioned above.

But what you do have, is the journey. Enjoy the journey.

Ahh, yes. agreed! You nailed that one.

You got some solid points there, particularly the tools. If there is one place where the analogy fails, it would be the tools part.

Hi Ed - Big fan of your posts.

While I'm also a huge fan of the lean startup methodology, it's still an estimate. You're doing your best to make an educated guess, but you're never really sure if you were correct until years later.

These counterpoints sound swell for trivial activities like developing mobile apps that remind me to walk my dog. What about the guy developing fusion, or rockets to the moon? Or pursuing the minesweeper that is step-by-step scientific discovery. Should we forgo all activities that require serious investment and only take baby-steps to attain the goals we calculate to be the surest and easiest to reach?

Am I the only one who believes that the lean startup movement is a positive for early stage investors at the expense of true innovation and causes founders who would otherwise try tough challenges to try somewhat trivial business ideas?

It seems that the framework is designed to reduce the need for computer engineers to use business thinking and to allow for a few examples of lucky groups to float to the top, raise capital while leaving the vast majority of those who try it with nothing to show for their work.

With the strength of the movement, how many people out there are currently trying "lean startups" only to fail? What do we think the percentage of businesses that get started using this methodology would actually make a profit large enough to support/grow the business at some point in the future?

It seems that the lean startup method serves a purpose in that it helps people try stuff, but it probably is not the right approach for any real challenge.

No. Any significant breakthrough usually represents many man-years of effort spanning years in real-time. Loosely, it's a very applied set of phd research, driven towards a goal which can not be demonstrated true until it is proven true.

I'm sure 'lean startup' is fine for a relatively trivial problem space, and there are many of those bringing much added benefit. I'm equally sure that significant lab equipment for bio/chem/materials firms can't be just 'iterated' through without heavy capital and a long-term plan. :-)

I think we're all in agreement here. Early stage investors benefit from trivial successes by passing along the hot potato down the pyramid.

Sorry! I should have quoted this line:

> Am I the only one who believes that the lean startup movement is a positive for early stage investors at the expense of true innovation and causes founders who would otherwise try tough challenges to try somewhat trivial business ideas?

"No, you're not the only one".

I don't really agree with this analogy. Unless your life is terrible and you have no other employment prospects, you're creating a startup out of ambition, not a strong desire to escape a terrible situation. Presumably you could do fairly well working at another company, unlike Andy, who is doomed to a miserable life unless he risks embarking on this escape plan.

> You can fail at any point in time – in the beginning, in the middle, or at the end – literally on any given day until you are done – and if you fail, all your efforts up to that point add up to nothing

Not necessarily true, we all learn from our mistakes and get experience as we do stuff. But I agree with the spirit of this post.

The analogy is an, obviously, false one. Working at a startup is not binary. There are many benefits and "rewards" earned along the way; pay, experience, contacts to name a few.

Edit: But, yeah, duh, Enjoy the journey. Don't people already know that? I don't see how anyone (in USA) past about 16yr old, unless they are supremely stubborn, could not have learned that from all the fables, parables, koan's, after-school specials, etc. that drive that message home.

The quote in the header[1] is probably misattributed. It likely originated with a sociologist named William Bruce Cameron in the '50s, not with Einstein.[2]

[1] "Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted counts."

[2] http://quoteinvestigator.com/2010/05/26/everything-counts-ei...

Comparing carving through a concrete wall to freedom for 20 years and building a startup in a 4 or 5 months is very humorous and is like comparing apples and oranges. You'd never feel like you completely failed if your startup failed. The new things learned along the way makes it way more rewarding than getting caught with a chisel in hand.

I'd agree, apart from that the "end result is binary".

When you aim to do something big, it's very hard to fail completely.

There's also some danger of being stuck in a state of mediocrity.

I concur--it's a flawed analogy on a couple levels (but still a good conversation stimulator) but I believe one of the hardest things to manage in a start-up is that your success isn't binary.

Yes, there are a great many start-ups that fail to get out of the gate and a small, small number that take off so quickly that success is almost a guarantee. But if you're in the muddy middle the decision to grind it out or try a new approach has to be a difficult one, and is usually a low-data decision. And platitudes are little help here with "it takes three years to create an overnight success" on one side and "fail fast" on the other.

I don't think this is on point. Get busy livin or get busy dyin. THAT, is a powerful message from the movie and is highly relevant. we must not fear failure. Get moving because you won't reach your goals just waiting around

this only makes sense if you're an alien abducted by humans unfairly and now in captive on this crappy earth. And you are devising a scheme to escape from this jail planet by working on your startup.

I don't think there is much to enjoy digging a tunnel with a spoon for 20 years ;)

Get busy livin', or get busy dyin'.

Seems strangely appropriate for a startup.

A fine movie that deserves a spoiler alert when revealing the key plot twist.

You're trying too hard, bro.

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