Silicon Valley is high on innovation. And pot
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I have been to college and have had many great times since then with all sorts of artificial stimulation. To this day, I really look forward to weekends and can't imagine a world without (my drug of choice) beer.
But I have never done any of this while working. No drugs, no alchohol, no medication, just a rare cup of coffee.
I have been programming for 34 years in startups, small businesses, and enterprises. And I'm doing my best work ever right now. And I've done all of it naturally; I don't think I would have made it this long any other way.
If my back or wrists hurt, I get up and move.
If I'm sleepy, I sleep.
If I'm hungry, I eat.
If I can't figure something out, I either knock off or work on something else.
The idea of popping the artificial help cherry has always terrified me. I never wanted to sacrifice my natural soul for the sake of any project. I also have this strange Newtonian belief when it comes to personal energy: "What goes up, must come down." (And never without a price.)
My most important tools are my mind and my body, so they always come first, before any emergency, deadline, or impasse. The crisis du jour will soon be gone, but I'll still be cranking along like the Energizer Bunny.
What I do is a marathon, not a sprint. I want to be doing this for the rest of my life, so natural is really the best way for me to go.
Just something to think about before you reach for <whatever>.
The problem I see is that all the other top marathon runners around me are taking nootropics (adderal etc) to stay in the lead.
Not everyone is born Kenyan. :P
Alcohol gives you a buzz by destroying your brain cells. There are better (and smarter) ways to enjoy yourself.
That's totally incorrect.
Alcohol INCREASES levels of norepinephrine, the neurotransmitter responsible for arousal. Elevated norepinephrine also increase impulsivity.
Alcohol REDUCES activity in the prefrontal cortex and temporal cortex. This is where decision making, rational thought, memory formation, and aggression suppression is managed.
In large amounts it's much harder on your liver than your brain, but in moderation it's fine.
Quite to the contrary. Every living human body continuously produces ethanol (beverage alcohol) 24/7. It's called endogenous ethanol production. Human life does not exist without the presence of alcohol.
Microorganisms in our digestive system constantly convert sugar into carbon dioxide gas and ethanol. The quantity of alcohol produced depends on our diet, but can reach about an ounce of "pure" alcohol per day. That's equivalent to almost two alcoholic drinks: two beers, two glasses of wine, or two shots of whiskey.
Our belief that alcohol is a poison and foreign to our bodies is based in our temperance past. The United States imposed National Prohibition for almost 14 years (1920-1933) and we are currently experiencing significant neo-prohibition sentiment.
Temperance activists disregarded scientific knowledge and, instead, made many clearly absurd assertions...
...
Instead of stigmatizing alcohol and trying to scare people into abstaining, we need to recognize that it is not alcohol itself but rather the misuse of alcohol that is the problem."
From http://www2.potsdam.edu/hansondj/Controversies/Alcohol-A-Dan...
The cook puts down the knife and answered: "What I follow is Tao, Which is beyond all skills.
"When I started butchering, What I saw was nothing but the whole ox. After three years, I no longer saw the whole ox.
"Nowadays, I meet it with my mind Rather than see it with my eyes. My sensory organs are inactive While I direct the mind's movement.
"It goes according to natural laws, Striking apart large gaps, Moving toward large openings, Following its natural structure.
"Even places where tendons attach to bones Give no resistance, Never mind the larger bones!
"A good cook goes through a knife in a year, Because he cuts. An average cook goes through a knife in a month, Because he hacks.
"I have used this knife for nineteen years. It has butchered thousands of oxen, But the blade is still like it's newly sharpened.
"The joints have openings, And the knife's blade has no thickness. Apply this lack of thickness into the openings, And the moving blade swishes through, With room to spare!
"That's why after nineteen years, The blade is still like it's newly sharpened.
"Nevertheless, every time I come across joints, I see its tricky parts, I pay attention and use caution, My vision concentrates, My movement slows down.
"I move the knife very slightly, Whump! It has already separated. The ox doesn't even know it's dead, and falls to the ground like mud.
"I stand holding the knife, And look all around it. The work gives me much satisfaction. I clean the knife and put it away."
The big one is smart drugs - Modafinil/Provigil and Nuvegil. I met a sales rep at a party who told me the bay area was one of the highest selling areas for Modafinil. That is a bit better than anecdotal evidence that there is something there. On top of that I know[0] that a lot of users are importing it from India using online stores.
There are then the pharma stimulants, adderall and ritalin, spread out through the colleges, where usage rates are high. I knew one person who couldn't wait for each years batch of interns to show up at his company because he knew at least some would have a connect to get Adderall.
Then you get the standard illegal class A stimulants, which I don't think are used any more or less in the tech community than in most other communities of similar social-economic standing (that is to say, quiet a bit).
[0] Techcrunch wrote about Modafinil in 2008, I was at TC at the time:
http://techcrunch.com/2008/07/15/how-many-of-our-startup-exe...
There were a lot of interesting follow-up comments and conversations after it was published, least not the intro to the sales exec.
For an average of all Californians, probably true. For an average of the entire country, probably false.
Modafinil, nicotine patches, and other stimulants seemed superior. Modafinil enough that I'd seriously consider getting an Rx at some point -- virtually no downside as far as I could tell. High-dose caffeine and other stimulants had far higher negative effects, and wouldn't be worth it long term.
How many times did you take it? Everyone I know that's taken Modafinil seems to have a similar experience: It appears to do something drastically different the first 1-3 times you take it versus the rest.
Maybe 5 other times (single dose each time) since then (over maybe the past 10 years?).
Based on my experience in the DC metro area, pot use in Silicon Valley is FAR higher than here. Aside from a few friends who smoked in the their teens and early-20s, I don't see it much at all.
Maybe DC is even lower than average because of the high concentration of government jobs (and the accompanying clearance process)?
The fact that so many tech jobs require clearances causes engineers to self-select in or out depending on their temperaments and leanings, as well as curbing the behavior outright.
Compare to California, where it is largely decriminalized and possible to acquire legally and it's no wonder there is a significant difference.
This leads me to conclude that this article is total shit. I honestly can't name a single engineer, designer, or writer I know who regularly smokes pot. Yet this article ends with the following line: "There is a raging culture of marijuana use among tech workers in Silicon Valley."
How this was allowed to be published is beyond me.
Edit: A better story would have been "How Silicon Valley is high on innovation. And Adderall."
Is there really any good reason why I shouldn't be drinking a lot of coffee? It seems I see as many researches claiming I shouldn't drink much coffee as I see researches claiming I should. I'm not sure what to think about coffee at this point.
Then, once that was all out of my system, I noticed that my sleep was different. More calm, somehow.
The last bit convinced me to continue not drinking coffee. I now do perhaps one cup a week, or less.
I worked with a guy, who was literally on his A-game at work (meaning he had absolutely stellar performance, owned his role and pretty much his whole department) and he smoked every single day on the way IN TO the office.
He even used to go and smoke at lunch.
Even recently, working with a client, we sat in a conf room and the conversation turned to how much the staff of my client smoke pot.
And regarding the sibling comment, my caffeine withdrawl is (for me) worse than cannabis withdrawl (ie: nearly non-existent, from smoking daily 2 years -> cold turkey results in a caffeine headache for a few hours on the third day or so and that's about it, minus any sleeping trouble depending on your habits). Plus, really, using in the evenings has zero affect on me at work the next morning other than a weird sense of calmness generally).
edit: For anyone curious, and for full disclosure, it can muck with your falling asleep for a few weeks if you are used to using it in the evenings before bed. Camomile tea, melatonin and increasing exercise in the evening can help clear that up much faster and is probably not that bad of an idea for me anyway.
Long story shorter and more relevant: I've picked up a knack for knowing what "hot topics" I can talk about with certain coworkers or friends (or most of all, family). I certainly err conservatively.
As for HN: I've noticed the same trend here. It seems really mixed and it is kind of enjoyable that people still feel comfortable expressing themselves. Reddit has it's dissenters but most people don't say much beyond "I support legalization" even if they disagree with cannabis usage. I've come into more contact with "pot makes you waste your life" types around here, and I'm okay with that. I don't need anyone to judge me, finding happiness in life is an extreme priority for me, so "haters gonna hate" I guess. (But you'll note that my username here on HN is not attached to my real name in anyway as far as I know).
But more directly to the point, if it were to come up at work, I wouldn't have a problem with admitting to using or conversing about legalization. Via my internship my team knows that they can rely on me and I think my work stands for itself. And most of all, I'm really hopeful that my employer isn't interested in my personal life beyond my work. Frankly, if anything else, I've noticed a shocking amount of presumption that I must have smoked because I'd been to college...
Regular pot smokers have a certain vibe. Not necessarily red eyes, but a way of being very casual and slightly disconnected. If you disagree with me, then think about how you 'just know' when someone is a pot smoker. There are subtle but telling mannerisms.
Which tells me that long-term pot use has an effect on personality.
Very casual and disconnected? Red eyes? Yeah, when I'm high my eyes are incredibly red, but I could be high at 10PM and you wouldn't know at 8:30AM.
You realize you suffer from confirmation bias? You know a spacey stoner and so you think everyone who gets high must be casual and disconnected? Let me guess, I must also be dull, inattentive, absentminded?
There are no universal 'telling mannerisms' of pot smokers. Quite a lot of pot smokers are anything-but-casual, hyper-focused, driven individuals. Not just programmers, but executives, politicians, power brokers, athletes, lawyers, surgeons, and so on.
If you disagree with me, it implies that you don't have significant experience with the industry described in this article. (Not the tech industry. The other one.)
"[...] as none of them ever seemed to talk about having drug experiences [...]"
These are your work colleagues for goodness's sake, when would that sort of thing come up?
My conclusion is based on a large amount of data analyzed over a lengthy period of time.
Yes, yes, I know unproductive pot users. I knew them before they found pot. Pot became their excuse for their largely existing laziness but in most cases it didn't fundamentally change them and "make" them unproductive.
edit: Oh, to make sure we're on the same page, I wouldn't advocate going to work high. I actively avoid being high in social situation, though I do tend to get work done on my side projects even when not 100% sober. But I guess I'd still consider arrogant and inappropriate to go to work high.
The real pot fiends are usually vesting in place or in boring ops/admin jobs at tech companies (uh, Yahoo!), but even at startup parties there is a moderate amount of pot on the weekends.
I mean, of the thousands of drivers I've met in my life, a vanishingly small percentage of them are skillful drivers while drunk -- doesn't mean they don't drink when not driving, though.
Personally, I'm a lot more inclined to light up a doobie when I want to prevent myself from working, and gently force myself to chill out and enjoy the process of making dinner with my wife, or tidying up the garage.
"I have smoked marijuana (and inhaled it, deeply) on more occasions than I can count."
Steve Yegge seems to have been a pot smoker. Most in my circle of friends stopped smoking pot before their finals in university.
Just about anything other than a good night's sleep and a nice glass of water cripples my productivity and turns me in to a zombie, and this wasn't always the case.
I think similarly, people who are anti-gay don't seem to know a lot of gay people, despite the fact that N% of the population are gay.
A classic sativa variety will contain almost nothing except THC, which produces an "up" high on its own. Higher concentrations of CBD and CBN, as commonly found in indica varieties (eg, "kush" in California) and weed that has been harvested too late, cause a more "stoned" effect and sleepiness.
See also: the Priceonomics blog post that was shocked to discover that hippy street kids in Golden Gate Park are pretty content with their lives.
Next up: "Sex Parties? Isn't that dangerous?"
As a random anecdotes, I was an opiate addict (Heroin mainly) for the last six years, while working as an engineer. Not in the Bay area mind you. As weird as it sounds, opiates help(ed) me focus. I was a very functional addict.
Nowadays I'm clean (have been for the past 9 months), well sort of. I'm on suboxone. It still helps me focus, helps with my severe depression, and is legal and literally 50 times cheaper per day.
I have weird brain chemistry however; opiates don't perk most people up. It makes me laser sharp. However, Heroin has so many other negative effects, it's not worth it financially and legally.
I don't suggest others follow my path, it's too dangerous and a consequence of my idiot 16yo self. But I'm doing great nowadays. Just wanted to add my odd anecdote to the pile.
I have considered going back on suboxone, but I found that adderall gives me the same type of effects without being an opiod itself. Adderall does have more negative side effects than suboxone though.
I personally can't stand being high. It gave me minor panic attacks and made me super anti-social. Not my thing, but I'm all for adults making their own decisions. I can't imagine any top tech company ever enforcing an anti-drug policy, especially outside of work.
Can you remark on exactly how much medicine otherwise prescribed for ADHD is abused by people in the valley? Is it 1 out of every 10 employee at Google, for example? Is it mostly concentrated in startup settings?
That said, this article seems to be heavily biased by what is simply local proximity and highly educated clientele.
I never lived in North America but I want to say that if I wanted to get a job and the employer would suggest me to pass a drug test, I would be extremelly offended and my human rights violated, and I'll tell them to eff off right away.
It's just so humiliating in my opinion.
I'm a software developer not an airplane pilot.
Not in programming or consulting, thank deus. I'd tell a prospective employer to take a flying fuck at the sun if they tried that shit with me.
Drug tests are an effective filter to ensure you have a compliant work force.
Very few people care anymore around here, and those who do more or less know not to step into the debate. I almost beg interviewers to ask me so I can just say "sure, I can take that test but I'll fail it. Is that a problem?"
I doubt many would tell me to walk, except Big Blue and the most old fashioned of firms, and I'm not even that talented.
But pot remains a primary tool in my toolbox for tackling difficult programming challenges.
Programmer's Fuel
If you want to do it fine, I don't do it, but I'm ok with people doing it.
I'm even ok with decriminalizing it.
But don't pretend it's for your wrist pain.
Edit: What about this map "proving" dispensaries are mixed with their "customers". A simple machine learning algo can split the two and point some outliners there...
I don't think people would pretend it's for physical pain if it were simply legal.
Yeah, this is a real dilemma. I'm moving soon to somewhere where I could get a medical card. I feel guilty about wanting to get a card because if I were to use it less than 100% medically, it could give people fuel to ban it for ALL, including those with debilitating pain.
someone might want it for that reason, and not want a medical card, just to not be in some database. not saying this is a good reason or not, just stating a fact.
Then let's pass laws so people don't have to pretend.
There's people near Capitol Hill that would rather that didn't happen.
Public indoor smoking's been recently banned in Spain and, oh boy, did that mess up the nightclubs' revenue.
I for one prefer alcohol regardless. Beer is more for me than a means to an altered state of mind.
* "scroll blocking" JS execution on first pageview * jump back up after all JS was loaded
for me it's unbelievable that we finally have really, really, really powerful JS engines in our browsers, and all we can think of is to make the UX experience of users who want simple things (like reading an article) worse.
So, uh, it's a great article, albeit a little short…
Cigarette smoke is bad. Stale cigarette smoke is worse. Cheap cigar smoke is disgustingly awful.
But pot smoke? It's not especially bad, and it's not especially strong. Very distinct, but on the scale of offensiveness fairly low.
Maybe you've been around people smoking with cheap tobacco blunt wraps? I dunno.
I've been in tech for 20 years now and never came across anybody on pot or any other drugs for that matter. Maybe I'm living in some kind of bubble or something, but my reaction to the above comment is that he's got a drug problem in his company.
Is this really a common problem?
On a side note, drugs are for drug dealers and losers. Only one benefits.
So I take it you don't drink alcohol or use caffeine?
I doubt anyone in the modern age can claim they have never used drugs before. Most of the OTC drugs at the pharmacy can be more damaging to your health than alcohol. The only people who can probably claim to be drug free are those who claim to heal with prayer.
- Drugs Are Bad Mmkay(tm)
- I don't need no 'scientists' to do 'studies,' because everyone knows that Drugs Are Bad Mmkay(tm).
- Since Drugs Are Bad Mmkay(tm), I can't allow a drug to go down in the rankings, only up!
- If a drug were to go down in the rankings, it would be political suicide. Political/religious/etc opportunists would come out of the wood-work to ply their silver tongues and attempt to get the general public to tar-and-feather those responsible (while benefiting the opportunists immensely, of course). - Even if I wanted to allow a drug to go down in the rankings, it would be political suicide
I'm fine with the legalization of marijuana, but as an appeal to authority, that one gave me a chuckle.
Right at the bottom, too, so you don't know it's there.
I'm sure none of those people smoke trees, though.