Personal Analytics for Facebook | Hacker News Reader

Personal Analytics for Facebook

blog.wolframalpha.com

25 pointssparshgupta23 comments

If you can edit the title, it'd be better as "Wolfram Alpha updates their Personal Analytics for Facebook" or something since it is indeed an update and not totally new.

Agreed.

Unfortunately I don't think I can.

No worries, thanks for posting it so quickly!

This looks like fun. I'm totally cool with them having my data. Just give me pretty graphs. :)

Is there any plans on setting it up so you only do analysis for a certain time frame? Who are my top comments in the past year vs all time?

Yes! We call it Historical Analytics. We're waiting till the next release to enable the visualizations, but you can start collecting data now by enabling it.

Does it save all my fb info on Wolfram Alpha's server or run the analysis every time ?

I feel like this is a question I ask myself with every FB app I "connect" with. You never really know what they're actually doing with your data unless you read all their policies and that's just what they _say_ they're going to do.

Well, I gave it a try with a temp id. The analytics is impressive. But, I am pretty concerned abt privacy despite their claim of not storing any personally identifiable info.

You are worried about privacy yet use FB?

Only time it saves anything is if you enable Historical Analytics. http://www.wolframalpha.com/fbfaqs.html

"When do you access my Facebook profile?

We only access your Facebook profile when you use Wolfram|Alpha Personal Analytics for Facebook, unless you have enabled Historical Analytics, in which case we will access your profile periodically. Your data is securely stored on our servers and is protected by industry-standard encryption. Your profile is only accessible to you, through Wolfram|Alpha Personal Analytics for Facebook."

It used to be that, in order to get access to someone's rolodex, you'd have to befriend them and do a ton of things with them to maintain that said friendship. And even then, you still had to go through them to take advantage of that rolodex of connections, where they would keep rough tabs on who you were and how often you took advantage of these connections, so that they could come back to you when they need to take advantage of your connections in turn.

Looks like these days, someone like Wolfram can get full access for the price of a few cute graphs.

At least, the data that the egomaniacal Wolfram gets his hands on is limited to those people who are easily fooled by shiny gifs.

Unless you enable Historical Analytics, we delete your data after one hour.

http://www.wolframalpha.com/fbfaqs.html

"I’m concerned about the privacy of my account information. What is done with my Facebook data?

We value the trust that our users put in us, and are committed to maintaining the highest standards of privacy protection.

In order to do analysis on your Facebook data, it is necessary to cache it temporarily on our servers. We acquire the data through the Wolfram Connection app using the Facebook API, respecting whatever privacy settings you and your friends have given to Facebook. Our system is set up to cache your data on our servers for one hour, which allows you to perform queries efficiently. The default behavior is to delete personally identifiable data after one hour."

Schooled by the Alpha Wolfram.

Great, then you can respond to some observations and answer some questions:

1. Your FAQ is at odds with your privacy policy (http://www.wolframalpha.com/privacypolicy.html) which states that you can collect and retain Personally Identifying Information. How do you explain the discrepancy?

2. In a conflict between a "FAQ" and Privacy Policy, which one is the officially binding document? Why should I entrust my data to comments made by a pseudonymous user or to something that is called a FAQ?

3. Your privacy policy is subject to change without notice. How can I be assured of any guarantee given that you have this blanket clause? Why would you not offer your users to opt out of any changes that weaken their privacy?

Please back up your responses with URLs to legally binding documents that provide strong guarantees we can rely on.

Thanks.

Alternative strategy: don't use it.

I'd be delighted to answer your questions:

1. I don't believe that the two documents are in conflict. Our privacy policy states:

"When you use any Wolfram|Alpha application associated with a Third-Party Site ("TPS"), including but not limited to social networking sites such as Facebook, we may collect personally identifiable information about you from the profile you have established at the TPS."

When you use Wolfram|Alpha Personal Analytics for Facebook, we do access your Facebook data, which you have to authorize through Facebook. That data does contain personally identifiable information. That isn't in conflict with the FAQ. The FAQ states (apologies if this is repetitive):

"In order to do analysis on your Facebook data, it is necessary to cache it temporarily on our servers. We acquire the data through the Wolfram Connection app using the Facebook API, respecting whatever privacy settings you and your friends have given to Facebook. Our system is set up to cache your data on our servers for one hour, which allows you to perform queries efficiently. The default behavior is to delete personally identifiable data after one hour."

We do collect personally identifiable data from Facebook, but we don't save this data for more than an hour (unless you specifically enable Historical Analytics which tracks changes to your Facebook over time).

2. There shouldn't be any conflict between the FAQ and the Privacy Policy, the FAQ is specific to Wolfram|Alpha Personal Analytics for Facebook whereas the Privacy Policy is global to all of Wolfram|Alpha. As far as my being pseudonymous, my name is John Burnham and the above link is to my blog post. Send me an email at johnb@wolfram.com if you like.

3. & 4. Yes, the privacy policy is subject to change, which is standard for many TOS's. I'd like to point out though, that our Privacy Policy also states at the bottom of the page that we haven't changed it since March 2009. If we do change it, you can refresh the page at any time and check the bottom of the page for the date of previous change. What's currently on the web is the current legal document.

Links: FAQ http://www.wolframalpha.com/fbfaqs.html Privacy Policy http://www.wolframalpha.com/privacypolicy.html

These is non-responsive PR:

1. The PP explicitly says that Wolfram can collect and retain data indefinitely. The FAQ promises a horizon of 1 hour. 1 != ∞. Which of these documents is to be believed? Which of them constitutes a legally binding document?

2. I don't want reassurance from some Joe Random Shmoe. Your users have a relationship with Wolfram LLC (or whatever the legal entity is). So any meaningful guarantee needs to come from that entity. But until now, Wolfram has only provided weasel wording and cagey language. I appreciate you sharing your name, but then again you have a product to peddle, and we both know that nothing you say here is legally binding for Wolfram, so you could say anything.

3 & 4. PP provides no meaningful long-term guarantee. Saying that this is standard for many in the industry is a cop out. If your company is really committed to these principles of privacy you espouse and claim here in this forum, it certainly has the legal staff to get it written into those two documents to which you linked.

Time to get your principles in your legal documents. It's duplicitous to claim the high road while peddling agreements that sign away so much PII to Wolfram.

1. Two different meanings of data: connecting your Facebook account to your Wolfram ID, which is necessary to do the analytics, is by definition PPI (your Facebook account IS your name and email address). That's why the privacy policy says that.

However, the actual data retrieved from your Facebook profile (wallposts, friend lists, etc) is deleted after 1 hour -- unless you enable Historical Analytics, obviously.

There is no contradiction here.

2. This question is phrased in such an insulting way I can't imagine you aren't deliberately trolling.

3&4. We've been quite upfront about what we do with your data. All your Facebook data goes away unless you opt in to Historical Analytics. Otherwise there is no PII derived from your Facebook data that we keep. You can disable Historical Analytics at any time, and you can disassociate your Facebook account from your Wolfram ID at any time, too.

To sum up: we've taken the high road from the beginning. Unlike many FB-based businesses, users aren't the product here, they're the customers.

Have a nice day.

Yes, we all follow what you have said, but I see no guarantees offered by Wolfram, the service provider. You can pretend to be offended and avoid the question, but at the end of the day, the assurance you are trying to provide here is not legally binding and you know it. If you really believe in your last paragraph, why don't you have the Wolfram legal staff put these guarantees in writing, into the ToS and Privacy Policy?

At $600/hour for a lawyer and 30 minutes of their time to add a sentence or two, it'll cost $300 to make the changes. That's well under however much your time cost to make unbacked assurances online. And at the end of the day, your service and your users will be better off for it.

I understand that there are people in the world who have to hide their private data for fear of gov't persecution or extreme judgement from family and their peers.

That's not the case for me, my Facebook data is useless. If they kept it, it wouldn't harm me in any way. It's not super secret, or very interesting stuff. So why not give it to them to visualize in an interesting way?

I do completely agree here. I don't know why people prefer hiding their email IDs and friends lists, comments they have made and things they liked. Having said that, I might have to make my privacy settings more strong if the Facebook Graph Search turns something like http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5100679

Reply on news.ycombinator.com