Apple's "Clean Design" Is Stupidity When It Comes to Hiding Fire Extinguishers | Hacker News Reader

Apple's "Clean Design" Is Stupidity When It Comes to Hiding Fire Extinguishers

gadgetreview.com

76 pointsjosephcsible31 comments

Weird writing:

1. “Reportedly, an Apple retail or office installation has been circulating” - but they then include a tweet as their apparent source that explicitly says it’s the 5th Ave store. So why say it might be an Apple office instead?

2. Maybe they are so wishy-washy about it because they aren’t confident it’s real, but if that’s the case, then writing a lengthy article calling something “stupidity” that you can’t even confidently state occurred…

3. “Reportedly, an Apple retail or office installation has been circulating” has a hyperlink across multiple words so you’d think it would be their source, but no it’s to the Apple homepage.

It’s a LLM generated article, and from the sentence style, I think a GPT. It looks like it’s been put through a “humaniser” or had less copy editing.

Just about all of gadgetreview.com is LLM writing these days.

This article is just a popular tweet that has been converted in to an ad filled article. Probably all done by AI.

For all we know even the original video from the tweet is ai generated.

> putting occupants at risk in seconds

Yeah, uh, I totally agree with you and won't be reading the rest.

dont you just love being an occupant

The "Steve Jobs" movie features a made-up subplot about Jobs insisting that the Fire Exit Safety signs be turned off to achieve "absolute blackout" in a theater. They very reasonably point out that no fire Marshall would approve it. I'm surprised for that reason, especially in midtown Manhattan. I've seen a fire marshall do a full inspection of a Broadway show and they were very thorough. This store is just a few blocks from there.

Let’s face it, the flat UI is stupidity when it comes to anything. This is not an issue exclusive to fire extinguishers.

https://www.nngroup.com/articles/flat-design/

I wonder if this could have been made trivially compliant by using a transparent window with a sticker, like they do for AED machines.

It doesn't even have to be transparent! (I think.) Big red "FIRE" letters and either a visible handle to open or very obvious instructions would probably be acceptable.

Maybe I'm misremembering, but do most luxury stores have fire extinguishers visible to customers (as opposed to staff)? I don't remember seeing them

I don't recall Coach bags catching fire[1] though.

[1]: https://appleinsider.com/articles/18/01/09/iphone-battery-fi...

I wonder if fire safety code (either in NYC, NY State, or nationally) has caught up with some sort of specific regulation for additional fire safety when you have N amount of watt-hours of lithium ion battery storage contained in X amount of square feet of retail space with Y type of fire suppression/detection systems. The same general concept as why you can't take above a 99Wh battery on an airplane as an individual unit, but extended to something like the Apple Store or the laptop display section in a Best Buy.

The closest thing I've seen is a big push from the NYC government to get people to stop charging their sketchy ebike/scooter battery packs indoors in hallways and apartments, which has caused more than a few fires.

https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=nyc+ebike...

They don't use fire extinguishers for lithium battery fires though (as the article mentioned: submerging it in special sand).

I wonder if it would actually be a negative if a member of the public grabbed a visible extinguisher during a battery fire?

Usually luxury stores have sprinkler protection, availability of fire hose reels, etc.

In Australia this would not comply with our fire code. Putting it behind a cabinet is fine; but it must have visible signs that can be seen from 20m away with a 20/20 eyesight (assuming no obstruction etc).

This applies to all portable extinguishers; even if it’s additional ones you’ve added beyond what’s required. The idea and intent is simple: train people and first responders to locate portable fire extinguishers by the sign.

The article explains precisely how I feel about MacOS

Reminds me of tesla.

No turn signal stalks, instead rotating buttons on the steering wheel. No PRND stalks either. Critical controls hidden on touchscreen behind look-then-swipe nonsense.

Also funny is the same nonsense apple has done between mouse scroll wheel movement direction and "natural" touchpad direction. Tesla's old PRND stalk was down for forward, up for reverse. New cars have touchscreen only gear select, and it is UP for forward, DOWN for reverse.

I kind of like the touchpad scrolling nonsense..

Tesla’s designs and software updates though are why I’ll probably never own one of their vehicles.

They need to add a touchscreen and menu to access the fire extinguisher, probably with auto-subscription. Then all will be well.

Confirmation dialog pops up on your iPhone, you allow it, it sends you a code to enter.

No no. IPhone will "just work". Only Android needs the code to enter

Passive-voice "reportedly" accusations; as the article itself admits, there's no evidence at all that Apple did this. So this would appear to be completely unsupported clickbait.

This is a shitty AI slop article that even admits it has no evidence this is even real:

No official Apple statement, architectural document, or verified primary image has surfaced to confirm the specifics. No such source was identified in the research reviewed for this article.

What the circulating example does clarify, regardless of its origin, is a pattern worth examining. Brand loyalty can short-circuit critical thinking fast enough to make observers praise a design choice before asking whether it actually works under pressure.

That looks like a picture taken from a mall, outside of an Apple Store.

So, let’s not blame Apple here. Let’s blame the mall for doing something really stupid.

No, that's the interior of the Apple Store on Fifth Avenue, the one that's a glass cube on top.

In case you disagree compare https://www.apple.com/cf/newsroom/2019/09/apple-fifth-avenue...

I think this is everything right about Apple. There is zero chance the building is not up to code, at least within the context of some exception granted to them by the city. Their extremely numerous number of employees are likely well trained on what to do during a fire, including where the extinguishers are. I can think of no stores I'd rather be in, if there's a fire, than that Apple Store. But, it makes nerds angry; they're more interested in the process than the outcomes.

> I can think of no stores I'd rather be in, if there's a fire, than that Apple Store.

How about a fire extinguisher store?

Or anywhere without so many lithium batteries.

This is correct. I actually visit Apple stores because the conduct of their employees reinforces the culture of voluntary safety that I've come to expect from society. Exposing these gaudy red extinguishers only causes customers to feel unsafe and resent safety instead of accepting it. Anyone that wants to display even a single extinguisher is obsessing over their own insecurities and tearing down the safety ecosystem we trust our lives with. Blatant nerd quackery.

When I can see the extinguishers in the store, that's when I'll know Apple has finally gone downhill. If you're reading this Ternus, don't stop fighting.

I agree there’s zero chance of written documentation that the building isn’t up to code.

That’s very different to it actually complying with code however. And to your second example, if I was physically attending WWDC back when they did they keynotes, I’d much rather seeing illuminated exit signs than having them (illegally) turn them off in case of a fire.

Much of building codes is either outdated, no longer the most effective way to achieve something, etc. But these building codes are written in blood. It’s why we have them.

Do that all you want in your personal house, but public spaces and even private workplaces with employees other than yourself rightfully should adhere to standards that apply the same everywhere so that any person has a reasonable chance to succeed at the crucial task in an unplanned emergency.

"My emergency response plan is there will always be a trained employee." is exactly as stupid as "My emergency response plan is there will never be an emergency."

Soooo, what if a non-trained non-employee needs to put out a fire in an emergency?

Reply on news.ycombinator.com