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Comment by Barrin92 | Hacker News Reader

I'm proud to live in the EU because for all its faults we have one thing going for us, we seem to be the only large institution that countries still want to voluntarily join, and can voluntarily leave.

In a world in which the other great powers revive the Monroe Doctrine or threaten their magnitude smaller neighbors with annexation we're not doing so badly. There is an inherent pettiness, weakness and fake strength in autocracy and force and it's often why I think the EU receives so much disproportionate hate.

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>we seem to be the only large institution that countries still want to voluntarily join, and can voluntarily leave.

Really? Because there's this organisation called CUSMA that nations can voluntarily leave (the US) and some want to stay in (Canada).

It's economy is larger than the EU btw.

CUSMA is just a trade deal, not a full-on organization like the EU.

If we're doing a trade deal measuring contest, I will just point out that the EU has the world's largest free trade network, including Canada (already), South Korea, most of Latin America, India etc etc.

The UK left, Iceland just voted not to join.

The EU does not have a military to annex any neighbours with. Individual states do, but non are really great powers any more.

> The UK left

Yes, you can read all about how that came about, and how it's going.

> The EU does not have a military to annex any neighbours with. Individual states do, but non are really great powers any more.

You're projecting an American ideal. Not all nations are--nor want to be--America, and we're thankful for that.

> Yes, you can read all about how that came about, and how it's going.

Yes, it seems to have made no difference. economically - economy performing much the same as France and Germany. Lots of lives saved by the faster covid vaccine rollout which is a plus IMO.

> You're projecting an American ideal. Not all nations are--nor want to be--America, and we're thankful for that.

You are missing my point. Not annexing anyone when its not an option because you cannot does not prove anything.

I have never even been to America - why would I project an American ideal?

edit: removed, didn’t properly read the context

> Do you seriously consider invasion of other countries a good thing

No, of course not. I really do not understand how you interpreted what I said as saying taht.

Can people please read what I said in the context of the comment i replied to!

Sorry, corrected

Brexit has caused an estimated ~6-8% per capita loss of output: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyv0m164m84o

"Annexing neighbour" is clearly a non-goal of the EU. One of the reason of its existence is to put an end to european countries invading each others all the time.

Do you really think the USA could annex anything but (maybe) Cuba, after seeing how the Iran war is playing out?

Iceland said no because they are afraid of overfishing in their water.

It isn't an unreasonable fear, especially given their dependance on that food source. Their "No" was perfectly reasonnable from what I can see.

Britain's "Leave" campain was drowning in lies, exageration, and british-empire nostalgia.

Those two situations are very different.

>The UK left, Iceland just voted not to join.

I don't know if you even made it to the end of the first sentence I wrote, but the fact that the UK could leave and is treated with respect, the fact that Iceland, a country of four hundred thousand people, which we could but will never threaten either economically or militarily, can decide their own future is a strength of the union.

We do not coerce our neighbors, no matter how small.

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