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Comment by dpacmittal | Hacker News Reader

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Please don't take HN threads into nationalistic flamewars, regardless of which nation you're for or against. It's not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

I'm not looking forward to it, them being strapped for resources provides a huge incentive to develop and release these smaller models. Even if they'd still release their models once they are able to comfortably service all potential customers via their cloud, running them locally would be almost impossible due to their size.

Chinese are pretty pragmatic. Even if they produce more expensive chips and memory, they are still going to focus on value. But who knows, maybe India will step up again like they did for Y2K 3 decades ago.

Unfortunately, India's focus is on everything but models. Hope I am wrong but the VCs there are now very risk free and are only investing in Snacks, Beauty and similar companies making risk free money due to growing income of population.

All the good talent moved to other countries due to this.

I agree. A meeting transcript posted recently from DeepSeek's founder suggests they're going to reach for larger models as soon as they can, and not look back. The model is already bigger than my machine can handle, though (I cannot put up with 25 t/s after getting used to over 100), so I'm not impacted.

Personally I'm hoping for EU to step up a bit

Seems incredibly unlikely, doesn't it? (I hope for the same thing but it feels almost like wishful thinking!)

Sorry we a focusing on leather handbags there.

The leather bag designs are shipped from Paris or Milan to China for production.

But some worker in Italy bolts on a zipper in the end so it’s actually Italian, believe it or not.

That worker is also Chinese, but in Milano.

It depends on the bags. I know people who work in handbags production, in France.

EU is out of game and can't be back anytime soon.

We'll make sure there will be enough regulations to have neither the electricity to power it or the companies to build it.

Well quite a few nuclear powerplants have had to shut down recently due to droughts... So we are well on the way for that!

1970s design.

Personally I don't. Wasting enormous amounts of resources on a technology that doesn't make money, can easily be copied, and eats up everyone's energy while at the same time can be downloaded over the internet is kind of stupid.

The fact that China could catch up in what, two years, shows that this is a commodity.

A fantastically useful commodity that resists monopoly is the best outcome.

The EU is not a state or some federation. It's like a NAFTA+ It unfortunately doesn't have the risk averse VC system (or pragmatic state driven like China) ecosystem to support the scaling required.

But if models will be commodities, maybe that won't be such a terrible thing longterm?

How about we hope for Chinese labs to continue pushing forward - and for America and the rest of the world to do so as well.

It needn't be competitive - everybody can succeed more tomorrow than they are today. You win. I win. We win.

Good luck when the last non-Chinese frontier labs will have closed and the CCP will ask to stop sharing models open source.

We'll never have fewer open-weight models than exist now. They won't suddenly disappear when labs stop publishing new ones. In fact, people will keep improving them and will keep distilling new frontier models into existing open-weight models.

My conspiracy theory is that this is the new space race, and the CCP encourages this to show the world what Chinese engineers are capable of, and tank the Anthropic/OpenAI valuation bubble as a desirable side effect.

Half of the engineers at OAI and Anthropic are Asian, I don't think China does all these for signaling.

What an odd thing to say

I was not trying to make that kind of argument, but rather a geopolitical one.

Retaining world-class talent and home-growing industries is no small feat. In Europe, we have been struggling with this, and I am not even entirely sure why.

A lot of world-class talent do not want to pay 50-60% taxes, so they move somewhere else. Not everyone, I'm just saying, it was a genuine consideration for me.

Oh no, 1kkk market country with top-tier research labs developing its own technology, must be evil!

Well, no, they're not aligned with our interests therefore we're concerned with their mastery here. You have the clause the wrong way around.

This will never happen btw.

Then non-Chinese labs can reopen, or they could offer lower prices right now not waiting for this event.

But imagine if Chinese labs would lose. Then there will be no open models, and the prices for closed models would be raised to the maximum.

As opposed to closed source American models where the federal government threatens your livelihood unless you build data centers to extend pax silica?

:-(

You're clearly not an American and they will never catch up on hardware. I'm mostly curious why you are so excited for China to "crush" American companies?

Incursions into other nations "just because"? Economic wars, and support for foreign governments or armed groups that caused harm or instability to the entire planet? You know? Planet Earth?

Sanctions and trade policies that hurt ordinary people? Cultural dominance through Hollywood (Holy Wood, again with the sick ruling elite and their witchcraft crap), social media, brands, the poisoning of food and water on global scale?

Etc? Etc?

Most people don't hate "Americans" or their companies, they are just against your ruling elite. Live one day outside the united states and understand how the planet works for the rest of mankind and you might start to grasp on reality.

And yeah, China will catch up with hardware pretty damn soon. Jesus, you guys bought your radios from Japan not 50 years ago. Sorry, can't dominate the world's economy forever. Never happened in history.

No matter how much black magic, dark rituals, sick crap and sacrifices people on the top throws at the wall.

We're humans, after all.

So yeah, it is not against America itself or American companies, but against the ruling class. So naturally , people get excited about China entering into the match!

3...2...1... Fight!

Come on. You can say all that nonsense about almost any other country.

Most everyone wants to come to America for the opportunity. Think an immigrant in China has the same economic opportunity as in America? Any other country come to mind?

American ultracapitalism seems to be approaching its final stages. That end can’t come quickly enough. If China helps speed it along, that’s a good thing for all of humanity.

> seems to be approaching its final stages

Sure, if you spend most your time on the internet in various news forums its doom and gloom. Its what sells.

The imperial hubris need to be humbled sometime

Yes agreed that is how the world turns but given the state of world I don't see it happening in any of our lifetimes.

Never?… Ha Ha Ha

Right. I misspoke. Should have said not in our lifetime.

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