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Comment by flumpcakes | Hacker News Reader

I think DHH's opinion is a very common sentiment in Europe. "Gypsies" are a very European thing. I wonder if there's anything similar in the US? For context for US readers; they generally exist outside of the usual social norms, and have a pretty bad reputation because of it.

This is not a defence of DHH, just providing context to his comments.

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There isn't really a direct point of comparison in the US, because by and large the US is much more loosely attached to the concept of having a specific "Our culture" that others are expected to assimilate to. Rather, US culture is more of an admixture of whoever happens to be in an area. That isn't to say that it's all peaches and roses, but our racism tends towards "this group is intrinsically worse than mine" rather than "this group is trying to conquer our homeland".

This plays out with things like US culture being pretty well tolerant of ethnic enclaves (Chinatowns, Little Italies, Solvang, etc) compared to what I've seen in my travels abroad, while preferring to bulldoze those enclaves when a new freeway needs to be built, and foods emblematic of certain areas being Flanderized versions of various foreign cuisines (Take a look at California's burritos, or a Chicago style pizza, or a New York style pizza).

As if the social norms only flow one way (gypsies excluding themselves) and not the other way (white Europeans excluding them).

There are in a lot of EU countries sets of laws to integrate gypsies, but it's a hard problem, e.g. schooling kids who move town every three months.

I think the gypsies he's referring to might be a particular set of organised beggar gangs exploiting gypsies from Romania, Bulgaria and generally central Europe in European cities since the early 2000s, and not the usual seasonal workers from these and other gypsy communities. But I haven't been to Copenhagen in a while.

I don't understand your comment - the social norms I refer to are paying tax, sending your children to school, integrating with the local community, living in areas/accommodation that is legal/not transitory. It can be argued how many of those are valid criticisms, but that is what generally refer to.

His opinion that their behavior is undesirable and should be dealt with is common.

His comparison to them as wolf-like predators (and you shoot wolves), previous posts about mass deportation and forced remigration ... no, most Europeans aren't veering strongly into hard-right territory.

I cannot speak for all of Europe, since I have no idea what rules are elsewhere. But in Sweden in the municipality I live in, they have banned begging in public areas. And the ones who are begging in public areas in Sweden are predominantly gypsies. There are a few municipalities in Sweden that have banned begging in public areas, while most still allow it. E.g. in the capital Stockholm it's allowed, and you may see gypsies sitting at shopping streets, at the central station and outside stores.

Just wanted to share that there are areas where people have gotten tired of gypsies, and have gotten rid of most of them in this way, as some extra context.

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