The Five NYC Taxi Drivers who Refused My Fare

This is a common tourist mistake. Flag the taxi, and then get in the car, say hello, then tell the driver where you are going. Only tourists think they need permission to get in the car, and so the drivers will refuse them. Tourists also tend to request unprofitable routes, like going 15 blocks in Times Square.

They are allowed to turn the off-duty light on, and to get one final fare going their return direction at the end of their shift. This rule is coming to an end because the GPS logs have proven that the drivers abuse this rule extensively.

New York has a solution for this. It's called a livery car (they're usually Lincoln Town Cars). This is especially prudent when you have a flight to catch.

You call and they send someone at the appointed time.

It's cheaper than Uber and the drivers are the same.

Some have phone numbers you'll never forget: (212) 777-7777 and 866-666-6666.

Hacker News: Criticizes cab companies for using laws to keep Uber out, then criticizes cabbies for not following the letter of the law with respect to unprofitable fares.

Which is it: Do we celebrate breaking laws? Complying with them? Or do we pick and choose the laws we respect?

It is illegal for taxi drivers to refuse your fare depending on your destination. If their "Off Duty" light is not lit, just get in, then say your destination. If they protest, say you'll call 311 (and start taking a picture of their license).

If the "Off Duty" light is on, just wave them on no matter where you're going.

I'm not entirely sure how Taxi's work in big cities, from my interaction with them I think they work based on the idea that there's always going to be x number of people in need of cabs in any area so driving around looking for patrons provides value to both people looking for a cab (cabs everywhere!) and value to the cabs (people everywhere!).

If a company like Uber takes off and eventually the uber model is delivering 50% of taxi rides, won't that harm the traditional cab market (less patrons) and in turn harm the customer experience (harder to find a taxi wherever you are) therefore requiring people to use the uber model? For example right now you could get an Uber ride in an available city easily, or you could get a traditional cab. If Uber took 80% of the market wouldn't that force you to use Uber?

Just thinking out loud and may be misunderstanding how it all works, but if my thinking is along the right lines it seems there are genuine downsides to the Uber model taking the largest market share beyond just "current taxi drivers will have to change how they work".

1) The author of this post is wrong when he assumes that the driver's refused his fare solely because JFK is a location that is "out of the way". There are indeed set shift changes that the large majority of cabs in NYC adhere to, and when they do change shift they leave their "off-duty" lights on and try to get one more fare on their way back to the depot/home at the end of their shift. I don't know how many times I've been refused by a string of taxis at the shift change because I'm going in the wrong direction, even though my route is normally one with the best profit margins for them.

2) To those suggesting you get in the cab before you state your destination, the cabs that do this already know that it is harder to refuse you once you get in the cab. That is why they will leave the doors locked, roll down their window, and only partially position themselves in the stopping lane.... They are ready to veer off very quickly. When it is raining outside and you are desperately trying to catch a cab you are going to comply with this routine.

3) Also, if you do manage to enter the cab and tell them a destination that is out of the way of their return journey, they have no qualms in telling you to get out.

EDIT: I'd also like to add that Uber hasn't really brought anything new to New York other than a smartphone app. Town car services in New York City are more than plentiful and no less reliable when you call them up than when you request one through Uber. In my my experience, the town car companies I have used over the past decade have been much more reliable and quicker to service me than the few times I've tested out Uber's service. I wouldn't call Uber a disruptive service in the NYC ecosystem, just a complementary channel for requesting private town cars.

It does make me think though, why should these town car services even cut Uber into the loop? Maybe there is space for some type of PAAS for town car companies to roll out their own web and mobile based booking system?

Most people commenting here about how he should stop whining and suggesting he should get in the taxi before telling the driver his destination are missing the point.

Uber provides a better experience than taxis. If it didn't there wouldn't be any demand and you wouldn't see posts like this on a regular basis. The taxi industry needs to improve their service, or stop attempting to outlaw the competition and STFU.

As documented in Mike Grynbaum's NY Times article, the five taxis probably weren't lying about the shift change.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/12/nyregion/12taxi.html

It seems irrational at first, but changing shifts at the same time makes drivers and cars more interchangeable. More importantly, it makes day-shift vs. night-shift approximately equal in profit opportunity. It's a shame the shift changes coincide with after-work rush hour and a popular time for night life to wind down.

You have to get inside the cab before you tell them where you're going, they are legally required to take you once you are inside

I hate his pretentious tone. The Uber drivers do what they do not because they are more respectful, but because you are paying out of our ass for it. You really think they like pulling around people if they could do something else?

Anecdotally, having lived in NYC for a few years now, the shift change thing is real. Some time periods are just dead for a little while. If a cab is actually on shift and available, they'll have their light on and stop and pick you up without asking you where you're going. If they're at the end of their shift, they'll likely stop and ask you where you're going first (without letting you in yet) to see if you happen to be going the same direction they are. If a guy is at the end of his shift and he's based in Jersey, I can understand why he wouldn't want to commit to driving 30-45 minutes in the opposite direction. There are literally hundreds of other cabs in manhattan that would be happy to take you to JFK, and there's a high likelihood you'd be waiting only a few minutes for one of them to come by.

I think Uber's a great service, but this article seems to be trying to invent a problem that doesn't really exist. For some cities, like SF and several others in CA where taxis aren't ubiquitous, Uber makes a ton of sense. But in manhattan, I'd say 95+% of the time I'm able to find a cab in under 5 minutes, at a reasonable price, by walking to the nearest street corner.

The shift-change thing is my biggest problem with NYC taxis, but other than that, they seem vastly better than anywhere I've tried (except London).

Plural of anecdote is not data, but what for me is a representative experience in NYC:

I had to go from Brooklyn (after having lunch with some rap lyrics entrepreneurs at a famous steak house), to my midtown hotel to pick up my luggage, to JFK, all in 2h, to catch a flight. I was also somewhat intoxicated.

Hailing a cab on the street is a lot harder in Brooklyn than Manhattan, but I managed to do so (as I was walking to a subway station 20-30 blocks away). He said he was going off-shift, but would drive me close to his depot (just across the Williamsburg bridge) to change taxis. I did that, and the next driver (who it turns out knew a few people I knew who worked as translators in Afghanistan; he was waiting for an application to be an instructor at DLI) drove me to my hotel, but was also going off-shift, but called another taxi who was waiting for me at the hotel to take me to JFK. Total cost was within $10 (including tips) of just getting a single taxi from Brooklyn to midtown to JFK, and total time was maybe 3min longer.

I took about 25 taxi rides in NYC over 2 weeks, mainly midtown and downtown, and they were all polite, professional, competent, etc. I talked with them about Uber, the Square reader (which apparently was just a tiny trial), etc. This was during some kind of financial dispute they were having, so I asked them about that (mid-summer 2012).

In SF:

Call a taxi. They don't show up. Repeat 3x.

Hail a taxi on the street. Driver verbally harasses my companion.

Next taxi I take gets "lost" in downtown.

One of ~20 taxis clips a parked car, keeps driving. (I called CHP after I got out with his info)

I'd like Uber in NYC, but it is essential in SF.

Whenever I've been in NYC, I've never had a problem getting cabs. Going to Newark airport however cost me something like $110 if I remember correctly, because the cab driver gave me these special "fees" at the end, it felt like highway robbery.

Now in SF, it's the worst cab situation I've ever seen. I've had cabs that I ordered via the phone never bother to show up, and once waited 90 mins in front of a hotel, as the hotel employee tried to flag taxis as they passed by the line. I don't bother taking the cab anymore. If I need to be somewhere for a day like New Year's Eve, I'll park downtown earlier that afternoon and then take the Muni there.

I just might try out Uber this New Year's Eve and see how that goes.

For the record, do note that "the taxi industry" and "taxi drivers" are not the same entity, do not have the same goals, and probably don't like each other very much.

I like the Uber concept and like most people I know, can feel for people having troubles with taxis.

But after I noticed the 3rd invite-to-uber link I got worried that this is just a piece of marketing. The count reached six and the closing words were again a call to action to sign up. A quick search seems to indicate that you can get benefits from the company, if you invite new users. Which someone is _desperately_ trying in my opinion.

A disclaimer would've been appreciated.

In general, you should take the time to learn the rules and regulations before writing things like these up:

- If the off duty light is not on and your trip is in the five boroughs then the cabbie cannot refuse to take you. In my couple years in New York taking hundreds of cabs I have never had a cabbie in this situation lock his doors or ask me where I was going before I got in the car.

- if the off duty light is on then the cabbie has the option because he is going in for a shift change. This happens around 4PM. They are not allowed to put off duty light on otherwise. They often can't go to JFK because there is another driver waiting for the car in the next hour.

You can (and often should) use a black car service when traveling during rush hour to the airports. Uber is 2-3x the rate of a cab. A service like Dial-7 is about 25% more and cheaper if going out of Newark.

Generally, it's best to get in the cab and then tell them where you're going. Mind you, that may mean you're now in the cab with an unhappy driver, but it used to be that was the only reliable way to get a cab from Manhattan to Brooklyn.

From my experience, subway from Manhattan to JFK might be actually faster, let alone cheaper.

Yellow cabs have fixed fare from anywhere in NYC to any city airport. This is written on each car. This is why, probably, they tend to refuse: this is not that profitable.

Jumping in is best practice but not always possible. Cunning drivers would sometimes ask you where are you going before opening doors, though legally they don't have to, and the passenger should tell them once in the car.

/* This is another example how regulations aimed to make a service affordable result in its becoming inferior, yadda yadda*/

It's economics: when it's raining, cabs will pass on a long-haul fare in order to pick up half a dozen or more short-hauls in the same 60-90 minutes. Especially in Manhattan, a cab in the rain will never be empty, so they're guaranteed fares and tips that will add up to more than the fare + $5 or whatever the average airport tip is.

I don't see this as so very different from Uber raising prices in response to demand.

As others have pointed out: get in the cab first next time to avoid disappointment. And don't ask, tell the driver where you're going.

Can the title of this be changed? I assumed this was some new payment system all NYC Cabs signed up for except 5. Where as the title is really 'Dear', i.e. a letter to.

For some reason I have a feeling if this guy pays the cab driver the same amount he pays the uber driver, the cab driver would be more than happy to take him

Wow that's crappy grammar.

Because, of course, taxi drivers exist solely to serve you and might not have been going in the opposite direction of the airport.

OP - quit your whining. Sounds like the country mouse is complaining about life in the city. The City moves fast, and it looks like you were not moving fast enough. Stop with tired metaphors of "small town rules and old world business."

Pro tip: Get in the cab. Close the door. Then tell them where you are going.

That is how you get to Brooklyn or any other undesirable place in the city. (see what I did there? the slight dig at BKLN?)

You squandered an opportunity there in Midtown. I'll explain:

1. It was raining 2. It was Midtown 3. Sounds like it might have been near shift-change.

How many times have you tried to get a cab in the rain in midtown? Given those market conditions YOU are the common commodity with little value. There are plenty of other customers willing to take the cab who will apply my pro-tip above.