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Comment by otherme123 | Hacker News Reader

> The Prince from Machiavelli is required

In Spain? Never heard of that, and would not make sense. An italian author writting about politics in Florence?

I have some Spanish ex-co-workers. I just verified it. They both had it on their required reading list in high-school. (one of them is in his 30s, the other in his 40s)

As a born, raised and currently living in Spain, I had never heard that. We have plenty of classical author required in high school: Cervantes, Quevedo, Benavente, Bécquer, Machado, Lorca, Pérez Galdós... Most modern and cool teachers also recommend contemporary authors like Ana María Matute, García Marquez or Jordi Sierra i Fabra. The foreign author most recommended has to be Roah Dahl, Michael Ende, Jules Verne or Exupéry.

I never heard of anybody who has read Machiavelli, Shakespeare, Tolstoi, Dante or any other "advanced" foreign author in high school.

There are some links with some "obligatory readings" for high school: https://www.edu.xunta.gal/centros/ieslamascastelo/system/fil..., https://www.educa2.madrid.org/web/lengua-castellana-y-litera... http://iesparquegoya.es/files/lengua/Libros%20de%20Lectura%2... or https://iesalgarb.es/wp-content/uploads/sites/25/2023/07/1.-... (first links when I search "lecturas recomendadas ESO") where you will find exactly one non-spanish writting author: Ray Bradbury's 451. A spicy teacher, for sure.

Maybe your coworkers read The Prince, but that is not a general recommendation or even something you heard from time to time.

These guys are from Galicia. Maybe that makes a difference.

One of those links, the first, is from a Galicia school. Incidentaly, I am Galician, and I read "O príncipe, de Maquiavelo" when I was around 40.

The difference in Galicia is that we also have "Literatura Galega", that requires us to read Castelao, Neira Vilas, Rosalía, Murguía, Otero Pedraio... I bet other Comunidades with their own language also recommend local writters.

Unless they went to some kind of private school, where they found a weird literature proffesor with political inclinations (the kind that also recommend Gramsci or Rothbard like it is "literature"), or maybe the requirement was from a philosophy or a history class, I never heard such a thing. Not saying that they are lying, but it is not a common recommendation, even less a requirement.

41 years old Spanish guy here, Machiavelli was definitely NOT in our required reading list, at least not back in my day.

Why would it not? Divine Comedy and Jack London were both required reading in my Ukrainian school (in translation of course). So was tolstoevsky unfortunately.

Why unfortunately? Tolstoy and Dostoevky are generally recognized as great authors. Being Russian does not make them retrospectively Putinist, does it?

Well, War and Peace is 1200 pages... fuck that at age 15 or whatever XD

It's 1200 pages of bad writing where he can't get to the fucking point and sentences are page-long subclause mess. He is only on the list because commies put him there for ideological alignment and being long form. Seriously, fuck tolstoy.

>Being Russian does not make them retrospectively Putinist, does it?

Because Chekhov, Gogol, Ilf and Petrov, and Strugatsky brothers are better. And dostoevsky definitely is in the retroactively putinist camp, if you don't catch that you haven't been reading enough of him. For mental hygiene alone he should be off that list. Even Bulgakov is better, although not for modern sensibilities. And is a huge waste of time.

That being said, some authors which are definitely great, just shouldn't be on the mandatory reading list for 15 year olds for all kinds of reasons, including for the reason of being russian. The list is not infinite and there is an opportunity cost that is wasted on those two specifically.

Because we have a lot of authors from what we call "golden years", and "Spanish Literature" teachers tend to be extra proud of them. Why would they recommend Dante, when they have "Cantar del Mío Cid"? A Shakespeare translation or original Cervantes? Mark Twain or Benito Pérez Galdós?

I don't mean that non spanish authors are worse (I dislike many of them because they were forced to me too early, when I preferred Dahl or Tolkien), I am just saying that it makes no sense to recommend Shakespeare instead of Cervantes in Spanish Literature class, where they recommend/require books. I can't imagine Russian Literature teachers requiring "Episodios Nacionales" authored by Galdós, a book about spanish history/politics in the XIX century over any russian author about any russian theme.

As a Spaniard I wish we had Mark Twain instead of the drowsy village dramas from the so-called Golden Age.

Yean, sure, sometimes it is like they train us to dislike those authors. But as a spaniard, had you ever heard of someone who was recommended/required to read Maquiavelo? Maybe some weird philosophy teacher? Even more, do you know a lot of people that knows even the name of the book "El Príncipe", and not just "Maquiavelo: el fin justifica los medios", and that's it?

Uhm, maybe pre-Uni students (Bachillerato) choosing the Humanities branch instead of the STEM one.

I don't know why you are getting downvoted. I am Spanish and I don't know of anybody who was required to read Machiavelli in high school.

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