Moderation in fentanyl, too? Some habits are arguably just vices, that have few justifiable middle grounds.
The difference between AI robbing you of learning opportunities and acting as a tutor or sounding board is what question you ask.
AI really isn't a skill that needs to be taught, like adults didn't need to take a semester in AI-usage, so why should children need such a thing? Besides, it interferes with how we teach, which is done by having students write things in their own words (which is just "that which I can't explain, I don't understand", instrumentalized). It's not the essay that is the point, it's probably kinda shit, but the point is the fact that you are writing it. If AI does that work for them, then they simply don't learn. It's largely the same reason we don't let children use calculators when they're learning basic arithmetic. Calculators exist, and are useful, but they're awful in a teaching environment.
If we can use AI as an expert teacher with infinite time for each child, that does theoretically have promise (per bloom 2sigma). But it's also quite far away with what we've got right now.
The article's talking about the use of AI learning rather than learning how to use AI.
> If AI does that work for them, then they simply don't learn.
I agree, and I think the original commenter would agree too given that this doesn't sounds like moderation.
The no-ai end is "you write the whole essay yourself" the all-in end is "you give the ai and idea and have it write the essay". The moderation approach is somewhere in-between and it could very well be "you write the essay and ask the AI to proofread and coach you through it".
> It's largely the same reason we don't let children use calculators when they're learning basic arithmetic. Calculators exist, and are useful, but they're awful in a teaching environment.
Yes, having the ai act as a calculator when you need to learn and prove you can do it is a bad use of it. Having the Ai double check your work to catch errors, point out when you make the same mistake over and over, or ask it to walk you through another example are all productive uses.
Any time you reach for AI to make it easier, you're missing out on understanding and retention. If you cannot express the thing in your own words, then you do not understand it.
Just as you don't learn anything by copying someone else's homework, or expanding on someone else's summary (like if that worked, that's how we'd be doing already, holy crap would it accelerate teaching), the same doesn't work when AI is involved.
Again, it's not the essay that is the point, it's the work that goes into writing it. You need to hand it in so that the teacher understand where to put in more effort, but if it wasn't for that need, they'd probably have you throw it away after writing it. Because of this, AI even for finishing touches makes it harder for the teacher to assess your level, and the polish it brings doesn't actually help you learn.
I am not sure how your literature classes went, but all of my essays were graded and feedback was provided to me specifically so I can get better. Perhaps my previously reply was too long winded, but feedback on your essay on how to improve it is the exact use case I gave as an example.
Not that it's impossible to learn a subject that way, it just requires extremely self-motivated students.
At this point that's like saying Microsoft Excel isn't a skill that needs to be taught.
None of this stuff is easy to use, or obvious. If you want to get meaningful results out of it and avoid the many, many traps then there is an absolute ton you need to learn.
In the context of this conversation, the skill that needs to be learned is how to use AI to learn effectively. That gets into pedagogy and personal learning styles and self-discipline and all sorts of other extremely gnarly areas.
There seems to be a literal trap where people are too trusting of the LLM and take its word on code or whatever is being offered instead of reading it themselves.
In the context of the classroom this means teaching discernment more than ever.
Given how much time I spend teaching people how to use AI effectively, I humbly disagree.
AI slop is not using AI effectively.
> like adults didn't need to take a semester in AI-usage
… especially adults
> so why should children need such a thing?
So that the scope of merits and demerits of the tool are explicit from the start, and this understanding can evolve along with the tool.
Moderation in fentanyl.
But yeah, what's moderation and what's excessive is subjective.
So I agree with the comment. It was appropriately placed and a valid point. Moderation is key for many things, but there are exceptions. Things that are highly addictive and corrosive may be a good category for exceptions. Things that are clearly bad (e.g. murder) are exceptions.
When someone says "life is as simple as x" and the someon else says "hold on its not that simple, what about this exception" that latter rebuttal is valid and constructive.
This is an absurd statement. If someone is trying to talk about the middle cases, redirecting the conversation to the edge in order to dismiss their general comment is not appropriate.
'Edge cases exist' is not a lesson most people here need to hear.
This leaves it generously a thought teminating cliche devoid of meaning, certainly nothing you should be making decisions off.
It fails in every direction, not just stepping on legos and murder. It's in no way better to be moderately happy or healthy than extremely happy or healthy.
1) days contain more photons than nights
2) water boils at 100 degrees Celsius
3) eating excessive sugar will lead to obesity
They seem like good generalizations because they are true most of the time from the perspective of the speaker and listener, even thought there may be some exceptions, they are materially more rare:
1) except in multi-solar systems, where this can get complicated
2) except when under pressures different than approximately sea level atmosphere
3) except when ___ I'm not sure but I bet there is some medical exception, maybe excessive exercise?
Bad generalizations will have many many exceptions such that the generalizations is materially lossy and even dangerous (e.g. "everything in moderation" -> murder in moderation, meth in moderation, punching grandmas in the face in moderation, etc.)
I know these are your extreme examples but this is literally how society functions in each one.
Meth in moderation = prescription stimulants for ADHD or narcolepsy.
Murder in moderation = war, capital punishment.
Punching grandmas in the face in moderation = arrests of shoplifters or intoxicated grandmas apparently require physical restraint, lots of possible examples of violence for purported good on youtube.
Each of your hard lines are things that literally happen daily around the world, in moderation.
My gut still says it's easily misinterpreted and can be used as justification to do something that shouldn't be. It has something to do with scope of applicability, but to be fair that's true of my other "good" examples as well (e.g. water boiling at different temperatures / pressures).
My instinctive "hold on a minute" was the assumption "everything in moderation" was not a good generalization when applied to everyone as individuals rather than more broadly/universally.
I suspect others that took issue had a similar misalignment in scope. (Fentanyl in moderation for a drug addict is not sustainable, fentanyl in moderation for a non-addict recovering from surgery, probably good)
I feel like I've stumbled into some philosophy tar pit - questioning the meaning of generalization, moderation, scope, good judgement and "everything"... so I'll just concede for now, despite feeling uneasy about it.
Perhaps try looking up the thing you are talking about before making a moral judgement based on mass media soundbites.