Comment by d5lt5 | Hacker News Reader

Comment by d5lt5 | Hacker News Reader

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> Yes. That’s why development and debt are hard problems. Also why calling it “goodwill” is, at best, too generous.

One can call the intent 'goodwill'. It doesn't mean that the outcome is satisfactory for your economic expectations. Judging from exceptions is not a valid approach and is a weird take.

> “The US also does very bad stuff” doesn’t make BRI goodwill.

True. I used that as an example of an alternative approach. The reader can decide which one is more 'goodwill'.

> Some even try viable (if self-interested) development policy without bombing people.

What countries are you referring to here: France (Douala and Abidjan ports, North–South railway in Vietnam), Japan (also ports in Sri Lanka, Thilawa), something else?

> Don’t make me say what I did not.

That conclusion says more about your reading than about what I actually wrote.

> Basically, that unlike your "goodwill" claim, China isn’t just giving away infrastructure for free out of the goodness of its government’s heart.

I shoot back with "Don’t make me say what I did not.", and 'goodwill' doesn't mean 'free stuff', you may want to check the dictionary ;)

> One can call the intent “goodwill”.

One can call anything anything. And intents can only be guessed at, while outcomes can actually be evaluated. The question is whether the label explains the policy.

BRI is state-backed finance tied to Chinese strategic, commercial, and diplomatic interests. Some projects may benefit recipients too. Great. That still doesn’t make "goodwill" a useful description of the principle.

> Judging from exceptions is not valid.

I’m not judging from one exception. I backed my point of view with examples of a broader pattern: debt-financed infrastructure, Chinese contractors/suppliers/operators capturing much of the spending, and projects that often also serve China’s trade and influence goals.

Feel free to provide substantive counter-examples instead of just waving the word "goodwill" around.

> I used that as an example of an alternative approach.

No, you used US violence as a contrast to make BRI look benevolent. That’s whataboutism. "Less bad than bombing" is not the same thing as goodwill.

> What countries are you referring to here: France (Douala and Abidjan ports, North–South railway in Vietnam), Japan (also ports in Sri Lanka, Thilawa), something else?

Given its own propensity to rely on bombing, I would not use France as an example. The EU-financed port and airport in Gaza, for all the good they were allowed to do, come to mind. Japanese development and aid efforts too, even if they, like most if not all state-sponsored efforts, come with strings attached.

> goodwill doesn’t mean free stuff

Obviously. But you’re the one explicitly framing it as humanitarian. If your "goodwill" consists of lending countries money for infrastructure that often serves the lender’s own strategic interests and pays its own companies, then I’m going to question the framing.

Keep the dictionary for Scrabble.

Unless, it just occurred to me, you meant "goodwill projects" in the sense of "projects aimed towards generating goodwill among recipient countries (and their population) toward China".

In which case, I’d still argue the frame is too narrow, but acknowledge I misunderstood your initial point and apologise.

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