> Yes, Steam Machine is optimized for gaming, but it's still your PC. Install your own apps, or even another operating system. Who are we to tell you how to use your computer?
It feels very commonsense that you should be able to run whatever you want on the computer that you have purchased, but it is surprisingly uncommon.
they created a nasty gambling system with their loot boxes that exists outside controlled casino environments and which impacts young adults a lot.
Open up Roblox and see the sheer amount of loot boxes via Robux with Pay 2 Win items, battle passes, daily rewards, etc.
Counter Strike meanwhile has item skins which don't impact the game. They aren't more OP, in fact, most of the time they give you a disadvantage.
Counter Strike is an 18+ game. Kids shouldn't be on this anyways.
Loot boxes are not a fun mechanic. Loot boxes are not designed to entertain you or give you good value for your money. Loot boxes only exist to make you gamble with your money over something that could easily be sold as a single purchase item, or better yet, be rewarded in-game. Simple as that. It’s a gambling scheme. Always has been. Always will be.
But still, Roblox should do a better job regulating the games on its platform
Yes? What's wrong with that? Then it's at least usable.
Can you hack it together in theory, get something working but making sacrifices left and right? Sure. But why would Valve want to do that? Use experience would be incredibly bad.
But give it time. There will be a standalone driver for Windows eventually, either from Valve or from the community.
If you are stuck to Windows there are some 3rd party efforts like https://github.com/ddeverill/SteamlessController
The last generation of steam controller still had a mode you could start it in where it would register as xinput device. Seems that's gone on the new generation.
When I used it I was somewhat incredulous that I could simply exit Steam mode have an actual Linux desktop environment, where I could literally do what I wanted. It was my computer, a proper general purpose computing machine, and it was (willingly* in my control. No sneaky root needed.
A interesting scenario would be to sell the hardware at cost, but include a 30% off ticket to the steam store (up to a few hundred dollars, in savings).
I already said why, but you ignored my second sentence out of two sentences...?
Let's say Valve subidizes it down to $800. But you can get a good office/art PC for $300, and a steam machine isn't particularly good for video editing. So why would you pay $800 and pick the steam machine if you're not gaming?
> And gaming is not only Steam, there is also GOG, EGS, Microsoft Store.
Why are you bringing up a whole different argument now? Yeah Steam won't get their cut for all games. But they'd get their cut for most games. If they have 75% market share then reduce the subsidy they could reasonably apply by 25%. Well, less than 25% because most people are leaving Steam OS on there and are even more likely to buy on Steam.
You've ignored "art, video editing" and you claim that your point ignored? Why do you type words at all if issue is their consumption?
Those people are gamers! If they want the steam machine it supports the argument I actually made before you brought up something entirely different (most of them buy steam games too btw).
> GPU used for 3D modelling and sculpting, video editing, encoding. Steam machine subsidized by $200 PC would be used for anything but Steam, payed by Steam users.
It's not a particularly good GPU. I don't think you'd get a lot of those users.
> You've ignored "art, video editing" and you claim that your point ignored? Why do you type words at all if issue is their consumption?
What are you talking about? I addressed both of those.
Use ctrl+F if you need to.
You've gone beyond skipping what I said to gaslighting me about it.
While you showed an inability to read my sentences twice.
But sure blame me if you want, bye.
$799 for a locked down version, $1049 for an unlocked version. Opportunity to pay $300 to unlock it later at any time. 5% discount on purchases on a locked device.
(then again i always buy the most expensive SKU they offer so im very outside the target buyer profile for such)
All I've seen is that everyone is doing at cost nowadays. The PS4 Pro was the last subsidized console.
> https://www.pcmag.com/news/sony-says-499-ps5-no-longer-sells...
I feel the 'don't waste time on HN' thing. I'm working on it, minimizing social media usage, minimizing non-productive screen time.
Last I checked you needed either a developer account or a jailbreak to load "whatever apk you want" onto the quest, and there didn't seem to be any jailbreaks around.
If this state of things has changed, please do share! I would love to be able to actually use the hardware I already paid for.
I think it’ll sell well though because of the form factor, Steam OS simplicity (and the size of many people’s Steam libraries), and the fact there are not actually many options with the living room friendly form factor and someway reasonable modern gaming performance.
The Frame on the other hand has no competition. I know I’m buying one. I hope it’s more reasonable but it could be a worse deal than a Steam Machine and… yeah.
[1]: https://www.pcgamer.com/gaming-industry/dutch-non-profit-set...
Edit, reply to bjord as I am rate limited: HDMI CEC, the chipset, GPU drivers, controller receiver etc.
Edit, reply to robhlt: Thanks! Hope we can get that ported to Windows
for example: https://www.phoronix.com/news/Valve-Old-AMD-Linux-Love-Song
i picked up Darksiders 3 a few weeks ago to play on my deck. at some point i realized i was pretty underleveled but i didn’t wanna grind.
so, opened chatgpt in desktop mode and uploaded my save, asked it to write me a script to set my souls/xp/money to whatever number. it analyzed the save and spat out a bash/python script. after a chmod +x it worked flawlessly. done from bed took like 15 mins to figure it out end to end.
no other what other (handheld) console in history combines the depth of library, the slick console experience, and also lets you chmod +x.
It's in fact one of the least powerful handhelds (of the x86 class.)
> Somehow Cyberpunk 2077 ran really well on it.
With significant dropping of settings across the board, with 30-40fps at best and frequent drops into sub <20fps during the action.
That may count as "really well" depending on your definition I suppose. I wouldnt tolerate it, but i'm sure many would/do.
It’s just hard for me to be impressed by one of the weakest entries from both a performance and image quality point of view. It’s all subjective though so if others do find it impressive, all the power to them.
I actually think the SW2 port is the most “impressive” handheld experience I’ve seen so far. Given its a superior experience “out of the box” as it were.
i’m a big time leverage enjoyer
There are alternatives for both, if/when I ever want them.
Apple could handle dev keys for free, if this was actually about security. But they don't because its another step on their road to locking down OSX like they do iOS and ensuring they make every platform developer pay their taxes.
Developers also can't access the biometric security features at all without an Apple dev account either. Even for my local software that I build for myself, I cannot use fingerprint unlock without an Apple dev license.
I don't really want to pay $100/yr to release free software for OSX, so I don't.
Nobody has even hinted that it would be nice to have a 3rd party store or the ability to run whatever OS on them freely.
I keep wondering why.
I'm not sure if you're being dishonest or just ignorant of the console hacking scene.
But for consoles it's just crickets.
We shouldn't need to "defeat the DRM", it should be allowed full stop.
Not every politician is a boomer.
> Nobody has even hinted that it would be nice to have a 3rd party store or the ability to run whatever OS on them freely.
If people are going through the trouble to defeat DRM, I would say that's more than a hint that people want the ability to run whatever OS on them freely.
There is a certain appeal to this for many people that hacking it to run your own OS isn't really sought after.
I think the other aspect is that when gaming on console, you know the game was optimized for a certain hardware config - not having to worry about whether the graphics card you bought a few years ago will net you the best experience on a recently released game.
It's just one less thing to worry about for many people, including myself.
They are selling a x86 PC. All x86 PCs sold by everyone are open and you can install whatever you want.
It's commodity hardware packaged into a small box. There is nothing special here.
Trying to sell it as it if Valve are more consumer friendly here is nonsense.
1) Full compatibility with SteamOS. You won't have to fiddle with drivers/hardware/whatever to get it working[1].
2) The physical hardware is maximally condensed, more so than you'd be able to do yourself with a SFF build.
I'd have definitely considered this if I wasn't already doing my own SFF stuff. Gaming on the Deck is a delight and I'd love that console-esque experience for my primary gaming PC as well.
[1]: Incidentally, it looks like they're working on broader support. Sweet! https://www.theverge.com/games/953411/valve-steamos-desktop-...
So does the typical gamer who's not a nerd like GP. I'm not framing it as an insult, more like a reminder: we infamously ignore the power of brands and sensible defaults chosen for you.
The Steam Machine is the best of both worlds, yes, it is a plain PC and Valve is recognizing that. However, they are also selling a fully supported Linux gaming rig that plays many Windows games out of the box.
That might not excite everyone, but it does me.
Quickly more and more companies are adopting the model of finding ways to trap the user into continuously paying them more money after the sale, then locking down hardware and software to ensure the customer is properly trapped, and maybe price cutting their competitors a bit. The death of mobile computing is actively happening right before our eyes as Google completes the trap by restricting users ability to install apks. Ultimately customers end up paying more and having a shittier experience as a result of this.
I think it needs to be applauded when a company refuses to engage with this model and simply lets you own what you bought and paid for, and brings this idea to a market that has long been infected with lockdownitis. (Unfortunately in this case the price is not "a little bit higher", but what can you do when component prices have become crazy...)
What exactly do you think an Xbox is? PS4 & PS5?
Everyone loves to say the Xbox and PS4/5 are just like an x86 PC except for the fact they are missing a huge aspect of what makes a PC a personal computer. If the vendor locks you out of doing personal computing, it's not really a PC, is it? Refering to x86 as a PC is such an outdated way of thinking. I can go buy an ARM-based laptop and do more with it than an x86 console. Even an iPhone offers a more PC like experience than an x86 console. The Hubble Space Telescope runs a 486, does that make it a PC as well?
If you are comfortable building a custom PC and fixated on the spec sheet sure, it's not that exciting. But there are some rough edges with PC couch gaming that are sanded off with this machine.