Minecraft augmented reality app announced for iOS | Hacker News Reader

Minecraft augmented reality app announced for iOS

mojang.com

72 pointsjipumarino41 comments

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So creater of Minecraft rejects Microsoft's platform (Windows RT/8) because it's closed, moves on to develop for iOS.

Yes, I remember the idea, being that Windows used to be an open platform, so closing it down is bad. But so was Mac OS.

This is still hypocritical as heck.

This is nothing new. Minecraft: PE has been available on iOS since November of last year.

http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Pocket_Edition

Well, it is. PE is mobile gameplay, the App in the linked announcement takes structures created within Minecraft and renders them in augmented reality.

Yes, but the OP's complaint was that they were still putting something on iOS App Store even though it's closed like Win 8.

PCs need to be open, cell phones less so. PCs have ever been so, cell phones have not. That's not actually hypocritical however dischordant it may sound to some.

PCs are "open", Windows 8 RT is not for PCs.

But Windows 8 is and the store for RT and 8 is shared.

The only apps that are limited to being exclusively available through the store are formerly-known-as-Metro apps which are generally more similar to iPad apps than OS X apps in functionality and emphasis on touch. The comparison is complicated because Microsoft's POV is that one OS can compete in both sectors, but no move has been made to close down the desktop on Windows 8, and it is as open as ever.

Full disclosure: I work at MS, my words are mine only.

it is as open as ever

What I see when I press the Windows key on my keyboard tells me you're wrong. That's still my desktop, whether you want to call it the desktop or not.

Exactly, by default the metro app labelled as desktop feels more like the equivalent of the command prompt in earlier version of Windows than an actual desktop... a power user/administration feature that is shamefully pushed off to the side by the OS hoping you won't notice it.

Long rationalisations are not easily conveyed to a public which is used to one liners.

"You can no longer install games on windows 8 except through the windows store."

"Some versions of windows 8, which come under the bracket of windows RT but will still be referred to as windows 8, will not allow you to load specific metro apps without buying them through the windows store, but desktop programs will be run and installed as normal. The famous people in the news complaining about Microsoft locking down windows are wrong."

Full disclosure: I could be wrong in the exact details of the second statement, it's just what I've gleaned thus far from reading comments about it.

I'm not rejecting your statement here, I'm simply interested in hearing your rationale:

> PCs need to be open, cell phones less so

Why is it more important for PCs to be important?

I'd argue that, because PCs and smartphones were open and closed respectively when they gained popularity, we've been conditioned to assume those states are permissible. I think if those initial conditions did not influence our perception of the products so strongly we would value openness equally across both. Since we are influenced though, we seem to be inclined to focus on the negative of the each's alternative option (anti-competitive PC market places and virus-ridden cell phones, respectively).

> Why is it more important for PCs to be important?

Woops, meant to say why is it more important for PCs to be open.

This isn't by Mojang, this is by 13th Lab.

> It’s been developed for iOS devices by 13th Lab – a bunch of clever augmented reality folks – with the help of Mojang. [1]

> Created by 13th lab and Mojang [2]

Looks like 13th lab is an augmented reality group Mojang contracted and worked with to build the product. Mojang may not have written the core technology, but they seem to have initiated and funded it, they're now publicizing it, and I'd guess they will be splitting profits with 13th lab.

1 http://www.mojang.com/2012/11/announcing-minecraft-reality-f... 2 footer image: http://minecraftreality.com/

I'm fairly certain the Minecraft community (especially the most involved subset that would buy an augmented reality Minecraft iPhone app) holds a lot of value to the game and Notch for not being profit driven (in their minds)[1][2][3]. Explaining this decision to the community bodes much better if they cite some set of developer ideals than if they were honest and said what we all know: a popular Minecraft iOS app will no doubt generate more revenue than pushing to the Microsoft equivalent would.

When it comes to heavily community dependent ventures like Minecraft or Reddit, there's no doubt that appearing to prioritize the community and product over profit, while holding more weight to profit behind the scenes, is a crucial for maintaining a positive company image.

1. https://twitter.com/carlmanneh/status/174987868786270209

2. http://www.minecraftforum.net/news/422-notch-gives-3-million...

3. http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/mojang-employees-split-notch-...

"You could put an exploding creeper in your school..."

I am not sure the placement of an explosive thing in a school was the best example they could have come up with. It's not that big of a deal, but it is just generally better to stay away from it.

Interesting observation, I didn't even notice that.

Been using this on iPhone 5 for a few minutes. It works really well. The UI is well put together. 3d tracking is pretty spot on. I'm in a low-light room and it works fine. They seem to be having some server load issues at the moment, as I frequently am getting network connection errors from the app when it's looking for new models. That's a minor issue that I'm sure they'll get fixed.

I have a group of friends that were thinking about doing something similar, unfortunately for them, they were just starting to shape the idea, while Mojang seems very ahead in development.

Plenty of room for more alternate/augmented reality worlds. See Gibson's Zero History for more examples (though not actually live and available, as in this case).

Thanks for the reference, I'm going to pass it to them, and yeah, there is still plenty of room in the AR worlds, but they are really dissapointed with this as they were pitching their game as "A minecraft but in the real world".

They are now looking for an alternative, I hope they find one.

Wow, anyone have the app? Is the tracking that good? That's way better than I tend to see.

That said, can't you define precise hardware requirements for apps? Why don't they restrict the sale of the app to exclude iPod 4th gen users, if it won't work on it?

Seems suspiciously good, especially the lighting. One shot in particular where the plane reaches out of the laptop screen is unimaginably impressive.

The actual iOS app seems pretty buggy at the moment. Many of the ratings are exceedingly negative.

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/minecraft-reality/id57799155...

"Note: Not supported for iPod Touch 4G or earlier. Most functionality is not available on iPhone 4."

... with many negative comments from iPhone 4 users who ignored that note. The video looked so good compared to Layar on Android - is the hardware in the iPhone 5 "better" for AR somehow? Or is the video just picking the best case scenarios?

That note is rather disingenuous considering the requirements on the left hand side state: "Compatible with iPhone 4, iPhone 4S, iPhone 5, iPod touch (4th generation)"

That's because Apple doesn't have support for flagging specific devices. You can't for example click check boxes that enable an app to be downloaded for iphone 5 and iphone 4s but not iphone4. There are a variety of clever tricks you can use in some but not all cases. For example you can require a front facing camera to eliminate ipad1 but not ipad2.

Unfortunately such tricks don't give devs complete coverage. It's a major issue that many devs struggle with. Apple is entirely at fault here for not supporting a very straight forward feature.

Thanks, I wasn't aware of that. Seems rather ridiculous considering the marked difference between devices.

I'm not an iPhone developer, but from my perspective this looks like a big problem for all apps that release products and/or updates only compatible with newer iPhones. These products/updates almost always warn the user in the descriptions, but these apps seem to always get flamed in comments and ratings anyways.

To the iOS devs out there:

* Have you run into this problem, and if so is this as frustrating as it seems?

* Why can't/wont Apple create a better system for this?

The conspiracy theorist in me wants to say that this is an awkwardly passive aggressive method of incentivizing all apps to be backwards compatible. Surely it can't be ignorance to this developer need, right?

I'm hoping there's some sort of flagging models as unacceptable. If anyone can put anything anywhere, then I expect a large number of trolling images like penises and schwasticas to be ... everywhere.

Kind of funny that Microsoft, Sony, and Mojang all attempted to solve their market saturation based profit deceleration (Xbox 360, PS3, and Minecraft respectively) issues with computer vision supplements (Kinect, PlayStation Move, augmented reality app respectively). Any doubt that further integrating and improving computer vision in gaming will be the dominant industry move over the next few years?

In the demo video the augmented elements seem to blend very well into the surrounding dynamic lighting. In the real world it never looks that good, especially in an outdoor setting where the lighting changes throughout the day.

anyone curious what similar apps were available for android, http://www.augmentedev.com/home.php seems quite nice - i'm not entirely convinced by the process, it could use some streamlining.. but it is reasonably easy to upload your own 3d model and use a qr code to view/share and the result is pretty good.

I assume this mojang app uses markers too?

> I assume this mojang app uses markers too?

No! That's what makes it so awesome. It analyses the scenery and infers your position as you walk around.

that is awesome.

Word of warning, this definitely did NOT work as well as in the video for me. I can not get any models to lay flat on my hardwood floor, or anywhere for that matter. Pretty disappointing.

That tracking is amazing! Is there an open variant so that I can look under the hood? Or could anyone cite what their implementation is based off?

The implementation and developer SDK uses a SLAM-based algorithm: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simultaneous_localization_and_m...

Here's a link to the SDK: http://developer.pointcloud.io/sdk/

This is genius. It's like the art from William Gibson's Spook Country come to life, but made practical and tied to a huge fan base.

There really is not much more to say about this than that it is very, very cool.

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