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Comment by RachelF | Hacker News Reader

The late 1970's were the golden age of documentaries: Connections, Cosmos, Civilization, The Ascent of Man and Attenborough's Life on Earth.

Perhaps it's just me, but modern documentaries are rather dumbed down?

As a side note: Quite ironic that he ends up pointing to a rocket propelled mostly by solid fuels.

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Yes, but the YouTube ed channels are such a treasure in and of itself. We had the “tech” to produce content like this for almost a century, but it took the Internet and democratization of content creation to come up with gems like smarter every day, veritasium, extra history, etc

My fear is that this is also being reshaped with ai, mostly for good now but I feel like the personal touch and passion of these creators is being diluted with the advent of generated content.

Maybe we are in a valley of the uncanny valley and the ai tools will become so good that they can successfully translate someone’s passionate vision faithfully, then it could be another renaissance.

In among all the MrBeasts and JackSepticEyes on Youtube there are some incredibly creative people.

Two that my 5-year-old loves are OddAnimalSpecimens who could easily have been on BBC children's programming in the 1980s, and Terragreen who would have been his ITV counterpart :-)

Probably the most entertaining child-friendly programme you can watch right now is whatever Jake Carlini is doing. Some wee guy in a house in Austin, Texas is coming up with better stories, better production values, and better life values than any of the "proper" children's TV productions, except maybe Sesame Street.

Thanks for the recommendations - I’m also big fan of 3blue1brown and PBS science, but as a recent dad am on lookout for content for my son to watch when he comes of that age - he’s just 1month now, hopefully by that time AI has not enshittyfied everything

We're a multilingual household, so another that gets a lot of love is Sendung mit der Maus which was originally a TV series but now is on Youtube as well - including some very old episodes. My son's German is way better than mine though, and these days so is his Gaelic - mostly I deal with people in English and I've kind of started to lose that skill.

If you like big 4x4s (and who doesn't?) then Matt's Off Road Recovery is pretty good. Utah looks lovely, and of course they're culturally fairly free of rude words so that's pretty okay for children.

Quiet Nerd is another of my son's favourites, he builds little electric-powered campers and drives them out into the woods near where he lives.

The youtube channels are nowhere near the style and depth of documentaries like the ones above...

Check out Technology Connections. This is way, way, way more in depth than anything one can find on TV.

If anybody wants some more encouragement to check out Technology Connections ... the vibe is hour+ long Andy Rooney pieces.

Damning with faint praise. He was never a first-rate reporter, AFAIK. More like Paul Harvey.

Thinking about it I have to revise my statement somewhat. I have seen The Great War, Technology Connections etc and my Youtube algo is after 15 years very tuned to me.

The issue is somewhat that this stuff needs to be pushed more into peoples feeds and not pregnant spiderman videos.

Depends on what you follow. For example, look up The Great War.

At least where I live, basically everything that's on discovery, national geographic and the history channel now is just "experts" talking (reading a script) about "hitler's secret sex life" or some such thing, interspersed with a re-enactment shot or one of the "experts" walking around a slightly relevant building.

That is fair, I have checked out some The Great War videos. Not to mention podcast stuff like Hardcore History. They are very good an in depth. There is also full MIT/Harvard courses on Youtube. So yes it is all about what one looks up.

Close to style, naturally styles are different

Lack of depth? Wrong. Just go beyond the usual pop-sci stuff on YT.

You can go as deep as you want. Surely it won't be "as fun" or "tiktok sized" but if you want depth it's there

That is fair, I have checked out some The Great War videos. Not to mention podcast stuff like Hardcore History. They are very good an in depth.

There is also full MIT/Harvard courses on Youtube.

So yes it is all about what one looks up.

> The youtube channels are nowhere near the style and depth of documentaries like the ones above...

My friend, if you enjoy long format, deep diving documentaries written, produced and narrated without AI about Space, Physics, Human evolution or planet Earths history, then I insist you head over to the History of the Universe YouTube channel and start watching!

This specific video is probably my favorite (I'm a sucker for contemplating "time"and what it actually is) and was the one that got me hooked on their channel. They go way deeper into the details without becoming a formal lecture and it's genuinely captivating. https://youtu.be/ZSmNii0uOmw?si=3Jaty3XcMGlryhh2

https://youtube.com/@historyoftheuniverse https://youtube.com/@historyofhumankind https://youtube.com/@historyoftheearth

Any particular recommendations? I’ve been meaning to queue some up to have in the background playing when the kids are around hoping to stumble across something that that might pique their interests

Not GP but here are mine, perhaps not all work for the kids and might require some attention but:

AlphaPhoenix - https://www.youtube.com/@AlphaPhoenixChannel - Probably needs no introduction to HN, but some great educational physics videos.

Huygens Optics - https://www.youtube.com/@HuygensOptics - Retired optics guy, lots of interesting stuff on making lenses and other optics phenomena and physics.

Dr. Jorge S. Diaz - https://www.youtube.com/@jkzero - Really good videos on the early history of quantum mechanics and related physics around that time.

Idealized Science Institute - https://www.youtube.com/@idealizedscience -Educational non-profit aimed at helping teachers and students, mostly physics. Typically featuring great physical demonstrations.

Tasting History - https://www.youtube.com/@TastingHistory - Recreates historical dishes, as well as serving interesting history about or surrounding the dishes.

Brian Lohnes - https://www.youtube.com/@brianlohnes3079 - Weird and fascinating history tidbits from mostly motorsports like drag racing.

Marshall Bruner - https://www.youtube.com/@MarshallBrunerRF - Accessible videos explaining radar and RF concepts.

ProjectsInFlight - https://www.youtube.com/@projectsinflight - Has a few amazing videos explaining how semiconductors work, also how to make them at home.

Modern History TV - https://www.youtube.com/@ModernKnight - Lots of interesting videos about the middle ages in Europe, how people lived their lives as peasants or knights etc.

Extractions&Ire - https://www.youtube.com/@ExtractionsAndIre - Fun guy from down under making compounds for his main channel Explosions&Fire in his shed.

Throwing out my recommendation for History of the Universe as well as its sibling channels. Honestly, the people behind these channels produce higher quality documentaries, both in substance and style, than 99% of the "professionally" created stuff I've watched in at least three last 5 years.

https://youtube.com/@historyoftheuniverse https://youtube.com/@historyofhumankind https://youtube.com/@historyoftheearth

I think if you watch Connections 2 & Connections 3 (and even Start Trek: The Next Generation) then you can see the progression that all documentaries went by the 1980s. "Story" used to be more important, but then "eye candy" became far more important.

Connections was so influential that my university (Purdue) introduced a 3 semester series of courses on the history of technology.

Agreed that Connections 2 and (especially) 3 were pale shadows of the original series.

However the related The Day the Universe Changed, which took a slightly different conceit (the episodes aren't necessarily linear in time) and focus (science and philosophy rather than technology), is excellent, and I'd put it right next to the original Connections series.

(There is, it turns out, a fourth season of Connections, "Connections 4", released in 2023 on Curiosity Stream according to Wikipedia. I've net seen any of it. It consists of only 6 episodes. <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connections_(British_TV_series...>.

Modern audiences are expected to be glued to twelve different things at once. Producers are being told to adjust to this reality. Watch any movie now and they are all compensating for the distracted audience.

Movies used to be watched in a place for that purpose. Now its the toilet. Now the phone itself is ringing. A message comes in. Time to upgrade. Ding! All while some key scene in the movie is taking place.

Well, even if it’s the living room, it’s not like being glued to a seat in a theater.

I used to be associated with content groups at a former company and in the almost 15 years I was there we saw clear trends in type of content and length of content viewers consumed.

> Perhaps it's just me, but modern documentaries are rather dumbed down?

I hear this often and believed it myself for a while, but I cannot find much evidence for it. It's just the presentation style that people are nostalgic for.

These old documentaries are quite dumbed down as well (and sometimes wrong!). If you were to just read the literal text you'd think it was an excerpt from a children's book. The next time you come across an old video you feel this way about turn on the captions, mute the audio, and block out the rest of the screen except that tiny rectangle at the bottom.

I agree there was pride in the work that shines through, but don't be fooled into thinking it's any "better".

I think the number of good documentaries has remained constant as the total number of documentaries has risen. So sure, the percentage of documentaries that are good has fallen as we are innundated with crap, but as previous posters have noted, there are still several good productions every year.

There was a lot of garbage back then too, they just aren’t a memorable so that’s why you only remember the best ones. There are a lot of great documentaries out these days. The early to mid-2010’s had a huge surge in particular, though there is plenty happening now as well.

I don’t know how someone could call The Act of Killing or Five Broken Cameras “dumbed down.” Or 20 Days in Mauripol just a few years ago

Unlike with a lot of award shows, one can actually do pretty well watching all the Oscar nominees for documentary any given year. Guaranteed at least half are good or great.

Even Golden Age TV documentaries can seem dumbed down compared to actual books. Even at the time, in the 1960s and 1970s, thinkers expressed concern that the medium of television was inherently likely to delight audiences with spectacle more than truly educate them.

My parents have a book published in 1849, "The Chemistry of Modern Life" and it's interesting to see how they transition very deliberately between "technical" and then "dumbed-down" descriptions of things.

It's as jarring as Star Trek's habit of "30 seconds of technobabble followed by a metaphor involving a balloon" trope they keep hammering.

Connections had an accompanying book (at least one) and so did the day the universe changed.

To that list I'd like to add Music of Man hosted by Yehudi Menuhin. His interview with Glenn Gould by itself is worth the price of admission!

I also feel most of the documentaries are awful these days. There are a feww that are pretty good but I miss the older stuff.

> Connections, Cosmos, Civilization, The Ascent of Man and Attenborough's Life on Earth

Civilization and The Ascent of Man were both commissioned by Attenborough - he had a major impact on the broadcast landscape well beyond natural history.

We watched all of The Ascent of Man in middle school. The only thing I remember is that when the narrator, Jacob Bronowski, gestured with the back of his hand (fingers up), he always tucked his middle finger behind his ring and index finger. I assume this was so that he wouldn't "give the finger" to the audience.

(I've been wasting neurons on this for fifty years...)

I guess we now have Veritasium, Jonny Harris, and the art of the problem instead.

NOT just you.

I feel it has gotten worse the past 10 years.

I feel it myself, I am dumbed down too. Having trouble even formulating this as I never type formally anymore.

Our state TV SVT buys in documentaries from BBC, Showtime, PBS and some of their own production. Some of their own are still good. The BBC ones are absolute garbage dumbed down now.

The world the aristocrats warned about in the 60s and 70s are here now.

What are 2 or 3 feature length documentaries you watched produced in the last 5 years? I’m curious what you’re watching and what made them so bad. I saw several excellent ones over the last few years. They’re out there and they’re not obscure IMO.

> What are 2 or 3 feature length documentaries you watched produced in the last 5 years?

Since GP mentioned TV, I suspect the ones he's complaining about are the ones I complained about: one-hour TV documentary-style shows like BBC Horizon or PBS Nova.

The ones I've seen from recent years contain interesting stuff, but the presentation is too rapid, to flashy, too repetitive yet not enough time to let things settle.

Feature length documentaries are better I agree.

>one-hour TV documentary-style shows like BBC Horizon or PBS Nova.

Yep, these must be them, but our Swedish state TV buys them and somewhat rebrands them, but the BBC logo is usually there at the end.

Yes they are much more flashy and "americanized" compared to 10-15 years ago. Sadly. I still appreciate them.

Cleo Abrams' YT tomes, albeit much shorter and more attuned to modern attention spans, are getting close to that quality level at least.

Also The Shock of the New with Robert Hughes.

It was the golden age of the US at least also. Times that belittle, defund, or destroy science or art are dark ages.

> Perhaps it's just me, but modern documentaries are rather dumbed down?

It's not just you. Most modern TV documentaries, especially series, are dumbed down and sped up. Fast cuts, lots of woo, not too much to challenge your brain, don't want it to get strained.

Gone are the days where someone conveyed the information calmly while not driving a car somewhere irrelevant. No more lingering shots allowing you to process what you just saw and heard.

Thats because we have a trove of in depth specialist and deep youtube content including all those old documentaries to mine through these days

Youtube and the internet is a goldmine and way bigger than old 80s/90s content, im over 50 and remember the 80s well enough.. a few great well produced documentaries are not a comparable to gigabytes or petabytes of videos and podcasts we have today

The cultural format of exchange has changed and the consequences of that - so called tiktok attention deficit folks means perhaps no one watches this content but I think that too is a generalization and great content is watched probably by a greater proportion of smart curious people today than back in the 80s on your phone nonetheless- we have a pocket tv with an almost unlimited amount of content

Im an information junkie and just today I spent 3 hours watching a documentary series on the incan civilization follower by a Stanford video on LLMs and then watching Blaise Arcas’s interesting ideas on computational life and intelligence

https://youtu.be/KhSJuqDUJME?si=-TMkLdapsbcWuoft

You watched all that content. Did you take action on it? What did you make or do as a result?

Is that to be the end result of the pursuit of knowledge, creating something? There is the true dumbing down, insisting on a vague kind of productivity as the point of life.

Why would doing something or taking action be dumbing down?

You are bristling with something like anger but it has nothing to do with what I wrote.

I'm off to go hiking. There are thousands of stars out there.

What will you make or do as a result of going hiking and looking at stars?

eh, sometimes its just passive consumption, I'm not claiming it makes me a better person..but it rattles around in my head and latter bubbles up as creative solutions I think.. I would be an information junkie in whatever world I was in regardless..

>Perhaps it's just me, but modern documentaries are rather dumbed down?

A pet peeve of mine is the sound effects added to nature documentaries. I had to explain, once, that the ants do not actually sound like robots no matter how far you zoom in, despite the whirring of servos that the editors decided to add in.

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