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Comment by germinalphrase | Hacker News Reader

I would strongly encourage everyone to choose two or three friends and say “hey - I want to chat with you, but it’s hard to schedule calls. I’m just going to try calling you sometime when I have a few minutes free. If you can talk, great! If you can’t, no sweat. Sound OK?”

I lowered the stakes for calling/answering/not answering, and I actually catch up with my friends more often.

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I'd hate that. I have a (small) group of friends, and we play games (almost) every weekend morning for 1-2 hours while on voice chat. I really enjoy that time but we have to schedule it in advance, we all have stuff going on. But we've been pretty good at making time for each other once a week for that time. Most of us are in different countries now so can no longer meet up in person, and this has been something that works for us.

If I'd get randomly called I'd actually just end up being annoyed, I need a sense of structure in my life lol.

> I’m just going to try calling you sometime when I have a few minutes free. If you can talk, great! If you can’t, no sweat. Sound OK?”

I do it all the time. And unfortunately this still only builds shallow relationships or keeps them alive for longer than they would. Proximity is the only thing that keeps things alive. Physical proximity is obvious, but there are other forms of proximity. Regular (almost daily) texts builds online proximity. Being financially in a similar boat brings financial proximity. Being in similar stages in life brings lifestyle proximity. The more you start drifting away (lose proximity in one or more areas), the more the relationship dies. Married people with kids who own houses rarely stay in touch with single people who are traveling the world.

Remember the old IRC rule? "Don't ask to ask, just ask."

"Don't ask to ask, just ask" is great in general, but if I tell someone this, I'm not trying to schedule a single call. It's more asking for permission to call whenever. Depending on who you and your friends are, it can be necessary to give this heads-up at least once so that, as another user put it, they don't get a panic attack from an unexpected phone call. As an older Gen Z, it feels like no one my age really calls each other out-of-the-blue, and you need something like this to establish it.

I realize there are generational differences but I still default to the assumption that calling people whenever (outside of 10PM-7AM for non-emergencies) is fine, unless someone specifically tells me otherwise

No, I don't need something like that to establish anything. My friends are relatively sane it appears. Neither do I expect such a behaviour from anyone. I have a phone, feature of that is you can call me. Complaining about that is weird. If you don't want calls, turn the thing off... But yeah, I realize in other parts of the world, there seem to be different "rules". However, still very weird to me.

I just call them. I dont think you have to reach out and send a “hey I have question is it okay to ask”-style entering-the-chat messages. The overarching problem is that everyone started treating communication as a formal business letter.

I agree, but the social norm (for a lot of young people) is not to call spontaneously - at all, ever. Giving people a heads up helps, and then consistently following through, is a step that helps make it happen.

Nah, just call them randomly and leave a message. I’m not going to have a whole social protocol for sending a phone call. If they don’t answer or call back it’s a lost cause communicating with them.

I once dated someone who “didn’t just leave the house for any old outing” and it became exhausting trying to figure out the protocol for what qualified as a worthwhile outing. It was easier to just dump the person instead of playing this little “no you’re holding it wrong” game of comms.

You’re overthinking my recommendation. It’s a one-time comment to set expectations. Nothing more.

You’re underthinking my counter-reccomendation. What you’re proposing “respond or don’t” is already a given if you send the preemptive message or not. Therefor a waste of time because you could just be initiating the relationship instead. People aren’t more likely to respond because you send them a “i wanna talk” message.

>If they don’t answer or call back it’s a lost cause communicating with them.

I mean, people are busy and schedules don't always align. Seems like the onus is on you if you expect another friend to answer whenever you feel like calling. Even with my parents we will check with each other via text before we call (being on a time zone difference doesn't help)

Then call them again! It doesn’t have to be a one time lottery.

If the schedules align they will pick up, if not they will see the missed call and call back when they have time.

Yea me too. Calling with my friends is actually a big part of my friendship

This is great, thanks for recommending me. Not sure if it'll work given how people could be quite busy, but nothing wrong with trying. No sweat.

I have found there’s a reciprocal nature to it. If I keep trying here and there, the friend more often than not does try me back in turn.

Many of us have kids/demanding jobs - so feeling free to just call when I’ve got ten minutes alone in the car means - at minimum - one of us is free at that time.

I hate this. Yes: I want to talk to you. No: I don't want it to interrupt me and I don't want to miss the chance to talk to you either. So it's lose-lose for me.

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