Comment by mratzloff | Hacker News Reader

Comment by mratzloff | Hacker News Reader

I agree with the broader message. Especially on vacation, disconnecting is important; it lets you take in life and experience it untethered, away from work email or other daily concerns. And if Facebook and other social networks make you feel that way, you certainly should disconnect from them.

But I wanted to call out a couple of things:

I woke up yesterday morning to a few Facebook status updates from people who don’t like Halloween, and who would never let their kids participate in the evils of trick-or-treating. I was immediately filled with guilt because I allowed my daughter to enjoy herself so much the previous night by letting her dress up in her self-chosen mermaid/fairy combination.

Why on earth would you feel guilty because you let your daughter go trick or treating and she had a great time?

And then I realized that I feel like that all the time on Facebook. Guilt, anger, envy… Those are the emotions that fuel all social networks, but perhaps Facebook more than the others. They’re the emotions that make us share/like/comment on things.

I don't really use Facebook that often, but when I do it's to look at photos someone uploaded or read a funny comment someone left.

So I guess I disagree that guilt, anger, and envy fuel all social networks (exclusively, which is what this seems to imply). It's a really strange worldview to me.

Really, it sounds like you just know a lot of unpleasant people.

I think you guys are missing a very key point. Without Facebook there was no way you were bombarded with this information. You just didn't see it or think about it. The perfect example is the current Presidential election. People I've known for 10 years are kind of shocking me with their political points of view and changing how I feel about them. Pre Facebook that just wouldn't happen. Now, how you react to these events is about you (the guilt/anger/jealous/bemused) However, it's important to acknowledge that FB and SN's in general greatly intensify the amount of this type of communication than before. Maybe if you're under 25 there isn't a real "before" to compare it to though perhaps.

>> "Really, it sounds like you just know a lot of unpleasant people."

Feeling guilt, anger, and envy reading a social network sounds like a personal problem and not entirely the fault of the people posting updates.

I agree. If social networks invoke those negative feelings within a person, it definitely indicates something that person has to deal with. I'm sure there are people driven by these emotions, but have hopes that friends and family are sharing to share and liking because they like things, not merely to keep score.

"it definitely indicates something that person has to deal with"

I don't agree. On facebook you see idealized lives of others and it can be pretty depressing. You see others going on vacation but you don't see them fighting with relatives ( ok, I see that, it just annoys me) and you can start thinking that their lives are better than yours.

I don't know if this is an accurate source, but I think this can be a problem for not so (mentally) stable people: (They could suffer from this without facebook too, but the dose on facebook is much bigger than in a close friend circle.)

http://www.uvm.edu/~pdodds/files/papers/others/2011/moreno20... - FEELING BAD ON FACEBOOK: DEPRESSION DISCLOSURES BY COLLEGE STUDENTS ON A SOCIAL NETWORKING SITE

> On facebook you see idealized lives of others and it can be pretty depressing.

I'm very sorry that you feel this way, but if you feel depressed for other peoples idealized lives, you have a problem that has nothing to do with your friends or Facebook.

I tend to agree that such feelings are rooted in personal issues. However I think it's also true that Facebook status updates can act as a catalyst for making those feelings bubble up in someone, when that person is trying to live their own lives without being reminded of "what could have been" etc.

This captures the sentiment. Sure its a 'personal problem' to be angry/envious that your friend from college just bought a new sports car and you're trying to figure out how to cover the cost of a smog check on your old van. But it is also entirely human. All too often we rate ourselves by the accomplishments or activities of others. This can be toxic. Disconnecting from the social graph, if only to prevent additional irritation of emotional scars, is a good thing.

I believe that the author perfectly illustrates the root of what really motivates behavior on social networks. It's very much about displaying your life as you want it seen, and choosing what to like, post, phrase posts and upload around that idea.

You may argue that the above is merely a cynical point of view (Or that the author just has emotional issues), but you risk missing the opportunity to (attempt to) objectively think about what motivates people/yourself to post on social networks with such wide audiences.

I would agree except.... people aren't real on facebook (or Twitter, blogs and forums for that matter).

The emotions I felt when reading my facebook news feed were not the same emotions I had when hanging out with these people in real life.

Before I called it quits I found myself hiding and deleting people because of the things they were willing to say and do on Facebook that they would never say or do in-person.

So, maybe it was a personal problem for me too. But the solution was to get rid of the medium.

Sounds to me like people are more real on Facebook than in the heavily self-censored in-person environment. Unless they're trolling, I suppose.

We need to stop thinking of social networks as anything other than "social interaction".

If a person feels guilt, anger, envy etc. when others tell them their opinion, they will feel so regardless of the medium on which the message was delivered.

But it's much easier to blame social networks than fixing one's own attitude. (similar to how people would prefer to ban good television than teach their children about the difference between acted and real violence ... or the whole boobies thing)

I don't think he was ever blaming the people he's connected to on Facebook. He never indicated that the people were even directing their posts at him.

I actually think it was a mature thing for him to do. He noticed that one of his behaviors - going online and looking at Facebook - had a negative effect on him, so he decided not to engage in the behavior as much.

When you say, "If a person feels guilt, anger, envy etc. when others tell them their opinion, they will feel so regardless of the medium on which the message was delivered." - this may be true. But. Facebook (and twitter and other social networks) allow people to broadcast their opinions in a way that wasn't usual for most people before. Most people are more likely to be reserved or show some tact about expressing their opinions when they're engaged in conversation than they are when broadcasting online.

edit: sorry - Swizec didn't say he the author was blaming people. I got his comment mixed up with another one. In any case, I didn't think he was blaming social media insofar as he's taking responsibility by changing his behavior.

>I don't think he was ever blaming the people he's connected to on Facebook.

Swizec never said he blamed people. Swizec (correctly) said he blamed the social networks.

But social networks provide a sensory overload that was not there before. Go back some years to time without even sms, and you would get other peoples opinion practically only when you saw them.

I'm sure there are many personality types even today who dislike facebook like interaction, and that's fine. Certainly that is not an attitude that requires fixing.

> We need to stop thinking of social networks as anything other than "social interaction".

We didn't evolve to handle social interactions that are not face-to-face. Medium really is the message and it alters the way those interactions go down greatly.

Like now, I probably wouldn't have interrupted you and start talking in a regular conversation but I have no problem with pulling one line out of your post and go at it online. And I would carefully explain what I mean instead of just dropping this link on you https://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/28/fashion/let-your-smartpho...

Maybe I'm weird here because I've grown up as a geek and a nerd so most of my social skills were built online.

But that's exactly what I would do in a face-to-face conversation. When I call bullshit on somebody (or somebody does on me), we usually whip out a smartphone and find relevant links to see who's right.

And when the other person is taking too long to say something, they will often get interrupted. Conversations often go on tangents because somebody said something interesting.

Conversely, when somebody isn't being interested, people will just walk away mid conversation.

But as I said, maybe I and my friends are the weird ones here.

"If a person feels guilt, anger, envy etc. when others tell them their opinion, they will feel so regardless of the medium on which the message was delivered."

Agreed.

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