Comment by musicsnob | Hacker News Reader

Comment by musicsnob | Hacker News Reader

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I'd argue that free markets are usually the enemy. They are not self-regulating, they are profit-maximizing. Capital's interests are not aligned with the Public's interests. Do you enjoy drinking contaminated water? Breathing leaded gasoline? Being locked in your office/factory with no fire suppression or escape routes? Why won't someone please think of the poor billionaires' profits?

Look no further back than right now to find that sleaze, corruption, and nepotism: Elon Musk, Peter Thiel, David Ellison, and so many more.

Would you estimate that socialism is practiced in Europe? Are Europeans fleeing? Have you found many examples of socialism in the Central and Southern Americas which have been allowed to operate without external interference? There is a rich history of the USA interfering in socialist and generally leftist countries with democratic processes. See Salvador Allende to begin. Death squads, hyperinflation, and authoritarian fascist regimes will certainly sway a few people to flee those situations.

This is the classic flawed reasoning on the left. Capitalism & free markets =/= lawlessness.

A small & focused government would have more resources, not less, to function in one of its core tasks, which is enforcement of law. Environmental protection is very compatible with a small govt and free markets as long as the legal system can focus on enforcing those environmental laws.

On the other hand, in a dysfunctional bloated government (as in large parts of Europe and the US) the legal arm is overburdened and suffocated by an ever-growing body of laws and regulations whose enforcement remains out-of-reach in any realistic scenario. Add in rampant lobbyism, lawmakers who are corrupt and dumb as sh*t, and and a fast-growing subset of the population that doesn't share the values of liberal democracies (thus keeping police and courts busy) and you have the perfect breeding ground for high-level lawlessness.

And to your question: while Europe's population looks stable from the outside, an "exchange" in happening in the background. If the working man's net pay is ~ 34% of the gross pay, while at the same time, a small family can get ~3k EUR per month in govt handouts + free healthcare without anyone working, it's not exactly incentivizing high performers to stay (and yes, many are leaving and for good reason).

>Do you enjoy drinking contaminated water? Breathing leaded gasoline?

The Soviet Union had worse environmental problems than any of the capitalist countries.

>There is a rich history of the USA interfering in socialist and generally leftist countries with democratic processes.

True, but the US interfered very little in Vietnam in the years after 1975 and in Cambodia after the Khmer Rouge took over, and still millions of Vietnamese fled the country after 1975 on makeshift boats and still millions of Cambodians were killed by their own government.

No country interfered to any significant degree with the Soviet Union except during the first 5 years of the Union's existence because after they had eliminated internal competition to their rule, the Soviets were very competent at national security and were mostly immune to outside interference.

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