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Comment by ChanderG | Hacker News Reader

Depending on a corporation to do your programming (and burning half the planet in the process, pardon the hyperbole) is the very opposite end of the "hacker" ethos where Lisp stands. Very surprising to see this sort of comment on HN, of all places.

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Really? Feels like most Of HN lately is just “get on the AI hype train or get downvoted”

HN has never really walked the walk when it came to embodiment of the hacker spirit.

Before the incessant AI hype it was crypto, and before that it was JavaScript frameworks and before that it was ...

HN is only a name, in reality it's VC news.

I've always understood hackers to be a subset of users at HN. Maybe there were more in the early days, but with the growth of the startup business model, a lot of different users were attracted to the site. The core value seems to be interest in technology and the cultures around it. Emphasis own the plurality of cultures because I think there are multiple, competing ones. Though, as per guidelines, any story interesting to users is acceptable for submission.

Hackernews isn't really for that kind of hacker. Ever since Paul Graham became a startup wonk and VC, it's really more for "growth hackers". It was originally called "Startup News". For growth hackers, productivity, profitability, and scalability, in metrizable form especially, are far more important than romanticism about the lone hacker or small team of geniuses building something with just a laptop and their wits, or even moral concerns about the environment. (And LLMs burn less energy, and deliver more value, than crypto did. The energy consumption of AI has been way overblown.) And Lisp was created specifically to bring about this world. It was an early initial experiment in intelligence by symbolic computation—one which ultimately failed as we found that we can get a lot closer to intelligence by matmuling probability weights with good old-fashioned numeric code written in C++, Fortran, or maybe even Rust. So the long-term AI initiative which gave rise to Lisp ultimately spelt its end as well.

But the force-multiplier effects of LLMs are not to be denied, even if you are that kind of hacker. Eric S. Raymond doesn't even write code by hand anymore—he has ChatGPT do everything. And he's produced more correct code faster with LLMs than he ever did by hand so now he's one of those saying "you're not a real software engineer if you don't use these tools". With the latest frontier models, he's probably right. You're not going to be able to keep pace with your puny human brain with other developers using LLMs, which is going to make contributing to open source projects more difficult unless you too are using LLMs. And open source projects which forbid LLM use are going to get lapped by those which allow it. This will probably be the next major Linux development after Rust. The remaining C code base may well be lifted into Rust by ChatGPT, after which contributing kernel code in C will be forbidden throughout the entire project. Won't that be a better world!

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