Hacker News Reader

> But the article points out that the students here don't even watch movies themselves -- "students have struggled to name any film" they recently watched. Why are these people even studying film? The inattention is clearly caused by disinterest.

There's a saying around here that roughly goes: few things are as successful in killing one's interest in something as pursuing a formal education about it.

Being innately interested in something is one thing, but then being in an environment when that is now a hard expectation is another.

It's like the difference between wanting to draw something and being forced to draw something. Entirely different playing fields.

it's not just a saying, literally anytime you introduce external rewards for a behavior, you kill any intrinsic motivation for doing the thing.

Simply untrue.

Plenty of people have a job that gives them money, yet they also get pleasure and satisfaction from their job.

I think you are referring to studies that show that payment can paradoxically be demotivating. But that isn't always true.

opposite in my case

Anyone that wants their own private "film school", can invest 10 years or so and work through the "1001 Movies to See Before You Die" [1]. It's a book compiled by several film critics as I understand it. For each of the films there's a page or two explaining the significance of the film (according to the critic that chose it for the list).

My wife and I have been at it for perhaps 6 years now. We probably have 3 years or so to go to finish it.

You do learn, I think, patience. I found long slow films tedious initially but have come to know why some film are that way and I am more willing now to just go with the flow.

To be sure though, any film over two or so hours we might split across two days to watch.

[1] https://1001films.fandom.com/wiki/The_List

That's a good list, but it's quite a western list. It's missing some great films from Socialist era Czechoslovakia, Poland, Hungary, etc. If you'd like to know some of my favourites, just let me know.

Please. And would you suggest any lists/forums which you found good?

Please see my reply to JKCalhoun. As for lists, I used other people's lists on Mubi a lot back when I used to watch/torrent 1 film per day (from 2008 to 2015), and for good forums there's Karagarga, rateyourmusic, letterboxd is OK, rutorrent is OK if you can read Russian, and there used to be an arthouse IRC channel on rizon back in the days but it's dead now. I stopped watching films religiously around 2015-2016, so I don't know where the cool kids hang anymore. Maybe Discord?

Here's an example of a Mubi list (not my list and not my account): https://mubi.com/en/lists/vintage-japanese-horror

Sure, please list.

FWIW, the "1001" has introduced me to a number of Czech (Obchod na korze, Sedmikrásky, Ostře sledované vlaky, Hoří, má panenko, Marketa Lazarová, Ucho) and Polish (Popiól I Diament, The Saragossa Manuscript, Człowiek z marmuru, Człowiek z żelaza) films.

I'm only up to the 1980's though, there may be a few more.

I'm not aware of having seen any Hungarian films (yet).

>(Obchod na korze, Sedmikrásky, Ostře sledované vlaky, Hoří, má panenko, Marketa Lazarová, Ucho) and Polish (Popiól I Diament, The Saragossa Manuscript, Człowiek z marmuru, Człowiek z żelaza)

Excellent! You've watched some brilliant Slavic films already then, especially Marketa Lazarova and The Saragossa Manuscript. I have these two in my favourite films of all time list. I hope you enjoyed them as much as I did.

Here are some of my favs: Ziemia obiecana (1975), Sanatorium pod klepsydrą (1973), Pociąg (1959), Kanal (1957), Holubice (1960), Slnko v sieti (1962), Zlaté kapradí (1963), Údolí včel (1968), Csillagosok, katonák (1967), A Pál utcai fiúk (1968), A tanú (1969), Kárhozat (1988), Két félidő a pokolban (1961), Szindbád (1971), Szürkület (1990), Dacii (1967), Danton (1983), O slavnosti a hostech (1966), Pădurea spînzuraților (1965), Reconstituirea (1968), and Добро пожаловать, или Посторонним вход воспрещён (1964).

I started on the BFI 250 greatest films this year. It's been an incredible experience so far. Lots of overlap with that list anyway.

I started with the AFI100. Obviously US-centric. As you say though about the overlap—I can of course skip those when I get to the 1001.

worth noting that letterboxd will track progress on these and similar lists, which is how I know I'm 43 films into the AFI100 and 210 into the 1,001:

https://letterboxd.com/beaugunderson/stats/#:~:text=LIST%20P...

I've finished IMDb's top 250 a few years ago. I'm now using this list ("a list of greatest films of all time") as a reference:

https://www.phi-phenomenon.org/

It's merging dozens of "greatest films" lists into a single "master" list.

> A friend of mine has a terrible Instagram addiction, yet has developed for himself a certain degree of cinephilia lately -- we've watched long movies together in theaters and not once has he been on his phone during the screenings. When one has faith that sustained attention might hold more value than that gained by interruption, they tend to prioritize the former.

I'm not convinced that you've fingered the reason. Pulling out your phone at the theater is considered anti-social behavior, comparable to conversing with your seatmate, and that sort of normative pressure can overcome a compulsion. It's like claiming that someone couldn't possibly be an alcoholic because they don't drink on the job.

A better test would be: What does your friend do when you watch a movie at one of your homes, where there's a lesser expectation to tuck away one's phone? Does he still watch the movie attentively, or does he check his phone every so often?

That was my thinking too. Not everyone has been or will be interested in (slow) movies, but historically those people wouldn't be studying film. It's not exactly a lucrative field.

I wonder if the students are going into film but actually just want to work in social media in which case it all makes sense.

These “film students” are like the people who take computer science just because they like playing video games.

Most of their idea of film is putting together little reels and TikToks. “Absolute Cinema” type stuff. They don’t actually care about movies and the art.

Good point. Maybe "film student" is the modern version of "studied art history".

When I was a student I studied a lot of things, I wasn't knowledgeable or good at much of any of them.

Sounds about right.

You might be extremely interested in a field and yet not find every part of it to be so interesting. Certainly not everything I studied in my computer science degrees was something I cared about deeply. I've never studied film, but I'd wager there are a number of films that are educationally significant to watch but that aren't very entertaining.

> When one has faith that sustained attention might hold more value than that gained by interruption, they tend to prioritize the former.

I suspect that attention is naturally tuned to work towards genuine interests which may be orthogonal to conventional value producing tasks

I don't know your friend's situation, but students who've been raised on screens may struggle a lot more to concentrate even on things they like than people who came across screens in adult life.

> Why are these people even studying film? The inattention is clearly caused by disinterest.

Because they want to, or are forced by their social circle, have a college degree credential, and this is the one that matched closest to their interests (they like watching stuff).

Very little people really care about a hobby. The ones that do are the most visible but the huge mass just isn’t passionate.

how old is your friend? has he been raised with cocomelon from day 1?