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Comment by oytis | Hacker News Reader

I'm surprised Trump didn't threaten involved parties with tariffs or military action over that yet. As a European, very happy about that happening, for multiple reasons. It's a shame it took so long

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Well yesterday he already imposed tariffs on several EU countries because they oppose the annexation of Greenland, so I wouldn't be surprised if he does the same in this case.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/trump-vows-tariffs-eigh...

Me too. I just think he needs to pick his battles right now as Greenland is taking so much space.

Maybe that’ll still come once he gets his intel briefing from Fox & Friends

Trump used this card already, he already imposed tariffs once so nobody cares about that threat anymore.

That's the thing with tariffs, they only work once.

You can always impose additional tariffs until it is ludicrous levels. Eg 100% or more like China has reached a few times before it was walked back.

It doesn't matter if he does it or not now, the US market is now seen as unreliable and risky.

If there's one thing companies hate more than taxes, it's uncertainty.

But there is a cap: you can only bring down trade with a country to zero. This might inflict some pain in the immediate, but eventually trade is simply directed elsewhere - and you lose any leverage you have.

The multiple reasons being exactly?

In my opinion it is a net negative for all countries in Europe, but one.

This can more some of the incredibly polluting meat (beef) industry to countries where the pollution is lower due to less intensive methods over a larger area, which is a win-win.

This is a boon to any European manufacturer and machining company.

Most importantly, Europe needs more trading partners after having lost Russia and now losing the United States. Second, I am happy about German (I suspect it's similar in other EU countries) farmers largely supporting the far-right getting a taste of a world without protectionism and regulations. Finally, I hope for lower grocery prices, not only for myself, but also because it makes the whole social situation less explosive.

Fair trade yes. Unfair trade no. And Mercosur is COMPLETELY unfair to European farmers. It imposes higher standards - and thus costs - on European farmers, while allowing South American farmers to produce with lower quality and adding forbidden substances to grow crops faster - and cheaper.

This is a common meme but wrong. The imported goods are subject to the same restrictions as those produced within EU.

What hurts EU farmers the most is the big supermarket cartel that controls prices and pushes farmers to produce more and more cheaply (and consumers that react extremely sensitive to every price increase, but that’s a more inconvenient truth)

That's like an anti-cartel, a cartel that keeps the consumer prices low.

With 12 euro/kg currently I wouldn't call beef in Germany extremely cheap on the world scale. Poultry has pretty much crossed the 10 euro mark too.

Definition of a cartel is a combination of independent commercial or industrial enterprises designed to limit competition or fix prices - it can be a cartel that basically oppresses farmers and have low consumer prices as result

And how does Asian countries curtail this?

Since we got trade deals when it comes to food with them, and they 100% do not have the same standard as European farmers.

And the EU won't check these inferior products for any problems?

From Reuters: “ The extra imports represent 1.6% of EU beef consumption and 1.4% for poultry”.

Maybe take a deep breath and relax a bit before storming the ramparts. This is a slight adjustment not something undercutting all EU farming.

Today.

> South American farmers to produce with lower quality and adding forbidden substances to grow crops faster - and cheaper.

This is a lot of fearmongering in a small sentences.

Nothing in the agreement says that that the EU has ro accept food produced with substandard practices.

Also, food produce in South America is not exactly low standards.

On average, South American farmers use 2-3 times more pesticides than farmers in Europe. 2-3 times more would be illegal in Europe, but is allowed as part of Mercosur trade.

Pesticides banned in Europe, but allowed in South America: Atrazine, Acephate, Mancozeb, Paraquat, and many more.

Diseases they can produce include: Parkinson's, brain damage in children and lower IQ, infertility, genetic mutations.

This is the fearmongering I am talking about.

Nothing in the deal says that EU has to accept anything that does not adhere to EU standards. Any food imports have to follow EU regulations. It only allows (a fairly dismal quota) to go through without tariffs.

So all the bullshit you just said (which I am not even sure I trust) is irrelevant.

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