Greenland: Macron warns of 'cascading consequences' if US seizes island | Hacker News Reader

Greenland: Macron warns of 'cascading consequences' if US seizes island

lemonde.fr

37 pointsperihelions17 comments

While people mock the EU for being entirely toothless, France is the only country in the EU with nuclear deterrence, with 240 warheads coupled to 48 MIRV capable missiles aboard four Triomphant class submarines (built in France), and 50 carried by Dassault Rafale fighters (built in France), with 10 of these 50 being aboard France's aircraft carrier Charles de Gaulle (also built in France). - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/France_and_weapons_of_mass_des...

Also it is very likely the very nuclear capable United Kingdom will ally with the EU over the United States when things go hot. - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom_and_weapons_of_...

So if this situation escalates too far, it will end very badly for both sides across the Atlantic.

Lets hope trump does not start to kill france soldiers on greenland.

I often think about the speech that Chamberlain made to announce that Britain was at war with Germany. The tone is chilling. No pomp, no bravado, just sad resignation. Chamberlain did his utmost to prevent another murderous war, and he failed.

I fear nothing more than hearing such a speech in my lifetime, yet here we are, making lines in the sand before an indifferent, war-hungry America.

It makes me so sad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcSnKArKz8E

> Greenland: Macron warns of 'cascading consequences' if US seizes island

No french wine and, if this doesn't work, no french cheese exports to US for some days. And, if this still doesn't work, a 500% tarif on US whysky, at least until Trump calls. And, if this still doesn't work, an ad with Pif et Hercule in front of Disneyland, Paris.

Or Europe dumps its considerable U.S. debt holdings, killing the U.S. economy.

40% of medicines and active ingredients used in the USA are manufactured in Europe.

30-40% of Boeing parts are manufactured in Europe.

Our financial, telecommunications and supply systems are so interconnected that if they were to fail, our lives would be profoundly altered.

Much of this around Greenland has to do with the ongoing land and sea blockade of Kaliningrad. It hasn't been widely reported in the Western media, but it could be the next major flashpoint between Russia and the E.U. Similar to Crimea, Russia wants it's access to the Baltic Sea restored and Kaliningrad is a key part of this. Standing between the English Channel, North Atlantic and Kaliningrad are three waterways through Danish territory. Now because Putins friend in the U.S. is threatening to invade a Danish controlled island (that the U.S. already has a military base on, and effectively controls militarily already), Denmark now has to split its forces to a degree, making it much easier for Russia to accomplish its goals in the Baltic Sea.

You must have dreamed this. There is no blockade against Kaliningrad. Especially no sea blockade. In fact, there is a EU treaty in place that ensures overland transport to Kaliningrad via Lithuania.

What in fact is in place is widespread GPS jamming done by the Russians from Kaliningrad, and that impacts ships sailing the baltic sea.

It's a scale between sanctions and other forms of blocking trade. Cutting off Kaliningrad will be a key part of punishing Russia as it moves more into Ukraine. There have been many instances of deliveries turned back through lithuania, sometimes causing massive disruptions to shipping to Kaliningrad. There has been a lot of threats from Russia that if the blockade gets to be fully enforced that they will respond militarily. Having total access to this port is going to be the next phase of the Russian war.

Regardless, without Kaliningrad being a factor, it is still Denmark's responsibility to control those waterways to deny Russia access to the North Atlantic. Having to reinforce Greenland is taking resources away from Denmark enforcing its area in the Baltic Sea.

There is a lot of information about it over the past few years from more international sources. And no, it's not imagined.

The really debatable issue is with the reported attempted agreement by the Trump admin and attempts by Russia to sort of trade Ukraine to Russia for Venezuela. If this turns out to be true, and you can find domestic reporting on this offer having been made a few years ago, then places like Kaliningrad, Estonia and other former Soviet Republics become the next targets.

That's exactly what Trump's is looking for - an excuse to break up and to open doors for Putin on the east flank. Same old story, meanwhile there is no counterreaction from freedom loving populace of the blessed country. That's all one needs to know.

So Trump wants to help Putin while simultaneously seizing his oil tankers?

Explain.

One explanation could be that, if Trump is a Russian asset, he'd be more effective at it if he wasn't obviously one. Seizing all tankers except russian ones might be too obvious.

Therefore, it might be worth it for Russia to lose a few tankers in order to keep one of their greatest assets.

All hypothetical of course. I'm sure Trump isn't a Russian asset. No way they can have kompromat on such a virtuous guy.

My 1st guess is that they made Ribentrop-Molotov deal last year in Alaska. 2nd guess he is drunk on power and inpunity. Or maybe both.

The stupidest answer is the most likely one. Occam's Kazoo.

Because they were transporting Venezuelan oil?

It’s not even clear whether they were actually Russian or if they were just flying the Russian flag to try and not get captured.

But even if they were Russian, it was a clear area in which Putin overstepped his boundary.

The goal seems to be to create essentially the geopolitics of 1984 (the Orwell novel, not the historical year), with the superstates of Oceania, Eurasia, and Eastasia replaced (for now) with three imperial zones of influence whose metropoles are the US, Russia, and China (this is the real substance of the “Donroe Doctrine”, though the overt part of that focuses on only the US-centered zone of control), though these imperial zones of control becoming de facto or de jure superstates isn't out of the question.

As in 1984, visible geopolitical conflict with a sufficient perceived degree of real kinetic threat between the empires serves the rulers of each empire by providing the external threat to maintain the apparent need for strong internal control, it also facilitates the transition from the current international status quo to the desired end state by providing a set of threats intended to coerce lesser powers to accede to the dominion of their respective regional overlords.

Unlikely Putin can capitalize on it with how his army is depleted.

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