CLI agents make self-hosting on a home server easier and fun
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I actually think Tailscale may be an even bigger deal here than sysadmin help from Claude Code at al.
The biggest reason I had not to run a home server was security: I'm worried that I might fall behind on updates and end up compromised.
Tailscale dramatically reduces this risk, because I can so easily configure it so my own devices can talk to my home server from anywhere in the world without the risk of exposing any ports on it directly to the internet.
Being able to hit my home server directly from my iPhone via a tailnet no matter where in the world my iPhone might be is really cool.
Now I have tailscale on an old Kindle downloading epubs from a server running Copyparty. Its great!
I could send a one page bullet point list of instructions to people with very modest computer literacy and they would be up and running in under an hour on all of their devices with Plex in and outside of their network. From that point forward it’s basically like having your own Netflix.
Why did people use Dropbox instead of setting up their own FTP servers? Because it was easier.
Being a software engineer doesn't mean you want to spend you free time tinkering about your self-hosting setup and doing support for your users.
With Tailscale, not only you don't have to care about most things since _it just works_, but also on-boarding of casual users is straightforward.
Same goes for Plex. I want to watch movies/shows, I don't want to spend time tinkering with my setup. And Plex provides exactly that. Ditto for my family/friends that can access my library with the same simple experience as Netflix or whatever.
Meanwhile, I have a coworker who want to own/manage everything. So they don't want to use Tailscale and they dropped Plex when they forced to use the third-party login system. Now they watch less than a third than they used to be, and they share their setup with nobody since it's too complicated to do.
To each their own, but my goal is to enjoy my setup and share it with others. Tailscale and Plex give me that.
Choosing convenience is fine. But if basic port forwarding or WireGuard is beyond someone's skill set, "software engineer" is doing a lot of heavy lifting.
I am not saying they are, but if it really is the case, then yeah.
As for file sharing... I remember when non-SWEs knew how to torrent movies, used DC++ and so on. These days even SWEs have no idea how to do it. It is mind-boggling.
The way I understand it is more like "without the ease of use provided by X, even though I could have done it, I wouldn't have done it because it would require time and energy that I'm not willing to put in".
Since we're talking about self-hosting, to me the main focus is not skill set but time and energy.
There's the same debate around NAS products like Synology that are sold with a high markup, meanwhile "every SWE should be able to make their own NAS using recycled hardware".
Sure. And I did all of this: - homemade NAS setup - homemade network setup - homemade mediaplayer setup
It was fun and I learned a lot.
But I moved to some more convenient tools so that I can just use them as reliable services, and focus on other experimentations/tinkering.
To be honest, the fact that you insist that Plex is just "file sharing" that can be replaced by torrents makes me think you either don't know what Plex actually is, or you are acting in bad faith.
1. The "unlocked" framing implies capability, not time preference
2. General technical literacy has declined: non-SWEs used to torrent, use DC++ extensively, etc.
I was not comparing Plex to torrenting. I was observing that basic file-sharing knowledge used to be common and now is not (see Netflix et al).
> time and energy being the focus
Sure, that is fair. But that is a different claim than "Tailscale unlocked self-hosting for me" which is how it is often framed.
But still, I insist that it's important to understand that, even if we share some similarities based on our interests/skills/work, we come from different backgrounds and have different priorities.
And part of the issue here is probably how people are framing things when they write about their experience. In tech, some of us are coming from a world of nerds where the norm is to be mater-of-factly, while some others are more extroverted and tend to put emphasis on random boring things.
Regarding this post in particular, I was more concerned about how the author was amazed by the fact that a 2025 computer could run 10 services in parallel... or that relying on a proprietary service (Claude) to manage all their setup was giving them "a strong feeling of independence".
I could, I just choose not to and direct my interests elsewhere. Those interests can change over time too. One day someone with Tailscale can decide to explore Wireguard. Similarly, someone who runs their own mail server might decide to move to a hosted solution and do something else. That's perfectly fine.
To me, this freedom of choice in software engineering is not disheartening. It's liberating and exciting.
Nobody said do everything from scratch. The point is: basic networking (port forwarding, WireGuard) should not be beyond someone's capability as a software engineer.
"I use apt instead of compiling" is a time tradeoff. "I can't configure a VPN" is a skill gap. These are not equivalent.
If you choose convenience for whatever reasons, that is completely fine.
I'm in the middle of setting up my own homeserver. Still deciding on what/if I want to expose to the internet and not just local network and while setting everything up and tinkering is part of the fun for me. I get some people just want results that they can rely on. Tailscale, while not a perfect option, is still an option and if they're fine with the risk profile I can understand sacrificing some security for it.
For a homeserver:
- SSH with key-only auth, exposed directly. This has worked for decades. Consider non-standard port to reduce log noise (not security, just quieter logs), fail2ban if you want
- Access internal services via SSH tunnels or just work on the box directly
- If exposing HTTP(S): reverse proxy (nginx/caddy) with TLS, rate limiting
- Databases, admin panels, monitoring - access via SSH, not public (ideally)
You do not need a VPN layer if you are comfortable with SSH. It has been battle-tested longer than most alternatives.
The fun part of tinkering is also learning what is actually necessary vs. cargo-culted advice. You will find most "security hardening" guides are overkill for a homeserver with sensible defaults.
The siloing of basic infrastructure knowledge into "not my discipline" is part of the problem. Software gets deployed somewhere: understanding ports, keys, and routing at a basic level is not specialized knowledge.
Honestly, if 10 lines of config is "network engineering", then the bar for software engineering has dropped considerably.
The 10 loc is not a valid measure.
`sudo rm -rf /` is a 1 line of code. It's not the lines that are hard to wrap your brain around, it's the implication of the lines that really what we are talking about.
Being overwhelmed by networking basics is worth addressing regardless. It comes up constantly: debugging connectivity, deployments, understanding why your app cannot reach a database. 30 minutes with the WireGuard docs would demystify it. The concepts are genuinely simple and worth 30 minutes to understand as it applies far beyond VPNs.
I have become pragmatic too. I do not tinker for the sake of it anymore. But there is a difference between choosing convenience and lacking foundational knowledge. One is a time tradeoff, the other is a gap that will bite you eventually.
And with LLMs, learning the basics is easier than ever. You can ask questions, get explanations, work through examples interactively. There is less excuse now to outsource or postpone foundational knowledge, not more[1].
At some point it is just wanting the benefits without the investment. That is not pragmatism, it is hoping the gaps never matter. They usually do.
[1] You can ask an LLM to do all of that for you and make it help you understand under less than 10 minutes!
My problem is not just networking knowledge. I genuinely faced issues with open source tools. Troubleshooting in the days of terrible search is also a major annoyance. Sometimes, it's just the case that some of the tools have evolved and the same commands don't work as did for someone in 2020 in some obscure forum. I remember those days of tinkering with linux and open source where you'd rely on a Samaritan (bless their soul) who said they'd go home and check up and update you.
Claude suggested me Tailscale too, but I'm glad we're having this conversation (thanks for the tips btw), so that we don't follow hallucinations or bad advice by similarly trained agents. I'm cautiously positive, but I think there's still a case to go self hosted with AI assistance. I found myself looking at possibilities rather than fearing dead ends and time black holes.
I am glad that it is useful to you! The "terrible search + outdated forum posts" problem is real for sure. LLMs genuinely help there by synthesizing across versions and explaining what changed.
I would say that self-hosting with AI assistance is the right approach. Use it to understand, not to blindly execute. Trust me, it is not much of a deal and you will be happy to have gone with this route afterwards!
Good luck with the setup. If you have any questions, let me know, I am always happy to help.
(I have very briefly mentioned some stuff here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46586406 but I can expand and be a bit more detailed as needed.)
I have done that with Tailscale, most of the time was spent waiting for it to download.
Full stack is for start ups and small projects.
All these are manageable through other tools, but it’s more complicated stack to keep up.
1. 1-command (or step) to have a new device join your network. Wireguard configs and interfaces managed on your behalf.
2. ACLs that allow you to have fine grained control over connectivity. For example, server A should never be able to talk to server B.
3. NAT is handled completely transparently.
4. SSO and other niceties.
For me, (1) and (2) in particular make it a huge value add over managing Wireguard setup, configs, and firewall rules manually.
Speaking of that, I have always preferred a plain Unbound instance and a Samba server over fancier alternatives. I guess I like my setups extremely barebone.
Tailscale gives me an app I can install on my iPhone and my Mac and a service I can install on pretty much any Linux device imaginable. I sign into each of those apps once and I'm done.
The first time I set it up that took less than five minutes from idea to now-my-devices-are-securely-networked.
right, like browsers are just sugar on top of curl
I enjoy that relative "normies" can depend on it/integrate it without me having to go through annoying bits. I like that it "just works" without requiring loads of annoying networking.
For example, my aging mother just got a replacement computer and I am able to make it easy to access and remotely administer by just putting Tailscale on it, and have that work seamlessly with my other devices and connections. If one day I want to fully self-host, then I can run Headscale.
Also plex is way more than sugar on top of file sharing; it's like filesharing, media management, and a CDN rolled into one product. Soulseek isn't going to handle transcoding for you.
From this thread, I've learned about Pangolin:
https://github.com/fosrl/pangolin
Which seems very compelling to me too. If it has apps that allow various devices connect to the VPN it might be worth it to me to trial using it instead of Tailscale...
I am not sure why people are so afraid of exposing ports. I have dozens of ports open on my server including SMTP, IMAP(S), HTTP(S), various game servers and don't see a problem with that. I can't rule out a vulnerability somewhere but services are containerized and/or run as separate UNIX users. It's the way the Internet is meant to work.
In every case where a third party is involved, someone is either providing a service, plugging a knowledge gap, or both.
In many cases they want something that works, not something that requires a complex setup that needs to be well researched and understood.
You can also buy quite a few routers now that have it built in, so you literally just tick a checkbox, then scan a QR code/copy a file to each client device, done.
My ISP-provided router (Free, in France) has WG built-in. But other than performance being abysmal, its main pain point is not supporting subnet routing.
So if all you want is to connect your phone / laptop while away to the local home network, it's fine. If you want to run a tunnel between two locations with multiple IPs on the remote side, you're SoL.
This is what I do. You can do Tailscale like access using things like Pangolin[0].
You can also use a bastion host, or block all ports and set up Tor or i2p, and then anyone that even wants to talk to your server will need to know cryptographic keys to route traffic to it at all, on top of your SSH/WG/etc keys.
> I am not sure why people are so afraid of exposing ports. I have dozens of ports open on my server including SMTP, IMAP(S), HTTP(S), various game servers and don't see a problem with that.
This is what I don't do. Anything that needs real internet access like mail, raw web access, etc gets its own VPS where an attack will stay isolated, which is important as more self-hosted services are implemented using things like React and Next[1].
I personally wouldn't trust a machine if a container was exploited on it, you don't know if there were any successful container escapes, kernel exploits, etc. Even if they escaped with user permissions, that can fill your box with boobytraps if they have container-granted capabilities.
I'd just prefer to nuke the VPS entirely and start over than worry if the server and the rest of my services are okay.
there are some well respected compute providers as well which you can use and for very low amount, you can sort of offload this worry to someone else.
That being said, VM themselves are good enough security box too. I consider running VM's even on your home server with public facing strategies usually allowable
If you are running some public service, it might have bugs and of course we see some RCE issues as well or there can be some misconfig and containers by default dont provide enough security if an hacker tries to break in. Containers aren't secure in that sense.
Virtual machines are the intended use case for that. But they can be full of friction at time.
If you want something of a middle compromise, I can't recommend incus enough. https://linuxcontainers.org/incus/
It allows you to setup vm's as containers and even provides a web ui and provides the amount of isolation that you can trust (usually) everything on.
I'd say to not take chances with your home server because that server can be inside your firewall and can infect on a worst case scenario other devices but virtualization with things like incus or proxmox (another well respected tool) are the safest and provide isolation that you can trust with. I highly recommend that you should take a look at it if you deploy public serving services.
With tailscale / zerotier / etc the connection is initiated from inside to facilitate NAT hole punching and work over CGNAT.
With wireguard that removes a lot of attack surfaces but wouldn't work if behind CGNAT without a relay box.
Behind a VPN your only attack surface is the VPN which is generally very well secured.
Edit: This is the kind of service that you should only expose to your intranet, i.e. a network that is protected through wireguard. NEVER expose this publicly, even if you don't have admin:admin credtials.
I now know better, but there are still a million other pitfalls to fall in to if you are not a full time system admin. So I prefer to just put it all behind a VPN and know that it's safe.
Pro tip: After you configure a new service, review the output of ss -tulpn. This will tell you what ports are open. You should know exactly what each line represents, especially those that bind on 0.0.0.0 or [::] or other public addresses.
The pitfall that you mentioned (Docker automatically punching a hole in the firewall for the services that it manages when an interface isn't specified) is discoverable this way.
I mitigate this by having a dedicated machine on the border that only does routing and firewalling, with no random services installed. So anything that helpfully opens ports on internal vms won't automatically be reachable from the outside.
Ideal if you have the resources (time, money, expertise). There are different levels of qualifications, convenience, and trust that shape what people can and will deploy. This defines where you draw the line - at owning every binary of every service you use, at compiling the binaries yourself, at checking the code that you compile.
> I am not sure why people are so afraid of exposing ports
It's simple, you increase your attack surface, and the effort and expertise needed to mitigate that.
> It's the way the Internet is meant to work.
Along with no passwords or security. There's no prescribed way for how to use the internet. If you're serving one person or household rather than the whole internet, then why expose more than you need out of some misguided principle about the internet? Principle of least privilege, it's how security is meant to work.
Sure, but opening up one port is a much smaller surface than exposing yourself to a whole cloud hosting company.
Any one of those components might be exploitable, but to get my data you'd have to exploit all of them.
LXC isolation protects Proxmox from container escapes, not services from each other over the network. Full disk encryption protects against physical theft, not network attacks while running.
And if Nextcloud has passkeys, HTTPS, and proper auth, what is Tailscale adding exactly? What is the point of this setup over the alternative? What threat does this stop that "hardened Nextcloud, exposed directly" does not? It is complexity theater. Looks like defense in depth, but the "layers" are network hops, not security boundaries.
You can trust BugCorp all you want but there are more sshd processes out there than tailnets and the scrutiny is on OpenSSH. We are not comparing sshd to say WordPress here. Maybe when you don’t over engineer a solution you don’t need to spend 100x the resources auditing it…
The few things I self host I keep out in the open. etcd, Kubernetes, Postgres, pgAdmin, Grafana and Keycloak but I can see why someone would want to hide inside a private network.
If your threat model includes "OpenSSH might have an RCE" then "Tailscale might have an RCE" belongs there too.
If you are exposing a handful of hardened services on infrastructure you control, Tailscale adds complexity for no gain. If you are connecting machines across networks you do not control, or want zero-config access to internal services, then I can see its appeal.
These days, that seems insane.
As the traffic grew, as speeds increased, licensing became necessary.
I think, these days, we're almost into that category. I don't say this happily. But having unrestricted access seems like an era coming to an end.
I realise this seems unworkable. But so was the idea of a driver's license. Sometimes society and safety comes first.
I'm willing to bet that in under a decade, something akin to this will happen.
The point of a driver's license is that driving a ton of steel around at >50mph presents risk of harm to others.
Not knowing how to use a computer - driving it "poorly" - does not risk harm to others. Why does it merit restriction, based on the topic of this post?
It’s why Cloudflare exists, which in itself is another form of harm, in centralising a decentralised network.
1. "Unpatched servers become botnet hosts" - true, but Tailscale does not prevent this. A compromised machine on your tailnet is still compromised. The botnet argument applies regardless of how you access your server.
2. Following this logic, you would need to license all internet-connected devices: phones, smart TVs, IoT. They get pwned and join botnets constantly. Are we licensing grandma's router?
3. The Cloudflare point undermines the argument: "botnets cause centralization (Cloudflare), which is harm", so the solution is... licensing, which would centralize infrastructure further? That is the same outcome being called harmful.
4. Corporate servers get compromised constantly. Should only "licensed" corporations run services? They already are, and they are not doing better.
Back to the topic: I have no clue what you think Tailscale is, but it does increase security, only convenience.
As an aside, I dislike tailscale, and use wireguard directly.
Back to the topic: Your connected device can harm others if used poorly. I am not proposing licensing requirements.
Are you saying "unlicensed" where you mean "untrained?"
If someone breaks regs, you want to be able to levy fines or jail. If they do it a lot, you want an inability to drive at all.
It's about regulating poor drivers. And yes, initially vetting a driver too.
I don't think it's about driving ability, besides the initial vetting.
Understand, I am not advocating this. I said I did not like it. Neirher of those statements have anything totk do with whether I think it will come to pass, or not.
In the same theory, someone would need your EC SSH key to do anything with an exposed SSH port.
Practice is a separate question.
It's slow to scan due to ICMP ratelimiting, but you can parallelize.
(Sure, you can disable / firewall drop that ICMP error… but then you can do the same thing with TCP RSTs.)
If you're blanket dropping all ICMP errors, you're breaking PMTUD. There's a special place reserved in hell for that.
(And if you're firewalling your ICMP, why aren't you firewalling TCP?)
Wireguard is explicitly designed to not allow unauthenticated users to do anything, whereas SSH is explicitly designed to allow unauthenticated users to do a whole lot of things.
I'm sorry, what?
Wireguard is distributed by distros in official packages. You don't need time, money and expertise to setup unattended upgrades with auto reboot on a debian or redhat based distro. At least it is not more complicated than setting an AI agent.
Having a single port open for VPN access seems okay for me. That's what I did, But I don't want an "etc" involved in what has direct access to hardware/services in my house from outside.
The mid-level and free tiers aren't necessarily going to help, but the Pro/Max/Heavy tier can absolutely make setting up and using wireguard and having a reasonably secure environment practical and easy.
You can also have the high tier models help with things like operating a FreePBX server and VOIP, manage a private domain, and all sorts of things that require domain expertise to do well, but are often out of reach for people who haven't gotten the requisite hands on experience and training.
I'd say that going through the process of setting up your self hosting environment, then after the fact asking the language model "This is my environment: blah, a, b, c, x, y, z, blah, blah. What simple things can I do to make it more secure?"
And then repeating that exercise - create a chatgpt project, or codex repo, or claude or grok project, wherein you have the model do a thorough interrogation of you to lay out and document your environment. With that done, you condense it to a prompt, and operate within the context where your network is documented. Then you can easily iterate and improve.
Something like this isn't going to take more than a few 15 minute weekend sessions each month after initially setting it up, and it's going to be a lot more secure than the average, completely unattended, default settings consumer network.
You could try to yolo it with Operator or an elevated MCP interface with your system, but the point is, those high tier models are sufficiently good enough to make significant self hosting easily achievable.
There was a popular post less than a month ago about this recently https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46305585
I agree maintaining wireguard is a good compromise. It may not be "the way the internet was intended to work" but it lets you keep something which feels very close without relying on a 3rd party or exposing everything directly. On top of that, it's really not any more work than Tailscale to maintain.
That's where wg/Tailscale come in - it's just a traditional IP network at that point. Also less to do to shut up bad login attempts from spam bots and such. I once forgot to configure the log settings on sshd and ended up with GBs of logs in a week.
The other big upside (outside of not having a 3rd party) in putting in the slightly more effort to do wg/ssh/other personal VPN is the latency+bandwidth to your home services will be better.
I would argue OpenVPN is easier. I currently run both (there are some networks I can’t use UDP on, and I haven’t bothered figuring out how to get wireguard to work with TCP), and the OpenVPN initial configuration was easier, as is adding clients (DHCP, pre-shared cert+username/password).
This isn’t to say wireguard is hard. But imo OpenVPN is still easier - and it works everywhere out of the box. (The exception is networks that only let you talk on 80 and 443, but you can solve that by hosting OpenVPN on 443, in my experience.)
This is all based on my experience with opnsense as the vpn host (+router/firewall/DNS/DHCP). Maybe it would be a different story if I was trying to run the VPN server on a machine behind my router, but I have no reason to do so - I get at least 500Mbps symmetrical through OpenVPN, and that’s just the fastest network I’ve tested a client on. And even if that is the limit, that’s good enough for me, I don’t need faster throughput on my VPN since I’m almost always going to be latency limited.
I am sure there must be an Iphone app which could probably allow something like this too. I highly recommend more people take a look into such workflow, I might look into it more myself.
Tmate is a wonderful service if you have home networks behind nat's.
I personally like using the hosted instance of tmate (tmate.io) itself but It can be self hosted and is open source
Once again it has third party issue but luckily it can be self hosted so you can even have a mini vps on hetzner/upcloud/ovh and route traffic through that by hosting tmate there so ymmv
It's worth an assessment of what you _think_ running ssh on a nonstandard port protects you against, and what it's actually doing. It won't stop anything other than the lightest and most casual script-based shotgun attacks, and it won't help you if someone is attempting to exploit an actual-for-real vuln in the ssh authentication or login process. And although I'm aware the plural of "anecdote" isn't "data," it sure as hell didn't reduce the volume of login attempts.
Public key-only auth + strict allowlists will do a lot more for your security posture. If you feel like ssh is using enough CPU rejecting bad login attempts to actually make you notice, stick it behind wireguard or set up port-knocking.
And sure, put it on a nonstandard port, if it makes you feel better. But it doesn't really do much, and anyone hitting your host up with censys.io or any other assessment tool will see your nonstandard ssh port instantly.
Now, I do agree a non-standard port is not a security tool, but it doesn't hurt running a random high-number port.
One less setup step in the runbook, one less thing to remember. But I agree, it doesn't hurt! It just doesn't really help, either.
This incident precisely shows that containerization worked as intended and protected the host.
Containerizing your publicly exposed service will also not protect your HTTP server from hosting malware or your SMTP server from sending SPAM, it only means you've protected your SMTP server from your compromised HTTP server (assuming you've even locked it down accurately, which is exactly the kind of thing people don't want to be worried about).
Tailscale puts the protection of the public portion of the story to a company dedicated to keeping that portion secure. Wireguard (or similar) limit the protection to a single service with low churn and minimal attack surface. It's a very different discussion than preventing lateral movement alone. And that all goes without mentioning not everyone wants to deal with containers in the first place (though many do in either scenario).
As someone who spent decades implementing and securing networks and internet-facing services for corporations large and small as well as self-hosting my own services for much of that time, the primary lesson I've learned and tried to pass on to clients, colleagues and family is:
If you expose it to the Internet, assume it will be pwned at some point.
1. No software is completely bug free and those bugs can expose your service(s) to compromise;
2. Humans (and their creations) are imperfect and will make mistakes -- possibly exposing your service(s) to compromise;
3. Bad actors, ranging from marginally competent script kiddies to master crackers with big salaries and big budgets from governments and criminal organizations are out there 24x7 trying to break into whatever systems they can reach.
The above applies just as much to tailscale or wireguard as it does to ssh/http(s)/imap/smtp/etc.
I'll say it again as it's possibly the most important concept related to exposing anything:
If you expose it to the Internet, assume that, at some point, it will be
compromised and plan accordingly.
Want to expose ports? Use Wireguard? Tailscale? HAProxy? Go for it.
And do so in ways that meet your requirements/use cases. But don't forget to at least think (better yet script/document) about what you will do if your services are compromised.
Because odds are that one day they will.
Are you sure that it isn't just port scanners? I get perhaps hundreds of connections to my STMP server every day, but they are just innocuous connections (hello, then disconnect). I wouldn't worry about that unless you see repeated login attempts, in which case you may want to deploy Fail2Ban.
I prefer to hide my port instead of using F2B for a few reasons.
1. Log spam. Looking in my audit logs for anything suspicious is horrendous when there's just megs of login attempts for days.
2. F2B has banned me in the past due to various oopsies on my part. Which is not good when I'm out of town and really need to get into my server.
3. Zero days may be incredibly rare in ssh, but maybe not so much in Immich or any other relatively new software stack being exposed. I'd prefer not to risk it when simple alternatives exist.
Besides the above, using Tailscale gives me other options, such as locking down cloud servers (or other devices I may not have hardware control over) so that they can only be connected to, but not out of.
But some peers are sometimes on the same LAN (eg phone is sometimes on same LAN as pc). Is there a way to avoid forwarding traffic through the server peer in this case?
https://github.com/jwhited/wgsd
https://www.jordanwhited.com/posts/wireguard-endpoint-discov...
- w for the wireguard network. - h for the home network.
Nothing fancy, just populate the /etc/hosts on every machine with these names.
Now, it's up to me to connect to my server1.h or server1.w depending whether I am at home or somewhere else.
Never again, it takes too much time and is too painful.
Certs from Tailscale are reason enough to switch, in my opinion!
The key with successful self hosting is to make it easy and fast, IMHO.
I’m working on a (free) service that lets you have it both ways. It’s a thin layer on top of vanilla WireGuard that handles NAT traversal and endpoint updates so you don’t need to expose any ports, while leaving you in full control of your own keys and network topology.
Your eventual connection is direct to your device, but all the management before that runs on Tailscales server.
But I also think it's worth a mention that for basic "I want to access my home LAN" use cases you don't need P2P, you just need a single public IP to your lan and perhaps dynamic dns.
Tailscale really is superior here if you use tailnet lock. Everything always stays encrypted, and fails over to their encrypted relays if direct connection is not possible for various reasons.
- Each device? This means setting up many peers on each of your devices
- Router/central server? That's a single point of failure, and often a performance bottleneck if you're on LAN. If that's a router, the router may be compromised and eavesdrop on your connections, which you probably didn't secure as hard because it's on a VPN.
Not to mention DDNS can create significant downtime.
Tailscale fails over basically instantly, and is E2EE, unlike the hub setup.
> Router/central server? That's a single point of failure
Your router is a SPOF regardless. If your router goes down you can't reach any nodes on your LAN, Tailscale or otherwise. So what is your point?
> If that's a router, the router may be compromised and eavesdrop on your connections, which you probably didn't secure as hard because it's on a VPN.
Secure your router. This is HN, not advice for your mom.
> Not to mention DDNS can create significant downtime.
Set your DNS ttl correctly and you should experience no more than a minute of downtime whenever your public IP changes.
A lot of people are behind CGNAT or behind a non-configurable router, which is an abomination.
> Secure your router
A typical router cannot be secured against physical access, unlike your servers which can have disk encryption.
> Your router is a SPOF regardless
Tailscale will keep your connection over a downstream switch, for example. It will not go through the router if it doesn't have to. If you use it for other usecases like kdeconnect synchronizing clipboard between phone and laptop, that will also stay up independent of your home router.
There's also no particular reason to think Home Assistant's authentication has to have a weakness point.
And your devices are also unlikely to start a fire just by being turned on and off, if that's your fear you should replace them at once because if they catch fire it doesn't matter if it's an attacker or yourself turning them on and off.
I think that has more potential for problems than turning lights on and off and warrants strong security.
I’ve been meaning to give this a try this winter: https://github.com/juanfont/headscale
Well just use headscale and you'll have control over everything.
Sure, tailscale is nice, but from an open-port-on-the-net perspective it's probably a bit below just opening wireguard.
Similar here, I only build & run services that I trust myself enough to run in a secure manner by themselves. I still have a VPN for some things, but everything is built to be secure on its own.
It's quite a few services on my list at this point and really don't want to have a break in one thing lead to a break in everything. It's always possible to leave a hole in one or two things by accident.
On the other side this also means I have a Postgres instance with TCP/5432 open to the internet - with no ill effects so far, and quite a bit of trust it'll remain that way, because I understand its security properties and config now.
the new problem is now my isp uses cgnat and there's no easy way around it
tailscale avoids all that, if i wanted more control i'd probably use headscale rather than bother with raw wireguard
But what can you expect from people who provide services but won't even try to understand how they work and how they are configured as it's 'not fun enough', expecting claude code to do it right for them.
Asking AI to do thing you did 100 times before is OK I guess. Asking AI to do thing you never did and have no idea how it's properly done - not so much I'd say. But this guy obviously does not signal his sysadmin skills but his AI skills. I hope it brings him the result he aimed for.
So yeah, the lesson there is that if you have a port open to the internet, someone will scan it and try to attack it. Maybe not if it's a random game server, but any popular service will get under attack.
That's fine, it's only people knocking on a closed door. You cannot host things such as email or HTTP without open ports, your service needs to be publicly accessible by definition.
It's always perplexing to me how HN commenters replying to a comment with a statement like this, e.g., something like "I prefer [choice with some degree of DIY]", will try to "argue" against it
The "arguments" are rarely, "I think that is a poor choice because [list of valid reasons]"
Instead the responses are something like, "Most people...". In other words, a nonsensical reference to other computer users
It might make sense for a commercial third party to care about what other computer users do, but why should any individual computer user care what others do (besides genuine curiosity or commercial motive)
For example, telling family, friends, colleagues how you think they should use their computers usually isn't very effective. They usually do not care about your choices or preferences. They make their own
Would telling strangers how to use their computers be any more effective
Forum commenters often try to tell strangers what to do, or what not to do
But every computer user is free to make their own choices and pursue their own preferences
NB. I am not commenting on the open ports statement
but actually it's worse. this is HN - supposedly, most commenters are curious by nature and well versed into most basic computer stuff. in practice, it's slowly less and less the case.
worse: what is learned and expected is different from what you'd think.
for example, separating service users sure is better than nothing, but the OS attack surface as a local user is still huge, hence why we use sandboxes, which really are just OS level firewalls to reduce the attack surface.
the open port attack surface isnt terrible though: you get a bit more of the very well tested tcp/ip stack and up to 65k ports all doing the exact same thing, not terrible at all.
Now, add to it "AI" which can automatically regurgitate and implement whatever reddit and stack overflow says.. it makes for a fun future problem - such forums will end up with mostly non-new AI content (new problem being solved will be a needle in the haystack) - and - users will have learned that AI is always right no matter what it decides (because they don't know any better and they're being trained to blindly trust it).
Heck, i predict there will be a chat, where a bunch of humans will argue very strongly that an AI is right while its blatantly wrong, and some will likely put their life on the line to defend it.
Fun times ahead. As for my take: humans _need_ learning to live, but are lazy. Nature fixes itself.
Add the generated Wireguard key to any device (laptops, phones, etc) and access your home LAN as if it was local from anywhere in the world for free.
Works well, super easy to setup, secure, and fast.
But Tailscale is just a VPN (and by VPN, I mean: Something more like "Connect to the office networ" than I do "NordVPN"). It provides a private network on top of the public network, so that member devices of that VPN can interact together privately.
Which is pretty great: It's a simple and free/cheap way for me to use my pocket supercomputer to access my stuff at home from anywhere, with reasonable security.
But because it happens at the network level, you (generally) need to own the machines that it is configured on. That tends to exclude using it in meaningful ways with things like library kiosks.
Your cloudflare tunnel availability depends on Cloudflare’s mood of the day.
LLMs are also a huge upgrade here since they are actually quite competent at helping you set up servers.
The only thing served on / is a hello world nginx page. Everything else you need to know the randomly generated subpath route.
You have also added attack surface: Tailscale client, coordination plane, DERP relays. If your threat model includes "OpenSSH might have an RCE" then "Tailscale might have an RCE" belongs there too.
WireGuard gives you the same "no exposed ports except VPN" model without the third-party dependency.
The tradeoff is convenience, not security.
BTW, why are people acting like accessing a server from a phone is a 2025 innovation?
SSH clients on Android/iOS have existed for 15 years. Termux, Prompt, Blink, JuiceSSH, pick one. Port N, key auth, done. You can run Mosh if you want session persistence across network changes. The "unlock" here is NAT traversal with a nice UI, not a new capability.
> SSH clients on Android/iOS have existed for 15 years
That is not the point, Tailscale is not just about having a network connection, it's everything that goes with. I used to have OpenVPN, and there's a world of difference.
- The tailscale client is much nicer and convenient to use on Android than anything I have seen.
- The auth plane is simpler, especially for non tech users (parents, wife) whom I wish to access my photo album. They are basically independent with tailscale.
- The simplicity also allows me to recommend it to friends and we can link between our tailnet, e.g. to cross backup our NAS.
- Tailscale can terminate SSH publicly, so I can selectively expose services on the internet (e.g. VaultWarden) without exposing my server and hosting a reverse proxy.
- ACLs are simple and user friendly.
> "Tailscale can terminate SSH publicly"
You are now exposing services via Tailscale's infrastructure instead of your own reverse proxy. The attack surface moved, it did not shrink.
nothing 100% fixes zero days either, you are just adding layers that all have to fail at the same time
> You have also added attack surface: Tailscale client, coordination plane, DERP relays. If your threat model includes "OpenSSH might have an RCE" then "Tailscale might have an RCE" belongs there too.
you still have to have a vulnerable service after that. in your scenario you'd need an exploitable attack on wireguard or one of tailscale's modifications to it and an exploitable service on your network
that's extra difficulty not less
The difference: Tailscale adds attack vectors that do not exist with self-hosted WireGuard: account compromise, coordination plane, client supply chain, other devices on your tailnet. Those are not layers to bypass, they are additional entry points.
Regardless, it is still for convenience, not security.
Claude Code or other assistants will give you conversational management.
I already do the former (using Pangolin). I'm building towards the latter but first need to be 100% sure I can have perfect rollback and containement across the full stack CC could influence.
The way I've put this into practice is that instead of letting claude loose on production files and services, i keep a local repo containing copies of all my service config files with a CLAUDE.md file explaining what each is for, the actual host each file/service lives on, and other important details. If I want to experiment with something ("Let's finally get around to planning out and setting up kea-dhcp6!"), Claude makes its suggestions and changes in my local repo, and then I manually copy the config files to the right places, restart services, and watch to see if anything explodes.
Not sure I'd ever be at the point of trusting agentic AI to directly modify in-place config files on prod systems (even for homelab values of "prod").
Its only swarms of bots and scripts going through the entire internet, including me.
iptables and fail2ban should be installed pretty early, and then - just watch the logs.
In my experience this is much less of an issue depending on your configuration and what you actually expose to the public internet.
Os-side, as long as you pick a good server os (for me that’s rocky linux) you can safely update once every six months.
Applications-wise, i try and expose as little as possible to the public internet and everything exposed is running in an unprivileged podman container. Random test stuff is only exposed within the vpn.
Also tailscale is not even a hard requirement: i rub openvpn and that works as well, on my iphone too.
The truly differentiating factor is methodological, not technological.
TS is cool if you have a well-defined security boundary. This is you / your company / your family, they should have access. That is the rest of the world, they should not.
My use case is different. I do occasionally want to share access to otherwise personal machines around. Tailscale machine sharing sort of does what I want, but it's really inconvenient to use. I wish there was something like a Google Docs flow, where any Tailscale user could attempt to dial into my machine, but they were only allowed to do so after my approval.
For the permissions, just add basic auth in the reverse proxy and choose whom to share the passwd with.
Now if you want OAuth or something like that... well tough luck, you need to set up OIDC or whatever and that's going to be taking you some time, but it still works how you want.
Basically, I feel that tailscale does not make it very easy to set up services this way, and the only method I have figured out has a bit too many steps for my liking, basically:
- to expose some port to the tailnet, there needs to be a `tailscale serve` command to expose its ports
- in order for this command to run on startup and such, it needs to be made into a script that is run as a SystemD service
- if you want to do this with N services, then you need to repeat these steps N times
Is this how you do it? is there a better way?
I was in another country when there was a power outage at home. My internet went down, the server restart but couldn't reconnect anymore because the optical network router also had some problems after the power outage. I could ask my folks to restart, and turn on off things but nothing more than that. So I couldn't reach my Nextcloud instance and other stuff. Maybe an uninterruptible power supply could have helped but the more I was thinking about it after just didn't really worth the hassle anymore. Add a UPS okay. But why not add a dual WAN failover router for extra security if the internet goes down again? etc. It's a bottomless pit (like most hobbies tbh)
Also (and that's a me problem maybe) I was using Tailscale but I'm more "paranoid" about it nowadays. Single point of failure service, US-only SSO login (MS, Github, Apple, Google), what if my Apple account gets locked if I redeem a gift card and I can't use Tailscale anymore? I still believe in self hosting but probably I want something even more "self" to the extremes.
Cheap vps servers 1 gb ram and everything can cost around 10-11$ per year and using something like hetzner's cheap as well for around 30$ ish an year or 3$ per month most likely while having some great resilient numbers and everything
If anything, people self host because they own servers so upgrading becomes easier (but there are vps's which target a niche which people should look at like storage vps, high perf vps, high mem vps etc. which can sometimes provide servers for dirt cheap for your specific use case)
The other reason I feel like are the ownership aspect of things. I own this server, I can upgrade this server without costing a bank or like I can stack up my investment in a way and one other reason is that with your complete ownership, you don't have to enforce t&c's so much. Want to provide your friends or family vps servers or people on internet themselves? Set up a proxmox or incus server and do it.
Most vps servers sometimes either outright ban reselling or if they allow, they might sometimes ban your whole account for something that someone else might have done so somethings are at jeopardy if you do this simply because they have to find automated ways of dealing with abuse at scale and some cloud providers are more lenient than others in banning matters. (OVH is relaxed in this area whereas hetzner, for better or for worse, is strict on its enforcement)
For something like a website I want on the public internet with perfect reliability, a VPS is a much better option.
They would be cheaper than starlink fwiw and most connections can be robust usually.
That being said, one can use tailscale or cloudflare tunnels to expose the server even if its behind nat which you mention in your original comment that you might be against at for paranoid reasons and thats completely fine but there are ways to go do that if you want as well which I have talked about it on the other comment I have written here in-depth.
I don't know what's the name of dongle though, it was similar to those sd card to usb thing ykwim, I'd appreciate it if someone could help find this too if possible
but also yeah your point is also fascinating as well, y'know another benefit of doing this is that atleast in my area, 5g (500-700mbps) is really cheap (10-15$) with unlimited bandwidth per month and on the ethernet side of things I get 10x less bandwidth (40-80mbps) so much so that me and my brother genuinely thought of this idea
except that we thought that instead of buying a router like this, we use an old phone device and insert sim in it and access router through that way.
How bottomless of a pit it becomes depends on a lot of things. It CAN become a bottomless pit if you need perfect uptime.
I host a lot of stuff, but nextcloud to me is photo sync, not business. I can wait til I'm home to turn the server back on. It's not a bottomless pit for me, but I don't really care if it has downtime.
Is it perfect? No, but it's more than enough to cover most brief outages, and also more than enough to allow you to shut down everything you're running gracefully, after you used it for a couple hours.
Major caveat, you'll need a 240V supply, and these guys are 6U, so not exactly tiny. If you're willing to spend a bit more money though, a smaller UPS with external battery packs is the easy plug-and-play option.
> How bottomless of a pit it becomes depends on a lot of things. It CAN become a bottomless pit if you need perfect uptime.
At the end of the day, it's very hard to argue you need perfect uptime in an extended outage (and I say this as someone with a 10kW generator and said 6kVA UPS). I need power to run my sump pumps, but that's about it - if power's been out for 12-18 hours, you better believe I'm shutting down the rack, because it's costing me a crap ton of money to keep running on fossil fuels. And in the two instances of extended power outages I've dealt with, I haven't missed it - believe it or not, there's usually more important things to worry about than your Nextcloud uptime when your power's been out for 48 hours. Like "huh, that ice-covered tree limb is really starting to get close to my roof."
Rewiring the house for 240V supply and spending $400+500 to refurbish a second-hand UPS to keep the 2500W rack running for 15 minutes?
And then there's the electricity costs of running a 2.5kW load, and then cooling costs associated with getting that much heat out of the house constantly. That's like a space heater and a half running constantly.
Again, not trying to normalize 2500W, most people don’t need that (and I don’t really either), but I do make good use of it.
As for “rewiring the house for 240V”, every house* in Canada and the US is delivered “split-phase” 240V (i.e. 240V with a centre tapped neutral, providing 120V between either end of the 240V phase and neutral or 240V from phase to phase), and many appliances are 240V (dryers, water heaters, stove/ranges/ovens, air conditioners). If you have a space free in your breaker panel, adding a 240V 30A circuit should cost less than $1k if you pay an electrician, and can be DIY’d for like $150 max unless you have an ancient panel that requires rare/specialty breakers or the run is very long. It’s far from the most expensive part of a homelab unless you’re running literally just a raspberry pi or something.
*barring an incredibly small exceptional percentage
But that doesn't mean its for us to say that someone else's use case is wrong. Some people self host a nextcloud instance and offer access to it to friends and family. What if someone else is hosting something important on there and my power is out? My concerns are elsewhere, but there's might not be.
My point was simply that different people have different use cases and different needs, and it definitely can become a bottomless pit if you let it.
For me, IPMI, PiKVM, TinyPilot, any sort of remote management interface that can power on/off a device and be auto powered on when power is available, so you can reasonably always access it, and having THAT on the UPS means that you can power down the compute remotely, and also power back up remotely. Means you never have to send someone to reboot your rack while youre out of town, you dont shred your UPS battery in minutes by having the server auto boot when power is available. Eliminates reliance on other people while youre not home :tada:
But again, not quite a bottomless pit, but there are constant layers of complexity if you want to get it right.
Generator was a requirement for the sump pump. My house was basically built on a swamp, so an hour in spring without it means water in the basement. Now admittedly, I spent an extra couple hundred bucks to get a 240V generator with higher capacity than strictly necessary, but it was also roughly the minimum amount of money to spend to get one that can run on gasoline or propane, which was a requirement for me. 240V to the rack cost me $45, most of that cost being the breaker (rack is right next to the panel).
> What if someone else is hosting something important on there and my power is out? My concerns are elsewhere, but there's might not be.
I host roughly a dozen services that have around 25 users at the moment, but I charge $0 for them. I make it very clear: I have a petabyte of storage and oodles of compute, feel free to use your slice, and I’ll do my best to keep everything up and available - for my own sake (and I’ve maintained over 3 nines for 8 years!). But you as a user get no guarantee of uptime or availability, ever, and while I try very hard to backup important data (onsite, offsite split to multiple locations, and AWS S3 glacier), if I lose your data, sucks to suck. So far most people are pretty happy with this arrangement.
I couldn’t possibly fathom worrying about other people’s access to my homelab during a power outage. If I wanted to care, I’d charge for access, and I’d have a standby generator, multiple WANs, a more resilient remote KVM setup, etc. But then I’d be running a business - just a really shitty one that takes tons of my time and makes me little money. And is very illegal (for some of the services I make available, at least), instead of only slightly illegal.
So now you need to test them regularly. And order new ones when they're not holding a charge any more. Then power down the server, unplug it, pull the UPS out, swap batteries, etc.
Then even when I think I've got the UPS automatic shutdown scripts and drivers finally working just right under linux, a routine version upgrade breaks it all for some reason and I'm spending another 30 minutes reading through obscure docs and running tests until it works again.
I've also worked in environments where the most pragmatic solution was to issue a reboot periodically and accept the minute or two of (external) downtime. Our problem is probably down to T-Mobile's lousy consumer hardware.
These are different requirements. The issue I described was not a power outage and having a well managed UPS wouldn't have made a difference. Nothing shut down, but we lost 5G in the area and T-Mobile's modem is janky. My point is that it's another edge case that you need to consider when self hosting, because all the remote management and PDUs in the world can't save you if you can't log into the system.
Of course there's all you need is a smart plug and a script/Home Assistant routine which pings every now and again. There are enterprise versions of this, but simple and cheap works for me.
This also makes self-hosting more viable, since our availability is constrained by internet provider rather than power.
Of course that means we’ll not have another ice storm in my lifetime. My neighbors should thank me.
A year later another atmospheric river hit and we had a 4 hour outage. No more jokes.
Make sure to run that generator once every few months with some load to keep it happy.
> maintain my familiarity with it in case I need to use it late at night in the dark with an ice storm breaking all the trees around us.
That's the way to do it. I usually did my trial runs during the day with light readily available but underestimated how much I needed to see what I am doing. Now there's a grounding plug and a flashlight in the "oh shit kit".
Assuming their heating, cooking and hot water is gas, a house doesn't actually consume that much. With a 50kWh battery you can draw just under 300W continuously for a week. I'd expect the average house to draw ~200W with lighting and a few electronics, with a lean towards the evenings for the lighting.
What follows is back of the napkin calculations, so please treat it as such and correct me if I am wrong.
1. Inverters are not 100% efficient. Let's assume 90%
2. Let's also assume that the user does not want to draw battery to 0 to not become stranded or have to do the "Honda generator in the trunk" trick. Extra 10%?
3. 300W continuous sounds a bit low even with gas appliances. Things like the fridge and furnace blower have spiky loads that push the daily average. Let's add 100W to the average load? I might be being too generous here, but I used 300W, not the 200W lower bound.
4. Vehicle side might need some consumption. If powering off the battery, it would probably need to cool the battery or keep some smarts on to make sure it does not drain or overheat? Genuinely not sure how to estimate this, let's neglect it for now.
Math is (50kw - 10%(inverter loss) - 10%(reserve)) / 0.4 = 100 (hours), ~ 4 days.
The above calculations assume a sane configuration (proper bidirectional wire, not suicide cord into 12v outlet). Quick skim of search for cars with bidirectional charging support for home shows batteries between ~40kWh(Leaf) to 250 kWh (Hummer).
So looks like one should be looking for ~80kWh battery, which actually most of the cars in the list have.
Again, very back of the napkin, would probably wanna add 20% margin of error.
Indeed with the fridge it pushes it a bit. But to address some of your other points:
> it would probably need to cool the battery
I'd expect if you're in a storm then you probably don't need any cooling - not to mention a 300W load is nothing for an EV battery compared to actually moving the vehicle. I'd expect some computers in the vehicle to be alive but that should be a ~10-20W draw.
On the other hand, my calculation assumes ~300W continuous. I expect the consumption to lean into the evenings due to the extra lighting, and drop off during other times.
But yes 80kWh might very well be what the OP has; I intentionally picked 50kWh as the lowest option I found on a "<major ev brand> battery kwh" search.
https://www.ankersolix.com/ca/products/f2600-400w-portable-s...
Also generators are still cheap compared to batteries?
For longer outages there is an outhouse with triple-redundant generators:
- Honda c. 2005
- Honda c. 1985
- Briggs & Stratton c. 1940
The “redundancy” here is that the first is to provide power in the event of a long power outage, and the other two are redundant museum pieces (which turn over!)
What setup did you go with for whole house backup power?
I regrettably removed our old furnace/tank when installing the air source heat pump we have now (northeast), but that’s been my biggest concern power wise
You can even self host tailscale via headscale but I don't know how the experience goes but there are some genuine open source software like netbird,zerotier etc. as well
You could also if interested just go the normal wireguard route. It really depends on your use case but for you in this case, ssh use case seems normal.
You could even use this with termux in android + ssh access via dropbear I think if you want. Tailscale is mainly for convenience tho and not having to deal with nats and everything
But I feel like your home server might be behind a nat and in that case, what I recommend you to do is probably A) run it in tor or https://gitlab.com/CGamesPlay/qtm which uses iroh's instance but you can self host it too or B (recommended): Get a unlimited traffic cheap vps (I recommend Upcloud,OVH,hetzner) which would cost around 3-4$ per month and then install something like remotemoe https://github.com/fasmide/remotemoe or anything similar to it effectively like a proxy.
Sorry if I went a little overkill tho lol. I have played too much on these things so I may be overarchitecting stuff but if you genuinely want self hosting to the extreme self, tor.onion's or i2p might benefit ya but even buying a vps can be a good step up
> I was in another country when there was a power outage at home. My internet went down, the server restart but couldn't reconnect anymore because the optical network router also had some problems after the power outage. I could ask my folks to restart, and turn on off things but nothing more than that. So I couldn't reach my Nextcloud instance and other stuff. Maybe an uninterruptible power supply could have helped but the more I was thinking about it after just didn't really worth the hassle anymore. Add a UPS okay. But why not add a dual WAN failover router for extra security if the internet goes down again? etc. It's a bottomless pit (like most hobbies tbh)
Laptops have in built ups and are cheap, Laptops and refurbished servers are good entry point imo and I feel like sure its a bottomless pit but the benefits are well worth it and at a point you have to look at trade offs and everything and personally laptops/refurbished or resale servers are that for me. In fact, I used to run a git server on an android tab for some time but been too lazy to figure out if I want it to charge permanently or what
But I think in the end what ended up working was my frustration took over and I just copy pasted the commands from readme and if I remember correctly, they just worked.
This is really ironical considering on what thread we are on but in the end, Good readme's make self hosting on a home server easier and fun xD
(I don't exactly remember chatgpt's conversations, perhaps they might have helped a bit or not, but I am 99% sure that it was your readme which ended up helping and chatgpt etc. in fact took an hour or more and genuinely frustrated me from what I remember vaguely)
I hope QTM reaches more traction. Its build on solid primitives.
One thing I genuinely want you to perhaps take a look at if possible is creating an additional piece of software or adding the functionality where instead of the careful dance that we have to make it work (like we have to send two large data pieces from two computers, I had to use some hacky solution like piping server or wormhole itself for it)
So what I am asking is if there could be a possibility that you can make the initial node pairing (ticket?) [Sorry, I forgot the name of primitive] between A and B, you use wormhole itself and now instead of these two having to send large chunks of data between each other, they can now just send 6 words or similar
Wormhole: https://github.com/magic-wormhole/magic-wormhole
I even remember building some of my own CLI for something liek this and using chatgpt to build it xD but in the end gave up because I wasn't familiar with the codebase or how to make these two work together but I hope that you can add it. I sincerely hope so.
Another minor suggestion I feel like giving is to please have asciinema demo. I will create an asciinema patch if you want between two computers but a working demo gif from 0 -> running really really would've helped me save some/few hours
QTM has lots of potential. Iroh is so sane, it can run directly on top of ipv4 itself and talk directly if possible but it can even break through nats and you can even self host the middle part itself. I had thought about building such a project when I had first discovered QTM and you can just imagine my joy when I discovered QTM from one of your comments a long time ago for what its worth
Wishing the best of luck of your project! The idea is very fascinating. I would appreciate a visual demo a lot though and I hope we can discuss more!
Edit: I remember that qtm docs had this issue of where they really felt complex for me personally when all I wanted was one computer port mapped to another computer port and I think what helped in the end was the 4th comment if I remember correctly, I might have used LLM assistance or not or if it helped or not, I genuinely don't remember but it definitely took me an hour or two to figure things out but its okay since I still feel like the software is definitely positive and this might have been a skill issue from my side but I just want if you can add asciinema docs, I can't stress it enough if possible on how much it can genuinely help an average person to figure out the product.
(Slowly move towards the complex setups with asciinema demos for each of them if you wish)
Once again good luck! I can't stress qtm and I still strongly urge everyone to try qtm once https://gitlab.com/CGamesPlay/qtm since its highly relevant to the discussion
I've added an asciinema to the README now <https://asciinema.org/a/z2cdsoVDVJu0gIGn>, showing the manual connection steps. Thanks for the kind words. Hope you find it useful!
Wow the asciinema is really good and very professional, thanks for creating it, I found it very helpful (in the sense that if I ever were to repeat my experiment, now I got your asciinema server) and I hope more people use it
> It could be streamlined with something like Magic Wormhole, though. I'll add that to the backlog and see if there's interest
To be really honest, its not that big of a deal considering one can do that on their own but I just had this idea for my own convenience when I was using QTM
I really like QTM a lot! Thanks for building it once again, I would try to integrate it more often and give you more feedback when possible from now.
If you just want to put a service on the internet, a VPS is the way to go.
If you are going to be away from home a lot, then yes, it's a bottomless pit. Because you have to build a system that does not rely on the possibility of you being there, anytime.
I have 7 computers on my self-hosted network and not all of them are on-prem. With a bit of careful planning, you can essentially create a system that will stay up regardless of local fluctuations etc. But it is a demanding hobby and if you don't enjoy the IT stuff, you'll probably have a pretty bad time doing it. For most normal consumers, self-hosting is not really an option and the isn't worth the cost of switching over. I justify it because it helps me understand how things work and tangentially helps me get better my professional skills as well.
Tailscale also has a self-hosted version I believe.
Then 5 years later there was a power outage and the UPS lasted for about 10 seconds before the batteries failed. That's how I learned about UPS battery maintenance schedules and the importance of testing.
I have a calendar alert to test the UPS. I groan whenever it comes up because I know there's a chance I'm going to discover the batteries won't hold up under load any more, which means I not only have to deal with the server losing power but I have to do the next round of guessing which replacement batteries are coming from a good brand this time. Using the same vendor doesn't even guarantee you're going to get the same quality when you only buy every several years.
Backup generators have their own maintenance schedule.
I think the future situation should be better with lithium chemistry UPS, but every time I look the available options are either exorbitantly expensive or they're cobbled together from parts in a way that kind of works but has a lot of limitations and up-front work.
Another maker is Goldenmate (less I be accused of being an ad)
its so much simpler when you have the files stored locally, then syncing between devices is just something that can happen whenever. anything that is running on a server needs user permissions, wifi, a router etc etc, its just a lot of complexity for very little gain.
although keep in mind im the only one using all of this stuff. if i needed to share things with other people then syncthing gets a bit trickier and a central server starts to make more sense
Self hosting sounds so simple, but if you consider all the critical factors involved, in becomes a full time job. You own your server. In every regard.
And security is only one crucial aspect. How spam filters react to your IP is another story.
In the end I cherrish the dream but rely on third party server providers.
> I am spending time using software, learning
What are you actually learning?
PSA: OP is a CEO of an AI company
You can watch your doctor, your plumber, your car mechanic and still wouldn’t know if they di something wrong if you don’t know the subject as such.
Bob the Builder doesn't convey much about drainage needs for foundations and few children think to ask. Who knows how AI-Bob might respond.
Very true but I'll still opt for that general anesthesia...
Wrote about learning and fun here: https://fulghum.io/fun2
Why wouldn't you bring it up, or even lead with it?
Doesn't it make sense to want to know this? It's not far fetched at all that there is a conflict of interest. How can they be unbiased in the validity of the approach if this is exactly the same stuff they sell for money?
Having others run a service for you is a good thing! I'd love to pay a subscription for a service, but ran as a cooperative, where I'm not actually just paying a subscription fee, instead I'm a member and I get to decide what gets done as well.
This model works so well for housing, where the renters are also the owners of the building. Incentives are aligned perfectly, rents are kept low, the building is kept intact, no unnecessary expensive stuff added. And most importantly, no worries of the building ever getting sold and things going south. That's what I would like for my cloud storage, e-mail etc.
I was thinking about what if your "cloud" was more like a tilde.club, with self hosted web services plus a Linux login. What services would you want?
Email and cloud make sense. I think a VPN and Ad Blocker would too. Maybe Immich and music hosting? Calendar? I don't know what people use for self hosting
I'd really focus on it being usable for non-techies, I don't think I'd want a linux login for anything. IMO, the focus should be on the basic infrastructure of digital life for the everyday person.
tilde.club sounds interesting though! Hadn't heard of it before.
I say all this as someone who's been self-hosting services in one form or another for almost a decade at this point. The market incorporation/consumerfication of the hobby has been so noticeable in the last five years. Even this AI thing seems like another step in that direction; now even non-experts can drop $350+ on consumer hardware and maybe $100 on some network gear so that they can control their $50/bulb Hue lights and manage their expansive personal media collection.
I don't think mainstream tech media is deliberately omitting co-ops in their reporting due to them challenging the status quo. I think it's rather that actually, there aren't really many initiatives in the space.
And I think that is due to a lot of tech people thinking that if only the technology becomes good enough, then the problem will be solved, then, finally, everyone can have their own cloud at home.
I think that's wrong though, I think the solution in this case is that we organize the service differently, with power structured in a different way. We don't need more software to solve the problem. We know how to build a cloud services, technically. We know how to do it will. It's just that if the service is run for-profit, counter to the interests of the users, it will eventually become a problem for the users. That's the problem to fix, and it's not one to fix with technology, but just with organizing it differently.
It works for housing, in some areas it also works for utilities like internet, there are also co-ops for food. Why shouldn't it also work for modern-day utilities like cloud storage and email?
As a techie, don't be content with just running your own self-hosted service. Run it for your family, run it for your friends, run it for your neighborhood! Band together!
100% agree with you here, and yeah I'm definitely leaning a bit too conspiratorial about it. It's probably not actually intentional, and instead just a product of the larger dynamics.
A while ago I read some interesting economic analysis about why more co-ops hadn't popped up specifically in the gig worker space, since it seems to natural to cut out the platform rent that eg. Uber extracts as profit. I'm failing to recall the specific conclusions, but IIRC the authors seemed to feel that there were some structural obstacles preventing co-ops from growing in those space. Something something capex and unit costs. It's certainly an area I'd be interested to see further analysis in.
Also you sounds like you might get a kick out of mayfirst.coop (if you're not familiar with them already). It's not exactly what you're describing, but the spirit is there. I use them for my web-hosting needs and have been extremely satisfied.
What you're describing is possible but you would need to market it differently if selling to non-tech people.
Now if you could make something like this https://oxide.computer/ for home users and make it affordable, that would be cool.
Also I am currently only targeting locals so I can physically go to their place and configure their server.
I don’t mind growing slowly here btw. It’s my side business and I plan to keep my current job for the time being.
But Tailscale is the real unlock in my opinion. Having a slot machine cosplaying as sysadmin is cool, but being able to access services securely from anywhere makes them legitimately usable for daily life. It means your services can be used by friends/family if they can get past an app install and login.
I also take minor issue with running Vaultwarden in this setup. Password managers are maximally sensitive and hosting that data is not as banal as hosting Plex. Personally, I would want Vaultwarden on something properly isolated and locked down.
That said, I'm not sure if Bitwarden is the answer either. There is certainly some value in obscurity, but I think they have a better infosec budget than I do.
I cannot say how happy I am configuring my own immich server on a decade old machine. I just feel empowered. Because despite my 9 years of software development, I haven't gotten into the nitty gritties of networking, VPN and I always see something non-standard while installing an open source package and without all of this custom guidance, I always would give up after a couple of hours of pulling my hair apart.
I really want to go deeper and it finally feels this could be a hobby.
PS: The rush was so great I was excitedly talking to my wife how I could port our emails away from google, considering all of the automatic opt in for AI processing and what not. The foolhardy me thought of even sabbatical breaks to work on long pending to-do's in my head.
I do want to be able to take control; with photos and Google not giving me a folder view to manage them was the last straw that pushed me deep into the self hosted world. I just want to de-google as much as reasonable.
I've been email self-hosting for a decade, and unfortunately, self-hosting your email will not help with this point nearly as much as it seems on first glance.
The reason is that as soon as you exchange emails with anyone using one of the major email services like gmail or o365, you're once again participating in the data collection/AI training machine. They'll get you coming or they'll get you going, but you will be got.
There are so many NAS + Curated App Catalog distros out there that make self-hosting trivial without needing to Vibe SysAdmin.
It was just giving commands to run that were plain wrong and extremely destructive, and unless you already knew what they were doing you were screwed.
Here: https://chatgpt.com/share/696539b6-65f0-8010-9324-5e35da42ee...
I have 4-5 more conversations like this. It's honestly almost a piece of art, the LLM keeps spouting out shit like "Ah got it, your issue is clear now", and digging deeper into the wrong direction.
Email/DNS I outsource, everything else I homelab.
In the end I literally had to give up, it's just too problematic.
In my experience, this approach works extremely well—I would not have been able to accomplish this much on my own. However, there is an important caveat: you must understand what you are doing. AI systems sometimes propose solutions that do not work, and in some cases they can be genuinely dangerous to your data integrity or your privacy.
AI is therefore a powerful accelerator, not a replacement for expertise. You still need to critically evaluate its suggestions and veto roughly 10% of them.
On self-hosting: be aware that it is a warzone out there. Your IP address will be probed constantly for vulnerabilities, and even those will need to dealt with as most automated probes don't throttle and can impact your server. That's probably my biggest issue along with email deliverability.
Haproxy with SNI routing was simple and worked well for many years for me.
Istio installed on a single node Talos VM currently works very well for me.
Both have sophisticated circuit breaking and ddos protection.
For users I put admin interfaces behind wireguard and block TCP by source ip at the 443 listener.
I expose one or two things to the public behind an oauth2-proxy for authnz.
Edit: This has been set and forget since the start of the pandemic on a fiber IPv4 address.
Years later I still had the same router. Somewhere a long the line, I fired the right neurons and asked myself, "When was the last time $MANUFACTURER published an update for this? It's been awhile..."
In the context of just starting to learn about the fundamentals of security principles and owning your own data (ty hackernews friends!), that was a major catalyst for me. It kicked me into a self-hosting trajectory. LLMs have saved me a lot of extra bumps and bruises and barked shins in this area. They helped me go in the right direction fast enough.
Point is, parent comment is right. Be safe out there. Don't let your server be absorbed into the zombie army.
Anything I really don’t want to lose is in a paid cloud service with a local backup sync over SMB to my TrueNAS box for some of the most important ones.
An exception is GitHub, I’m not paying for GitHub, but git kinda sorta backs itself up well enough for my purposes just by pulling/pushing code. If I get banned from GitHub or something I have all the local repos.
I mostly just don’t want to be stuck with cloud services from big tech that have slimy practices. I’d rather pay for honest products that let me own my data better. With the exception given to GitHub which I guess is out of my own laziness and maybe I should do something about that.
If you’re using gitea you might be interested in Forgejo, it’s a fork and I think it’s well regarded since gitea went more commercial-ish IIRC?
The idea is a contract is defined saying which options exist and what they mean. For backups, you’d get the Unix user doing the backup, what folders to backup and what patterns to exclude. But also what script can be run to create a backup and restore from a backup.
Then you’d get a contract consumer, the application to be backup, which declares what folders to backup either which users.
On the other side you have a contract provider, like Restic or Borgbackup which understand this contract and know thanks to it how to backup the application.
As the user, your role is just to plug-in a contract provider with a consumer. To choose which application backs up which application.
This can be applied to LDAP, SSO, secrets and more!
Proxmox Backup Server?
No judgement, but wanting to tinker/spend time on configuration is a major reason why many people do self-host.
p0wnland. this will have script kiddies rubbing their hands
This is nonsense. You can't self-host services meant to interact with the public (such as email, websites, Matrix servers, etc.) without a public IP, preferably one that is fixed.
I don't have a need to give people public access but if I did I would set up Authentik and proxy everything through it and hand out usernames to people I want for the whole thing (or per app). You would open only :443 and not worry about a thing.
As a bonus use caddy as forward auth, create a wildcard subdomain (cloudflare dns supports it), configure caddy for wildcard domains for sub-sub domains and dns cert verification via cloudflare token. This way nobody even knows your real domain names. Nothing they can see in DNS or certificate transparency logs. (This is my working theory. I haven't actually researched it too deep but I am doing it.) You add a new app/site in caddy's config and everything else is completely automatic. You can even use dynamic dns with a client or a script that uses the same cloudflare token to update your IP.
As I said above. Don't even need to have a public IP on this machine. Better if you don't in case something like docker or an AI agent accidentally opens a port. (Your router already protects you but I am talking about if this was on a cloud host or an ISP that gives you real IPs for each of your machines)
I recently had a bunch of breakages and needed to port a setup - I had a complicated k3s container in proxmox setup but needed it in a VM to fix various disk mounts (I hacked on ZFS mounts, and was swapping it all for longhorn)
As is expected, life happens and I stopped having time for anything so the homelab was out of commission. I probably would still be sitting on my broken lab given a lack of time.
That being said, I procrastinated on getting postgres backups working and ended up causing self-inflicted corruption, so it is nice to see you've got that setup and have thought of pretty much everything!
It's not tariffs (I'm in Switzerland). It's 100% the buildout of data centers for AI.
But I wanted decent deployments. Hosting a image repository cost 3-4x of the server. Sending over the container image took over an hour due to large image processing python dependencies.
Solution? Had a think and a chat with Claude code, now I have blue-green deployments where I just upload the code which takes 5 seconds, everything is then run by systemd. I looked at the various PaaSes but they ran up to $40/month with compute+database etc.
I would probably never have built this myself. I'd have gotten bored 1/3 through. Now it's working like a charm.
Is it enterprise grade? Gods no. Is it good enough? Yes.
When using them with production code they are a liability more than a resource.
I just wish this post wasn’t written by an LLM! I miss the days where you can feel the nerdy joy through words across the internet.
But I want to host an LLM.
I have a 1U (or more), sitting in a rack in a local datacenter. I have an IP block to myself.
Those servers are now publicly exposed and only a few ports are exposed for mail, HTTP traffic and SSH (for Git).
I guess my use case also changes in that I don’t use things just for me to consume, select others can consume services I host.
My definition here of self-hosting isn’t that I and I only can access my services; that’s be me having a server at home which has some non critical things on it.
CC lets you hack together internal tools quickly, and tailscale means you can safely deploy them without worrying about hardening the app and server from the outside world. And tailscale ACLs lets you fully control who can access what services.
It also means you can literally host the tools on a server in your office, if you really want to.
Putting CC on the server makes this set up even better. It’s extremely good at system admin.
Took a couple hours with some things I ran across, but the model had me go through the setup for debian, how to go through the setup gui, what to check to make it server only, then it took me through commands to run so it wouldn't stop when I closed the laptop, helped with tailscale, getting the ssh keys all setup. Heck it even suggested doing daily dumps of the database and saving to minio and then removing after that. Also knows about the limitations of 8 gigs of ram and how to make sure docker settings for the difference self services I want to build don't cause issues.
Give me a month and true strong intention and ability to google and read posts and find the answer on my own and I still don't think I would have gotten to this point with the amount of trust I have in the setup.
I very much agree with this topic about self hosting coming alive because these models can walk you through everything. Self building and self hosting can really come alive. And in the future when open models are that much better and hardware costs come down (maybe, just guessing of course) we'll be able to also host our own agents on these machines we have setup already. All being able to do it ourselves.
related "webdev is fun again": claude. https://ma.ttias.be/web-development-is-fun-again/
Also the "Why it matters" in the article. I thought it's a jab at AI-generated articles but it starts too look like the article was AI written as well
[1] https://martin.kleppmann.com/2025/12/08/ai-formal-verificati...
Waiting for the follow-on article “Claude Code reformatted my NAS and I lost my entire media collection.”
I share a lot of the same hesitations as others in the thread - using a giant US-based tech giant's tool for research as well as another US giant's tool to manage access, but it's really a game change and I'd be unable to find the time to do everything I want if I didn't have access to these otherwise.
I'm not even a software guy by engineering, my network is already complicated enough that learning and correctly securing things otherwise would simply just not be feasible with the time and energy I'd like to dedicate to it.
If you have your own agent, then it can talk to whatever you want - could be OpenRouter configured to some free model, or could be to a local model too. If the local model wasn't knowledgeable enough for sysadmin you could perhaps use installable skills (scripts/programs) for sysadmin tasks, with those having been written by a more powerful model/agent.
What’s the goal? If the act of _building_ a homelab is the fun then i agree 100%. If _having_ a reliable homelab that the family can enjoy is the goal, then this doesn’t matter.
For me personally, my focus is on “shipping” something reliable with little fuss. Most of my homelab skills don’t translate to my day job anyway. My homelab has a few docker compose stacks, whereas at work we have an internal platform team that lets me easily deploy a service on K8s. The only overlap here is docker lol. Manually tinkering with ports and firewall rules, using sqlite, backups with rsync, etc…all irrelevant if you’re working with AWS from 9-5.
I guess I’m just pointing out that some people want to build it and move on.
I'll agree to disagree on it not being applicable. Having fundamental knowledge on topics like networking thru homelabbing have helped me develop my understanding from the ground up. It helps in ways that are not always obvious. But if your goal is purely to be better at your job at work, it is not the most efficient path.
In that case, it's not about the 'joy of creation', but actually getting everything up and running again, in which case LLMs are indispensable.
Enlightenment here comes when you realize others are doing the exact same thing with the exact same justification, and everyone's pain/reward threshold is different. The argument you are making justifies their usage as well as yours.
From to time, test the restore process.
They tend to slip out of declarative mode and start making untracked changes to the system from time to time.
>I am spending time using software, learning, and having fun - instead of maintaining it and stressing out about it.
Using software, learning and having fun with with what? everything is being done by Claude here. The part of fun and learning is to learn to use and maintain it in the first place. How will you learn anything if Claude is doing everything for you ? You are not understand how things work and where everything goes.
This post could be written or at least modified by an LLM, but more importantly I think this person is completely missing the point of self hosting and learning.
I did it! Except you didn't and you don't know anything about what it did or learned anything along the way. Success?
But for what i'm using Agents right now, claude code is the tool to go.
workdir/ ├── README.md ├── CLAUDE.md # Claude Code instructions ├── BACKUP.md # Backup documentation ├── .gitignore ├── traefik/ │ ├── docker-compose.yml │ └── config/ │ └── traefik.yml ├── authentik/ │ ├── docker-compose.yml │ └── .env.example ├── umami/ │ ├── docker-compose.yml │ └── .env.example ├── n8n/ │ ├── docker-compose.yml │ └── .env.example └── backup/ ├── backup.sh # Automated backup script ├── restore.sh # Restore from backup ├── verify.sh # Verify backup integrity ├── list-backups.sh # List available backups └── .env.example
We've gone a step further, and made this even easier with https://zo.computer
You get a server, and a lot of useful built-in functionality (like the ability to text with your server)
I agree you could use LLMs to learn how it works, but given that they explain and do the actions, I suspect the vast majority aren't learning anything. I've helped students who are learning to code, and very often they just copy/paste back and forth and ignore the actual content.
And I find the stuff that the average self hoster needs is so surface level that LLMs flawlessly provide solutions.
If you're self hosting for other reasons then that's fine. I self host media for various reasons, but I also give all my email/calendar/docs/photos over to a big tech company because I'm not motivated by that aspect.
They also aren't seeing any of your sensitive data being hosted on the server. At least the way I use them is getting suggestions for what software and configs I should go with, and then I do the actual doing. Which means I'm becoming independently more capable than I was before.
I'm asking Claude technical questions about setup, e.g., read this manual, that I have skimmed but don't necessarily fully understand yet. How do I monitor this service? Oh connect Tailscale and manage with ACLs. But what do I do when it doesn't work or goes down? Ask Claude.
To get more accurate setup and diagnostics, I need to share config files, firewall rules, IPv6 GUAs, Tailscale ACLs... and Claude just eats it up, and now Anthropic knows it forever too. Sure, CGNET, Wireguard, and ssh logins stand between us, but... Claude is running a terminal window on a LAN device next to another terminal window that does have access to my server. Do I trust VS Code? Anthropic? The FOSS? Is this really self-hosting? Ahh, but I am learning stuff, right?
Tbh I did the mistake of throwing away Ansible, so testing my setup was a pain!
Since with AI, the focus should be on testing, perhaps it's sensible to drop Ansible for something like https://github.com/goss-org/goss
Things are happening so fast, I was impressed to see a Linux distro embrace using a SKILL.md! https://github.com/basecamp/omarchy/blob/master/default/omar...
I’ll bite. You can save a lot of money by buying used hardware. I recommend looking for old Dell OptiPlex towers on Facebook Marketplace or from local used computer stores. Lenovo ThinkCentres (e.g., m700 tiny) are also a great option if you prefer something with a smaller form factor.
I’d recommend disregarding advice from non-technical folks recommending brand new, expensive hardware, because it’s usually overkill.
And then you can only use distros which have a raspberry pi specific build. Generic ARM ones won't work.
I build out my server in Docker and I’ve been surprised that every image I’ve ever wanted to download has an ARM image.
I'm not familiar with Dell product names specifically but 'tower' sounds like it'll sit there burning 200W idle. Old laptops (sliding out the battery) is what I've been opting for, which use barely anything more than the router it sits next to. Especially if you just want to serve static files as GP seems to be looking for, an old smartphone will be enough but there you can't remove the battery (since it won't run off of just the charger)
My first "server" was a 65€ second-hand laptop including shipping iirc, in ~2010 euros so say maybe 100€ now when taking inflation into account. I used that for a number of years and had a good idea of what I wanted from my next setup (which wasn't much heavier, but a little newer cpu wasn't amiss after 3 years). Don't think one needs to even go so far as 200$ for a "local Bandcamp archive" (static file storage) and serving that via some streaming webserver
Jellyfin docs do mention "Not having a GPU is NOT recommended for Jellyfin, as video transcoding on the CPU is very performance demanding" but that's for on-the-fly video transcoding. If you transcode your videos to the desired format(s) upon import, or don't have any videos at all yet as in GP's case, it doesn't matter if the hardware is 20x slower. Worst case, you just watch that movie in source material quality: on a LAN you won't have network speed bottlenecks anyway, and transcoding on GPU is much more expensive (purchase + ongoing power costs) than the gigabit ethernet that you can already find by default on every laptop and router
(In)famous last words?
For now I'm just using Cloudflare tunnels, but ideally I also want to do that myself (without getting DDoS)
The structure is dead simple: `machines/<hostname>/stacks/<service>/` with a `config.sh` per machine defining SSH settings and optional pre/post deploy hooks. One command syncs files and runs `docker compose up -d`.
I could see Claude Code being useful for debugging compose files or generating new stack configs, but having the deployment itself be a single `./deploy.sh homeserver media` keeps the feedback loop tight and auditable.
Which basically accomplishes same thing, but gives a bit more UI for debugging when needed.
It's simple enough and I had some prior experience with it, so I merely have some variables, roles that render a docker-compose.yml.j2 template and boom. It all works, I have easy access to secrets, shared variables among stacks and run it with a simple `ansible-playbook` call.
If I forget/don't know the Ansible modules, Claude or their docs are really easy to use.
Every time I went down a bash script route I felt like I was re-inventing something like Ansible.
For example - I have ZFS running with a 5-bay HDD enclosure, and I honestly can't remember any of the rules about import-ing / export-ing to stop / start / add / remove pools etc.
I have to write many clear notes, and store them in a place where future me will find them - otherwise the system gets very flaky through my inability to remember what's active and what isn't. Running the service and having total control is fun, but it's a responsibility too
If you need to run the command once, you can now run it again in the future.
It's very tempting to just paste some commands (or ask AI to do it) but writing simple scripts like this is an amazing solution to these kinds of problems.
Even if the scripts get outdated and no longer work (maybe it's a new version of X) it'll give you a snapshot of what was done before.
In this case you will be completely unable to navigate the infrastructure of your homeserver that your life will have become dependent on.
But a homeserver is always about your levels of risk, single points of failure. I'm personally willing to accept Tailscale but I'm not willing to give the manipulation of all services directly over to Claude.
I wonder if a local model might be enough for sysadmin skills, especially if were trained specifically for this ?
I wonder if iOS has enough hooks available that one could make a very small/simple agentic Siri replacement like this that was able to manage the iPhone at least better than Siri (start and stop apps, control them, install them, configure iPhone, etc) ?
What I've found: Claude Code is great at the "figure out this docker/nginx/systemd incantation" part but the orchestration layer (health checks, rollbacks, zero-downtime deploys) still benefits from purpose-built tooling. The AI handles the tedious config generation while you focus on the actual workflow.
github.com/elitan/frost if curious
Historically, managed platforms like Fly.io, Render, and DigitalOcean App Platform existed to solve three pain points: 1. Fear of misconfiguring Linux 2. Fear of Docker / Compose complexity 3. Fear of “what if it breaks at 2am?”
CLI agents (Claude Code, etc.) dramatically reduce (1) and (2), and partially reduce (3).
So the tradeoff has changed from:
“Pay $50–150/month to avoid yak-shaving” → “Pay $5–12/month and let an agent do the yak-shaving”
(and no, this product is not against TOS as it is using the official claude code SDK unlike opencode https://yepanywhere.com/tos-compliance.html)
And ironically all in the name of "self hosting". Claude code defies both words in that.
Then someday we self-host the AI itself, and it all comes together.
My self hosted things all run as docker containers inside Alpine VMs running on top of Proxmox. Services are defined with Docker Compose. One of those things is a Forgejo git server along with a runner in a separate VM. I have a single command that will deploy everything along with a Forgejo action that invokes that command on a push to main.
I then have Renovate running periodically set to auto-merge patch-level updates and tag updates.
Thus, Renovate keeps me up to date and git keeps everyone honest.
Is there a replica implementation that works in the direction I want?
And until now without AI, but I'm kind of curious but afraid that it will bring my servers down and then I can't roll back :D But perhaps if I would move over to NixOS, then it would be easy to roll back.
I route it through a familiar interface like slack tho as I don't like to ssh from phone or w/e using a tool I built - https://www.claudecontrol.com/
And ideally doing it via lxc or vm.
Extra complication but gives you something repeatable that you can stick on git
But I wouldn't give the keys of the house to Claude or any LLM for that matter. When needed, I ask them questions and type commands myself. It's not that hard.
Avoid stacking in too many hard drives since each one uses almost as much power as the desktop does at idle.
Is it just a single docker-compose.yml with everything you want to run and 'docker compose up'?
Agents are powerful. Even more so with skills and command line tools they can call to do things. You can even write custom tools (like I did) for them to use that allows for things like live debugging.
The tailscale piece to this setup is key.
I am writing a personal application to simplify home server administration if anybody is interested: https://github.com/prettydiff/aphorio
Its comedic at this point.
I suspect it may have been related to the Network File System (NFS)? Like whenever I read a file on the host machine, it goes across the data-center network and charges me? Is this correct?
Anyway, I just decided to take control of those costs. Took me 2 weeks of part-time work to migrate all my stuff to a self-hosted machine. I put everything behind Cloudflare with a load balancer. Was a bit tricky to configure as I'm hosting multiple domains from the same machine. It's a small form factor PC tower with 20 CPU cores; easily runs all my stuff though. In 2 months, I already recouped the full cost of the machine through savings in my AWS bill. Now I pay like $10 a month to Cloudflare and even that's basically an optional cost. I strongly recommend.
Anyway it's impressive how AWS costs had been creeping slowly and imperceptibly over time. With my own machine, I now have way more compute than I need. I did a calculation and figured out that to get the same CPU capacity (no throttling, no bandwidth limitations) on AWS, I would have to pay like $1400 per month... But amortized over 4 years my machine's cost is like $20 per month plus $5 per month to get a static IP address. I didn't need to change my internet plan other than that. So AWS EC2 represented a 56x cost factor. It's mind-boggling.
I think it's one of these costs that I kind of brushed under the carpet as "It's an investment." But eventually, this cost became a topic of conversation with my wife and she started making jokes about our contribution to Jeff Bezos' wife's diamond ring. Then it came to our attention that his megayacht is so large that it comes with a second yacht beside it. Then I understood where he got it all from. Though to be fair to him, he is a truly great businessman; he didn't get it from institutional money or complex hidden political scheme; he got it fair and square through a very clever business plan.
Over 5 years or so that I've been using AWS, the costs had been flat. Meanwhile the costs of the underlying hardware had dropped to like 1/56th... and I didn't even notice. Is anything more profitable than apathy and neglect?
Bandwidth inside the same zone is free.
Maybe viable if you have a bunch of spare parts laying around. But probably not when RAM and storage prices are off the charts!
I had a 30-year-old file on my Mac that I wanted to read the content of. I had created it in some kind of word processing software, but I couldn’t remember which (Nexus? Word? MacWrite? ClarisWorks? EGWORD?) and the file didn’t have an extension. I couldn’t read its content in any of the applications I have on my Mac now.
So I pointed CC at it and asked what it could tell me about the file. It looked inside the file data, identified the file type and the multiple character encodings in it, and went through a couple of conversion steps before outputting as clean plain text what I had written in 1996.
Maybe I could have found a utility on the web to do the same thing, but CC felt much quicker and easier.
There are a few important things to consider, like unstable IPs, home internet limits, and the occasional power issue. Cloud providers felt overpriced for what I needed, especially once storage was factored in.
In the end, I put together a small business where people can run their own Mac mini with a static IP: https://www.minimahost.com/
I’m continuing to work on it while keeping my regular software job. So far, the demand is not very high, or perhaps I am not great at marketing XD
Granted, that's rarely enforced, but if you're a stickler for that sort of thing, check your ISP's Acceptable Use Policy.
Though just blocking particular ports for this purpose is very 90s and obviously ineffective, as you demonstrated. Anybody proficient in installing wireguard also knows how to change ports.
That's the flaw right there. Don't mix company assets with pricate use. Phone, laptop, car. Your life is already very dependent on your employer (through income), don't get yourself locked in even more by depending on them for personal tech. Plus it's a security risk to your company.
Unless you have a low paying job, which rarely anybody on HN does, you can afford your own phone and laptop. And IT won't find your messages to girlfriend or pictures you don't want others to see or browsing history.
Lol, no thank you. Btw do your knees hurt?
I still struggle with letting go of writing code and becoming only a full-time reviewer when it comes to AI agents doing programming, but I don't struggle in the slightest with assuming the position of a reviewer of the changes CC does to my HA instance, delegating all the work to it. The progress I made on making my house smart and setting up my dashboards has skyrocketed compared to before I started using CC to manage HA via its REST and WS APIs.
All those fancy GUIs in Mac and Windows designed to be user friendly (but which most users hate and are baffled by anyway) are very hostile for models to access. But text configuration files? it's like a knife through butter for the LLMs to read and modify them. All of a sudden, Linux is MORE user friendly because you can just ask an LLM to fix things. Or even script them - "make it so my theme changes to dark at night and then back to light each morning" becomes something utterly trivial compared to the coding LLMs are being built to handle. But hey, if your OS really doesn't support something? the LLM can probably code up a whole app for you and integrate it in.
I think it's going to be fascinating to see if the power of text based interfaces and their natural compatibility with LLMs transfers over into an upswing in open source operating systems.
Thanks
Claude and Gemini have been instrumental in helping me understand the core concepts of kubernetes, how to tune all these enterprise applications for high latency, think about architecture etc...
My biggest "wow, wtf?" moment was ben I was discussing the cluster architecture with Claude. It asked: want me to start the files?
I thought it meant update the notes, so replied 'yes'.
It spit out 2 sh files and 5 YAMLs that completely bootstrapped my cluster with a full GitOps setup using ArgoCD.
Learning while having a 24/7 senior tutor next to me has been insane value.