> This approach avoids the overly restricted verification requirements (e.g., program complexity constraints)
Maybe i'm missing something, but isn't that a bad thing?
Maybe i'm missing something, but isn't that a bad thing?
But you wouldn't want to use that for the actual firewall for example, or with a production service. There's no general "bad". Just different contexts.
1. This requires root.
2. eBPF also requires root usually. As I understand it it was originally meant to be secure enough to allow unprivileged use but Spectre ruined that and now they've given up on that.
Why judge the whole Rust community for the choices made by one minor subgroup?
Perhaps the world is too complex without breaking it down into in-groups and out-groups, with any out-groups supposedly being completely homogenous. Pretty intellectually lazy but fairly common on HN, to the point where it’s not even worth calling out.
(I may come across as an Ada zealot myself.)
Has full Ada solved their unsafe de-allocation problem in a way that's comparable to the borrow checker's guarantees?
You should take another look, lots have changed in this scene.
One could also say some in the C or C++ communities actually care about security, thus no need for Rust or alike, yet no one is paying attention to those small groups in the corner.
A village is judged by its population actions, and even the black sheeps count to its overall image from outsiders.
As for that sentence: I think Rust has its place, I do not agree at all with their 'rewrite' mantra because there are a ton of risks associated with rewrites that have nothing to do in what language the code is written in, just that it is a rewrite.
I think the Rust folks should go all-in on Redox and fix their tool optimization issues. And do one thing and do that well rather than to be the next Swiss army knife of programming. And I also think that the C and C++ folks can do a lot better still. Filip is doing something interesting I think and if there a practical solution to the C heritage I think it lies more in his direction than in rewriting billions of lines of battle tested code. Performance isn't nearly as important as it used to be. Another thing that I think would be beneficial would be to take as many device drivers out of the linux kernel as possible and run them as userspace processes.
Anyway, belated Merry Christmas to you and a pre-emptive happy 2026!
You’re then accusing me of being intellectually lazy for not giving high karma accounts the respect they deserve. Come off it. I’m going to judge comments by their content, not by the karma of the author. You shaming me is not going to make me change that.
What’s crazy is that judging people by their karma instead of their words is actually lazy. Isn’t this obvious? Do I need to get another 20k karma before you’ll understand that?
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46352728
So apparently it is fine for you to call out low karma accounts but I can't have you shit on a member in excellent standing here?
The Rust community has - rightly, in my opinion - flagged a number of serious concerns about language safety. Outside of that Rust is just another programming language and languages are just one of the parts of the security picture. There is process, general hygiene and a lot of hard learned lessons about how you keep systems secure regardless of what language a particular piece of code is written in.
Given the amount of Rust evangelization on HN (which is one of the reasons this link got posted in the first place) and the fact that they can't let any opportunity go by to shit on other languages and those that use them for reasons that are unclear to me (and this goes quite far, up to and including questioning the sanity of anybody writing in a systems language other than Rust) you can expect that that higher standard is applied to the Rust advocates in the same way.
Action begets reaction.
Your response is telling: you make a personal attack on a member of HN and then hide behind pointing out the flaws in 'the community' when in fact it is you that is poisoning the community with these kind of comments.
I've made it a rule since a couple of weeks that I'm tossing accounts like that onto my blacklist because really, life's too short. If you don't see value in HN discussing languages and their communities (and I have to give the Rust community some credit here, as the language matures they've become more realistic about their abilities and there is less zealotry, especially Steve Klabik deserves a mention) then it may be that you are in the wrong place. For me your account will cease to exist after this comment.
Me calling out a sock puppet account (0 karma, created minutes before) is not the same as you saying that high karma accounts need to have their opinions respected simply because they are high karma. Coincidentally, I notice your account is very high karma.
You’re acting extraordinarily offended, like I’ve committed some major transgression here. I haven’t. I’ve re-read my comments and they’re frankly milquetoast.
ffs
Rust Striking Force meme exists for a reason, their actions are also not supported by the core team.
Many of the core team and by large its community witness RESF in action for long before sending in a few words isn't exactly not supported in my book.
But then again I understand every PL needs a lot of push and marketing. It just went way too far in one direction.
It seems a little disingenuous to describe "community" as including people who haven't even attempted to interact with anyone in the community other than forking their code.
And this is very much also something which is helped along by the community’s defining voices.
but I realized that in the past decade or so all of my kernel experiments are being done in little baby kernels. virtualization and the sheer volume of open source makes this a perfectly good path. and frankly Linux isn't that lovely to work in and extend.
the current situation with kernel modules and symbol resolution is a crappy boundary that really gets in your way as a developer, and from a security perspective is really just crime scene tape.
so we should really try to clean up and harden production systems, and understand that we will need the playground to inform that activity. right now we have neither, and this clearly belongs in the playground.