Hacker News Reader

Comment by apparent | Hacker News Reader

In terms of long-term market viability, have you considered whether your success could encourage Apple or other large competitors to make a battery life-optimized version of their smartwatches?

I understand that some Pebble fans are all about the customization, and will be with you forever. But probably many people care mostly about the battery life, which is severely lacking in watches from Apple, Google, etc.

If Apple realized there was a big enough market to justify making a $200 Apple Watch Basic, how much could that undercut your business?

Relatedly, when will we learn more about the other "core" devices that you're contemplating, and which you alluded to in the video? Building more of a unique ecosystem could help with the moat.

View on HN

> In terms of long-term market viability, have you considered whether your success could encourage Apple or other large competitors to make a battery life-optimized version of their smartwatches?

Companies like Garmin, Coros and Suunto already make less-smart-watches with weeks of battery life, and those haven't convinced Apple to budge from only making watches that do everything under the sun but barely last a day. Another long-lasting watch from a tiny brand probably isn't going to move the needle.

IDK about Coros or Suunto, but the only Garmins with a battery life approaching 30 days cost ~$1,000. This could be competition for AWU, but wouldn't communicate that there is demand for a more basic/long-lasting Apple Watch.

30 days is asking a lot of any reasonably sized smartwatch, but if you set your sights a bit lower then a $250 Coros Pace 4 will do ~3 weeks with AOD off, ~1 week with AOD on, and 30-40 hours of continuous GPS recording. That's still a lot longer than any Apple Watch even if it's not hitting the 30 day milestone.

Yeah I don't need 30 days, but starting out at a week with AOD puts a pretty low ceiling on future battery life. Appreciate the pointer though.

In thinking further, I realized that the buttons are actually a pretty good moat against the big tech company competitors. Their UIs are all about touchscreens, so they'll never have as many/useful buttons as Pebbles do.

My Coros Pace 2 was my solution to my desire for a less smart watch. It cost $200 when I got it 3 years ago. I run a ton and the exercise features of the Pebble just didn’t do it for me (and I don’t want to keep swapping watches based on what I’m doing). I easily get 2+ weeks with 7-8 exercises with GPS on. The screen is some variation of those transflective LCDs or MIPs LCDs.

I can never go back to a 2 day battery life for a watch, even if my 5 year old iPhone technically can’t make it through half a day of use….

> The screen is some variation of those transflective LCDs or MIPs LCDs.

They just switched to OLED with the Pace 4, for better or worse. AOD battery life took a hit but it does look a lot nicer than MIP.

Yeah, I’m not sure if I like that choice from them. I really like the look of their non OLED displays. This has been my favorite running watch, and I’ve used it the longest out of all the different watches I’ve had. Although if I want them to keep existing as a company I should consider buying another.

I've got an Instinct Solar 2x and it does last 30 days for me, and it's much cheaper than $1000.

Didn't realize Garmin made monochrome solar watches. It is much cheaper. However, looks like an absolute tank, which would not fit under many shirtsleeves...

Unfortunately, they have been replacing in new models the monochrome MIP display with colorful AMOLED with less battery life.

Unlikely pebble to get 30days with garmin type usage either. A forerunner with mip display should survive for 2+ weeks though

Smart watches with long battery life exist. Garmin watches generally have ~2 week battery life:

* Venu 3 for $350 has 2 week battery life [1]

* Forerunner 55 for $150 has 2 week battery life [2]

I don't see why you are defining success as 30 days of battery life when the baseline is charging your watch every day.

[1] https://www.garmin.com/en-US/p/873008/pn/010-02784-00/

[2] https://www.garmin.com/en-US/p/741137/

> I don't see why you are defining success as 30 days of battery life when the baseline is charging your watch every day.

Up until about 10 years ago, no one would have considered the baseline to be charging your watch every day. Even today, most watches/wrist-worn step counters don't require daily charging.

I wouldn't define 30 days as success, but I do want to start out at 2+ weeks. Battery life gets worse over time, and watches aren't meant to last for just a little while. I don't want to spend hundreds of dollars on something that will require charging more than once a week within a year or two.

Appreciate the links, but I'm guessing these are estimates with AOD disabled? That's another benefit of the Pebble (AOD doesn't reduce battery life).

The baseline for watches is changing the battery every 3-5 YEARS! This modernity of charging watches daily is a pox on humanity brought on by Apple.

Pebble (and Fitbit, and others) were always in the "week-plus" timeframe for charging. Meeting the "minimum bar" of 14-17 days battery life (of the OG pebbles) is successful. Shooting for "30 days" is definitively best-in-class performance for smart-watches!

When I first bought my pixel watch 2 I was able to optimize the settings to get almost 3 days of battery life.

A year of firmware updates later, I am back down to less than 2 days using the same settings.

I don't think the big manufacturers are going to change their ways anytime soon...

I sold my Pixel Watch 2, but I wasn't able to get two days' worth. The sacrifices weren't worth it.

Namely, you'd have to turn off the always on screen (I gave this up easily), as well as "flick to wake", which I found harder to give up.

If I were to press a button on my watch to read a notification, I may as well use my phone. YMMV.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com