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Comment by baxtr | Hacker News Reader

I am no expert at all in this topic! So please take this with a grain of salt. I just have the feeling (maybe wrongly) that the love and focus for bees is having detrimental/ unwanted effects on the ecosystem.

Here some more articles / discussions:

* https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44505552

* https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44792207

* https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35668879

View on HN

My love for bees is more about their behavior (similar to how I find ants fascinating), and their "products" that is honey, propolis, beeswax, and so on. I am simply fascinated by their behaviors, and propolis is very healthy!

that read like "source please" then "sauce is yummy"

I am not sure what you are trying to imply.

If you are referring to what I asked: "What are those adversarial effects, what other pollinators, and how does it hurt the ecosystem more than it helps?", then all I have to say about it is that I am just genuinely curious.

I have always been enamored with "social" insects like bees, wasps, and ants. I _loved_ SimAnt as a child.

It also blows my mind that I utterly balk at eating insects but bee vomit is totally cool.

Oh my, I just looked for a screenshot of SimAnt. I remember this game, too! I have played it for some time, too. :)

You can play it in a browser: https://archive.org/details/msdos_SimAnt_-_The_Electronic_An...

Oh cool! I am doing the tutorial and it told me to click on "MAP" which I did, and then nothing happened. :( Any ideas?

Did it say to click on map or Window menu -> map?

https://i.imgur.com/LbCx8jQ.png

Window menu -> MAP, so I assumed it was "MAP". Where is the "Window menu" exactly?

It's at the top of the game window: https://i.imgur.com/xqh2rrY.png

Oh, that! Thank you!

SimAnt and SimEarth were my faves as a kid!

Why won’t you let „the ecosystem“ decide that on its own ? It’s much older than you and you are not its lega guardian. If the ecosystem (of which we are a part) decides it wants more honey bees than that’s what it shall get.

The idea that ecosystems naturally balance themselves is a pervasive myth.

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environment/article/balan...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balance_of_nature

>It’s much older than you and you are not its legal guardian.

A fair few cultures believe they are. NZ recognises the Whanganui River as having legal personhood.

If we're a part of the ecosystem, then deciding to be honey bees' legal guardian _is_ the ecosystem deciding that on its own, no?

Yes exactly, doing nothing or doing something is the same.

We are part of the ecosystem. So any discussion we’re having is also part of being and operating in the ecosystem…

The same reason you bandage a stab wound instead of letting the body decide what it wants.

It doesn't want anything or have the ability to choose its responses to changes. Which is exactly why we are the legal guardians of natural ecosystems, by the way - have you not heard of lands and waters protected from certain human activities? The fact that we don't currently stop ourselves from propogating honeybees into ecosystems that can't fit them is not an indication of anything except our failures.

I guess it’s a fair point.

But then again, since as you argue (rightfully so!) that I’m also part of the ecosystem: me caring and expressing doubts is actually working as the ecosystem.

That’s how I’m being (virtually) a part of it.

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