Comment by valleyer | Hacker News Reader

Comment by valleyer | Hacker News Reader

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> where are people expected to learn these implicit rules? If the store doesn’t care enough to communicate these expectations (assuming they even have them, and that they don’t only exist in the minds of the self-appointed “cart police”), why should customers follow them?

The rules are not implicit; there are typically giant signs saying "RETURN CART HERE" over a metal cart corral that often contains other carts.

People are expected to learn this during their first or second trip to a grocery store that offers carts.

Similarly, at a full-service restaurant, you will be able to notice busboys picking up used tableware, and you will notice a scarcity of customer-accessible garbage bins (as compared to, say, a self-service fast-food restaurant).

If you are ever unsure of the protocol, you are always welcome to ask an employee. Employees at these businesses are typically distinguished by wearing a uniform.

Hope these tips help you on your future trips to Kroger/McDonald's/Olive Garden.

That's because the business is trying to save on their own manpower costs by shifting some of the burden to their customers -- much like self-checkout.

If by returning my cart I was helping the employees, I'd be inclined to go out of my way to do so. But actually all I'm doing is helping the business, who is trying to cut as many employees as possible (talking about big stores like Walmart, Target, not some small local grocery that might even be employee owned).

By that logic, why not also just throw your trash on the ground? And, if you need to use the restroom while you're there, why not just pee on the floor?

That would be a great way to fight the business, which would love to employ fewer people to clean that stuff up by shifting the burden of doing it right onto you, the customer.

That was unhelpful. You can take almost any logic to an extreme; doesn't mean it's still logical :/

Fair. The greater point was that you're not just "helping the business" by maintaining a clean environment (whether the "dirt" be carts or excrement). You're also helping your fellow humans.

And, in fact, you almost certainly are helping employees. Sure, there could be fewer of them, but they'd be doing less menial work. And the ones who got laid off due to your contentiousness would find less menial work elsewhere. Society as a whole would benefit.

You probably already know this, but the idea that we should make the world worse to preserve people's jobs is called the broken-windows fallacy.

I probably should have just responded with that originally.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parable_of_the_broken_window

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