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Comment by MichaelZuo | Hacker News Reader

So then where are the premium HVAC companies for the residential market charging a higher price but offering credible guarantees?

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If you want to understand the state of these industries I highly recommend reading "How contracting because a race to the bottom"[0]. The crux of the problem is that unlicensed/uninsured firms will always undercut "quality" firms for small jobs. If you are getting a quote from a firm that actually pays workers compensation insurance it's going to be at a substantially higher price.

[0] https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/07/magazine/contractors-cons...

You can hire from a sole proprietor working on his own behalf. Since he's working for himself he doesn't need workers comp but yet can still be licensed and legally operating.

My wife and I bought a house in 2022. It's an old home (built in the late 1800s) that underwent a gut rehab by a real estate firm in 2018-19, and which they subsequently ran as an Airbnb for several years owing to the pandemic and its effects on the housing market.

By 2024, it became apparent that while the rehab squad had done a really amazing job on most of the house, they also cut corners here and there and made some costly mistakes... well, costly to us.

We needed two major jobs done on the house, both for the exterior. I got several quotes from respected contracting firms in the St. Louis area, and the best price for Job A was around USD $40k while the best price for Job B was around $20k. Those were all multi-employee firms and promised to get the jobs done in just a few days once they could get started (booked solid for 5+ months).

Long story short, we ended up hiring a local solo contractor (never has helpers) with 40+ years experience who only takes cash and is something of a perfectionist (and dare devil!). Watching him work and talking to him about his work, it's clear he considers his efforts to be labors of love and a kind of art to which he is deeply devoted. He got the work done in a timely manner and was careful to abide by all the rules of the neighborhood association related to exteriors of historic homes. He charged USD $8k and $5 for the jobs, a massive savings for us! I'm not sure what we'll do in 20 years when we'll likely need another round of work and this guy is in his late 80s.

Best I can do is $1000 to change a capacitor that any tom dick or harry could do, and $10,000 to install a mini split that I literally did myself for $1000 in tools and watching 8 hours of youtube.

The industry is largely a scam. There is no reason why you need a brick and mortar fixed business for many HVAC tasks. On one occasion, I knew exactly what was wrong but as a tenant so I could not perform the work myself. I had to deduct $1000 rent from my landlord becaues I had to pay an HVAC guy so I would not break the law literally replacing a plug-and-play blower motor myself. The guy didn't diagnose anything, or need any skill, I just told him exactly what to do and he was in and out in like 5 minutes.

Calling the industry largely a scam is pretty strong. Of course for the small minority of technically competent people with interest and time it will always be cheaper to do something yourself rather than pay a business to accomplish the same thing. But most people cannot/do not want to do it themselves, and regulations are there at least partially to help protect them against the house-fire-waiting-to-happen untrained handyman.

Sure a bunch of businesses opportunistically up-charge, some I'm sure are predatory, and there are obviously efficiencies to improve, but overall scam it is not.

A building is where a business stores tools and inventory, provides desks with computers and phones, and parks the trucks at night.

Those companies are doing premium work for good customers...or at least charging enough to make dealing with poor customers less an issue.

In the case of the author, the $22k quote is a good way of segmenting the market. Remember the author was just a prospect, not a client since the author choked on the price.

How does a prospective customer tell if a high price is just a confidence trick, or if it’s genuinely indicative of a high credibility company?

A busy residential HVAC company does many many jobs a year. A highly reputable tradesperson will happily give you a long list of references…I once had a conversation with a roofer who metaphorically pointed his finger and said “I did that roof and that roof and that roof over there and three on the next block…please ask those customers.”

A grifter will not give you that kind of answer…unless they are admirably good.

Go with a good vendor and you won't have a problem.

The problem is, of course, that both good and bad vendors will charge similar amounts.

You have to find someone who is local and stands by their work (this can be tough but talk to neighbors/friends/etc). Then treat them well by always paying a tip over the quoted price. Honest businesspeople exist, they will remember your generosity, stand by their work, and go the extra mile to make it right if they make a mistake.

It's relationships, not legal guarantees. There's not enough paper in the world to protect you from a dishonest contractor or tradesman. Finding someone honest and then overpaying is the premium option.

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