Comment by bugsbunnyak | Hacker News Reader

Comment by bugsbunnyak | Hacker News Reader

For what it's worth, this doesn't happen in a vacuum. If you want to read the arguments, enter the patent number 8276057 at this website:

http://portal.uspto.gov/external/portal/pair

Look under the heading "file wrapper" for all the communication. In particular, read:

	 CTNF	Non-Final Rejection
	 REM	Applicant Arguments/Remarks Made in an Amendment
	 NPL	Non Patent Literature
         NOA	Notice of Allowance and Fees Due (PTOL-85)

The initial rejection (CTNF) is followed by applicant rebuttal (REM), several prior-art searchs (NPL) and then the acceptance (NOA, first document with 6 pages).

I'm not bored enough to read the whole thing, but the claims seem to have been some constrained on very technical points.

Please note: this patent is completely bogus, and I am not defending it. I am pointing this out because I think it is critically important for people to understand how the process works. Otherwise all this hand-wringing is for naught (and those who don't learn from history, etc...)

A suggestion for an enterprising web designer who happens to also be a bored 2L: make a website to semi-automate collation of prior art challenges. Court is not the only way to challege a patent. Patents can be challenged by 3rd parties through an "ex-parte re-examination request". One of the big limitations to this is the cost of the legal process and prior-art search/summation. I'm dreaming of a website that would allow crowd-sourcing to get 95% of the way to a ready-to-file submission, which could then be vetted and finalized by pro-bono lawyers, students in legal clinic, etc.

For those who haven't seen it:

http://patents.stackexchange.com/

(This is the same as askpatents.com)

And a link to a question specifically pertaining to this patent:

http://patents.stackexchange.com/questions/535/prior-art-for...

Someone should post this on AskPatents.com, to make sure the Patent Office sees it, or is it too late for that already?

The patent is valid as of the issue date. A re-examination request can be filed at any time during the life of the patent.

I haven't yet heard what, if any, formal relationship AskPatents.com will have to the examination process going forward. However, at least for an already-issued patent a re-exam would be required.

From my understanding the director of the patent office David Kappos, was the one that asked the people at stack exchange to make this site. I suppose they indeed haven't given any further details of how they will interact, but I don't see him taking this initiative without intending to bring to the attention of his office the patent questions which receive the highest votes. (seeing that is how stack exchange works anyways.)

The promotion by the director is a great sign, and I can see AskPatents being very useful for prior-art searches (one of the results of which is the NPL document referenced above). It will hopefully improve results and save money.

Absent some statutory changes, it's hard to see how it will impact the prescribed, formal steps of the patent review process. Patent filings are a lot more complicated [edit: as compared to existing legal forms websites], but I can imagine a template interface that would allow crowd-sourcing before a final review to cross the Ts and dot the Is.

It would be phenomenal if the PTO streamlined the process themselves. Baby steps...

I just noticed this answer, which gives an overview of how to officially provide prior art for a pending patent application:

http://meta.patents.stackexchange.com/questions/105/i-want-t...

This is really neat!

I wonder if it would be possible to collect some prior art, then call up a patent holder and shake him down for a little "settlement" to keep you from filing the re-exam.

Its like trolling backwards.

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