Ask HN: Who else thinks they should add GOTO statements to Python? | Hacker News Reader

Ask HN: Who else thinks they should add GOTO statements to Python?

3 pointsn1xis10t11 comments

I don't think the "considered harmful" says much to the current coder, but I do think throwing out from deep/loop state to a target is an ugly code method which leaves all kinds of problems behind in it's wake.

Early termination of loops, assumptions about the values present, locality of reference, mutated state.

If your problem is speed, I don't think it necessarily is actually more runtime efficient. If your problem is die early, then it loses information an assert() would preserve. If your problem is a dislike of if-elif-elif- then I think you argue more for a case: statement than a GOTO.

I used them enough in the past to suffer the consequences of debugging around them. I don't miss them, they haven't consciously been in my back pocket armory for some time. I'd rather find other ways to fall through/out-of code to a fixed point.

I missed goto when I was 10 and had to stop using it because I moved beyond writing BASIC on an Apple ][.

I got over it.

I did have to use it in error handlers in Lotus Notes apps back in the 90s/00s, but that didn't make the apps better, it just was how the scripting worked. I haven't once felt the need for a goto since then.

So unless you can tell us a scenario where they work better, no - they are not needed and would cause more harm than good.

You haven’t provided any reasons for it being bad other than it being childish. Would you mind providing a few reasons why they cause harm?

The (in)famous "spaghetti code", where function is impossible to understand because of large number of goto's.

The only useful purpose for goto's I can think of is breaking out of mulitple nested loops, and this has been proposed in PEP 3136[0]. This has been rejected by Guido, see [1] - and every of his reasons applies to "goto" as well.

[0] https://peps.python.org/pep-3136/

[1] https://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-3000/2007-July/0086...

Thanks!

What would be the behavior of goto in Python? Would you have it jump across functions, modules, stay within a particular scope (file or function scope)? How would you ensure it's well-behaved when jumping into a loop body, or out of it? Saying you want it communicates nothing, explain how it would (or could) work so people can judge your idea.

I haven’t thought much about it to be honest, thanks.

I do not have strong opinions, except to ask why? I use python a lot (recreational these days) and do not miss a GOTO. Maybe though, you have a case I do not run into often.

Well, I suppose I just like them. There has been once or twice when I thought “This would be so much easier with a GOTO” but unfortunately I have no idea what those situations were, and I don’t think I wrote them down anywhere.

There is an April Fools' joke [1] that demonstrate this and I cannot tell it's readable or not...I personally find it confusing in Python, but not in C's case which can make things clearer, if you use it wisely and in moderation!

[1] https://entrian.com/goto/

Thank you

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