Guy Kawasaki on why he gave up on iOS | Hacker News Reader

Guy Kawasaki on why he gave up on iOS

gizmodo.com.au

92 pointsmtgx58 comments

Total clickbait with little substance, lets focus on something:

"So if Apple can’t keep one of its earliest employees happy...", that entire sentiment is based around the idea that Apple shouldn't do anything that's going to upset what's a very small (but vocal) group of users. That's stupid. That's some of the stupidest business advice ever.

Also, the falling on face test is a relatively good idea but it'll still hurt no matter the size unless it weighs sod all.

Agreed, and the articles about Woz saying Android is better are also more of the same. Given the number of column inches of coverage I'm surprised I've not seen a more rigorous set of metrics observe, I wonder if I'm just missing them in all the noise.

Um... the (short) article was filled with substance. There's a big block quote from Kawasaki right in the middle where he talks about all the specific things he likes about Android.

Now, those are all high level things everyone here will be familiar with. So maybe the article is mis-targetted. And the headline is clearly designed to inflame. So you can argue about that if you want.

But saying that Kawasaki's opinions have no value is just weird, and sounds like sour grapes to me. The guy was the official Mac evangelist for literally decades. Clearly his opinions are newsworthy.

The quote is substance, but the entire article lacks substance. Just quoting something does not a substantial article make. There's so little discussion or analysis that they could have just posted the quote and said "Argue in the comments".

Whenever one of these things floats up like "Woz likes Android! News at 11" I constantly slap myself on the forehead when it's taken super seriously, as Apple now is so far removed from what it was even 15 years ago. Is it surprising that people involved decades ago think it's not the same, or have moved onto something else? No. Not even a bit.

What? No, that's just wrong. The job of a journalist is to collect hard-to-find information and give it to the public; the "analysis" part is just a nice-to-have. If Kawasaki had written that on a blog post, then the article would be dumb and we should have linked there. But he didn't, he gave that quote to a journalist. And it's a good, interesting, substantial quote that the public wants to read. Thus it's useful to write about even if you have nothing to add, because it distributes the useful quote to the public.

Really, it still sounds to me like you're just upset about reading bad news about Apple.

Actually I stopped getting upset when I read anything negative about Apple when I realised I didn't care enough to feel negative. And I still think they squandered an opportunity for some really good, solid journalism. My opinion of course.

Guy worked at Apple for four years. In the eighties.

I think his opinions on IOS are about as important as mine. Or yours. Well, maybe a bit more than ours, he worked there for 4 years. In the eighties.

> Guy worked at Apple for four years. In the eighties.

Guy worked at Apple for four crucial years during the birth of the Macintosh and was instrumental to its success.

Meh.

This guy pops his head up in documetaries and occasionally in the startup blogoshpere. Usually to toot his own horn about his 80s Apple Cred.

His advice and style are hoplessly outdated and his persona is actually rather annoying.

I'm still angry about the waistcoat he wears in that dumb 'Art of the start' video that still does the rounds...

I have both an iPad and a Nexus 7. For a couple of specific things (docs, etc.) I find the larger screen size of the iPad to be handy. However, for most recreational and daily use, I find the Nexus 7 to be a better size. Functionally, they're pretty much do the same things. iOS has a better UI, Android better customizability.

If I had to pick one to use for the rest of my life, I'd go Android, without regret, for the open platform.

I have both as well, and I always really liked the iPad for reading, but now I grab the Nexus 7 first. For me it's not the size, I would love a 10" Nexus tablet, it's the whole experience.

My favorite Guy Kawasaki quote is in connection with the launch of windows 95, when someone said that windows is now as good as the Mac. He response was

"Saying Windows is equal to Macintosh is like finding a potato that looks like Jesus and believing you've witnessed the second coming".

"I love NFC, I love the fact that you can have a live widget that shows you emails."

My Nokia 701 running Symbian Belle does both of that, runs Qt apps. Nobody gave up their iPhone for Nokia though.

Nobody cared about beautiful open source Qt as a mobile framework contender driving Qt and Meego down into the dumps.

Closed garden? Nobody cared about apple's "walled garden" when Richard Stallman had been preaching against it for years/decades for the right reasons. Not because he finally found it inconvenient.

I had a Sharp Zaurus (PDA) before smart-phones were available and I loved it for the same reason. On the other hand, the ADK is much easier to use than the Qtopia (or is it back to QT Embedded?) system was and between the proliferation of Android hardware devices and the number of Java-trained programmers, I don't think it's a surprise Qtopia lost.

Qtopia and QTe both got dumped for Qt Quick, which uses Javascript for the UI.

I am one of those people that does very much care about Apple's "walled garden". The only reason I would get an Apple device is if I had to develop an app for it.

I have a friend who is an Apple fan, so I can see a lot of benefits to the Apple kool aid as he keeps on showing me all the useful things he can do on his Apple devices.

But what happens if I want to install an app that I want but Apple hasn't approved, well I have to jail break my Apple device, and that, right there, is the failure point and the reason I will never get an Apple for personal use.

If the app is available and apple hasn't approved it there are two ways to install it.

1. Have the developer set you up for an ad hoc install(free). 2. If you have the source, create a developer account and install it yourself(costs money).

1. Ad-hoc installs don't require Apple approval. This isn't a barrier for hackers.

2. iOS was supposed to be an HTML5 app device. Those install and run w/o Apple involvement at all.

3. Many of the neat tricks on Android require a rooted phone. Many neat tricks on iPhone require a jailbroken phone. Same idea. Again, not a barrier for hackers.

4. Computing succeeds when people can use it without stress, like they use their fridge or lately their car. iOS is closer to that today. I believe in a future where everyone can have the knowledge of the world in their hand -- and use it. And that, right there, is why I evangelize non-hackers to get an Apple for personal use. They quit just carrying a smartphone, and start using one.

re: 1

They require the payment of $100 a year, to Apple, which certainly implies Apple approval (they could just choose to not take your money and grant you a cert.)

> 3. Many of the neat tricks on Android require a rooted phone. Many neat tricks on iPhone require a jailbroken phone. Same idea. Again, not a barrier for hackers.

I don't think this is necessarily true. And even if it is, you can buy a phone that supports rooting out of the box if you want. Apple will never support jailbreaking.

Huh? Did Nokia actually make it viable to create Qt apps? I mean for a significant volume of phones with a prospect of longevity? My impression is most cool Nokia projects of recent years were shot down internally before they had a chance to prove themselves.

Guy Kawasaki is basically a PR guy and promoter who also does some VC stuff. So a new client gave him their product, and he's pitching the product. Big whoop.

The good news here is that the polish on Android phones is getting good enough that selling phones is a PR/marketing exercise. That and the re-entry of Microsoft should mean that all the players will need to keep the innovation process going.

Android does contain a lot of innovations that make it really cool from a UX standpoint, even to an Apple fan (especially a long-time Apple fan like Guy). The whole intents architecture, which lets you slot in any application to fulfill an intent, is really innovative and reminds me of where Apple was trying to go in the nineties with its next-gen Mac before Mac OS X swept in and took over.

By comparison iOS is in many ways a lot more like the Lisa than the Macintosh: rigid and inflexible, and possessed of system-supplied apps and workflows for common things which you are supposed to use without complaint.

Apple builds such nice hardware though ....

Gee .... somebody should port Android to the iphone!!

It would be the best of all worlds... :O

While I'm not an Apple zealot by any stretch of the imagination, the biggest complaint is the lack of additional browsers.

You can get Chrome on iOS now (thankfully).

I just wish that Samsung or someone else would up their game hardware wise. I love Android, but I do not like any of the hardware choices.

He mentions that you can get additional browsers but that you can't set them as the default when you click on a link.

I really wish iOS would get Android Intents.

I wouldn't be very surprised to see something like that in next version of iOS. Scrap that. I would be surprised not to see that in next version in iOS.

I would be very surprised. Apple has tried hard to have standard apps that are always standard apps. Intents give you choices for your standard apps which give you (even if minor) fragmentation. That is something people see differently and for me personally that sounds like hell. But to each his own and I'd even guess people with no technical knowledge might prefer not to be bothered by such choices.

I love Android intents and can't wait for webintents to take off but I can't see Apple embracing intents or something similar on iOS.

I'd say if Apple opens up that sort of customizability, it'll have strict requirements around the interface/behavior and, if those requirements change, 3rd party apps will have to change rapidly with them or be rejected from the Store. In other words, their control over the Store could allow them some flexibility to allow some customization in ways that avoid fragmentation.

I felt that way three years ago. At this point, I'm starting to think the omission is intentional.

Similarly with home-screen widgets. Though I think lock screen/notification center widgets might be incoming.

Every time I see this, I try to imagine what would happen if Microsoft forced IE to be the default browser in Windows. I'm guessing there would be quite an uproar.

You can get a Chrome like experience, as it uses a UIWebView under the hood, with limited features compared to the default Safari browser.

It is better than nothing, but still far from what we can call a browser choice.

But the browsers can't use their own rendering or Javascript engines. So all the browser vendors can work on is the user interface, not the core of the OS. It's a real shame Apple forbids it.

I switched to a galaxy note in February because there wasn't anything as compelling and new out from Apple at the time.

My previous iPhone 3gs managed to do a lot for me. The iPhone.4 didn't interest me at the time because of the antenna, and the 4s seemed underwhelming.

I realized then Apple was no longer pushing the envelope with what my smartphone could be, or do, and it was about maximizing product cycles.

On the other hand, Samsung had the gall to release a phone like the Galaxy Note. I didn't know if I'd like it, and it turned out I was burnt by having 3 year old gingerbread on it with no upgrade in sight, I realized whether or not I liked it, Samsung seemed to have assumed the role of being the cutting edge.

iOS is totally more optimized out of the box than Android to use. ICS has made large strides forward but it still requires me to spend time customizing my phone which I didn't, or couldn't.

Will the iPhone 5 win me back? if it came out last year I probably would have been writing this post on it right now.

The Note is about to get Jelly Bean if Engadget is to be believed.

And Jelly Bean really is a game changer. The difference between ICS and Jelly Bean is profound. The difference between the 2.x series and 4.1 is night and day, they aren't even comparable platforms.

It takes way too long for the official releases to come out for the phone. I was under the impression the Note was to be the flagship phone for Samsung, but it seems to be a 1b, with the S3 being the flagship. The S3 is a fine phone, if it had the stylus I'd be a very happy person with it.

- he worked for apple almost 25 years ago. - He spruiks his book for Google+

Im a big fan of Rules for Revolutionaries and Art of the Start was OK but since then I havent read anything that I have been impressed with.

Not sure how his start up portfolio has faired: http://www.garage.com/portfolio/

Guy Kawasaki prefers Android. So he uses an Android phone.

I'm looking forward to the follow-up: "Guy Kawasaki on why he gave up pizza because he was frankly more in the mood for a hamburger for lunch."

I'm happy that he found the mobile device that fits his needs, but otherwise I just really don't care. I prefer my iPhone. I have little opinion about what other mobile operating systems people use.

I don't expect journalistic excellence from Gizmodo, but is it too much to ask to have at least one other person just proofread the thing?

"How does this guy who got in on the ground floor of Apple only to turn on them years later?"

I'm pretty sure a 6th grader could spot the problem with that sentence.

This stalled me also, read it four or five times because I thought I was the one being retarded.

I don't mind spelling mistakes and poor grammar, as long as I can get the point of what the author is trying to say.

However half written sentences make me think you don't really know what you're talking about and I immediately begin to subtract credibility.

And to a lesser degree: "It was his job to shill the first Macintosh, and he did a pretty good job." "Job" twice is redundant. It's not a huge deal but it's just kind of lazy and sloppy.

My friend's aunt's milkman's neighbour once sweeped the floor for a few years at Microsoft in Redmond in the early nineties.

These days, he hates Windows Phone.

Microsoft is doomed.

He is without a doubt right about this part

"I think the size of [the Nexus 7] is perfect. I love the size. I think that 10.1-inches is just a little too big for me for reading. My test for a tablet is that if you fall asleep and the device hits your face, does it hurt you? The seven-inch doesn’t and the ten-inch does, so that’s my test!"

I am really suprised i have not broken my nose with my ipad yet.

I have hurt my nose before with a hardcover book. Clearly, those things should never be printed. That's supposed to be the reason to go for one or the other - nap-friendliness? People are becoming ridiculously spoiled.

I must have missed the part where he stated that 10" tablets should never get made.

I believe a more likely comparison would be why does Publisher A, who only prints hardcover, complain/mock/denounce the thought of Publisher B offering paperback as an option?

A short bullshit article about Apple on Gizmodo? I should have known better.

I'd like to know how many times he has been able to use NFC in the US. Does he seriously believe Apple can't throw in a little chip? There are other reasons they don't do this, mostly because of the inability to have much impact on how payments are performed at this time, and NFC hasn't changed things much. And they've had LTE on their latest ipad, just a matter of time before it was ready for the iPhone without destroying battery life.

The NFC chip might be small but the antenna is HUGE.

And it does not play nice with aluminium casing. It is basically mutually exclusive choice.

I use my NFC almost everyday. I use it to pay with my phone at those wireless credit card scanners.

Interesting and I am glad he is flexible about choosing his tools. BTW, I am fairly certain that Guy Kawasaki was the guy at Apple in 1984 who paid for a full page Scientific American advertisement for the little Mac application I wrote while at SAIC. I made sure that everyone in my management hierarchy saw the ad :-)

Guy Kawasaki, Evangelist by profession. Nuff said.

The tablet test sounds sensible.

I gave up on Guy Kawasaki when all he would ever talk about is AllTop without it ever being obvious why AllTop matters.

napierzaza, you were Hell-banned 247 days ago. I've no idea why.

> to find out about his new daily driver

Where's the part about his new daily driver?

It means the phone you "drive" (i.e. use) day to day. The term is borrowed from automobile culture, where an auto enthusiast might have several cars: a "daily driver" (a plain old ordinary car), a sports car, a show car, etc.

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